Jermaine Pennant wants Irish call up

[tricky_colour]

My feeling on this are.
1) He is hardly setting the world on fire although he a decent play, I can't really say I have paid much attention to him in the past
So I will have to keep an eye on him next time he play.

2) There is the point of "is he Irish enough", well technically he is, and that is all that is required.

3) Does he want to play for Ireland? Well apparently he does!! Which is nice to hear!!
I think this is a big plus point for him, even if he only want to to further his own career.

What I would say is contrast him with Stephen Ireland and he looks very good in that respect.

Finally I would say he would struggle to get a place in the team because we have too many other options.
He went to Stoke for £1.7 million, we have a number of players in his position who are worth more than that.

I hope the people who are saying he should not play are not the same people who have said they
they would gladly take Stephen Ireland back because if they are they are being a bit hypocritical IMO.

[geysir]

That's fair enough, but the point is would that be enough to pass this new Stutts gut test, if it had been applicable at the time? I'm not trying to make it about individual past players - it's just the same standard isn't being applied to Pennant imo now he says he's interested in representing "the republic".

There is no comparison with Ray or Owen Coyle for that matter, both of them grew up in 'little Donegal' in the Gorbals. There was no dilemma for either of them, it was a natural decision to declare for Ireland. Being Irish was already a part of their upbringing.

There is something about Jermaine that does not resonate with the Irish fans. There is no science to that, so perhaps Stutts' gut test has some rational validity.
Apart from ability, very few question Paul Green about his motives or connections. Fans can accept a player at honest face value.
It's not appreciated when a player dallies for a long time or discusses publicly about whether to declare or not. That alone demeans the honour.

[cestlavie]

And Owen Coyle's mother is from Donegal and still goes to the games, so no comparison witha buck like Pennant.

[Junior]

There is no comparison with Ray or Owen Coyle for that matter, both of them grew up in 'little Donegal' in the Gorbals. There was no dilemma for either of them, it was a natural decision to declare for Ireland. Being Irish was already a part of their upbringing.

There is something about Jermaine that does not resonate with the Irish fans. There is no science to that, so perhaps Stutts' gut test has some rational validity.
Apart from ability, very few question Paul Green about his motives or connections. Fans can accept a player at honest face value.
It's not appreciated when a player dallies for a long time or discusses publicly about whether to declare or not. That alone demeans the honour.

Spot on.

[Wolfie]

There is no comparison with Ray or Owen Coyle for that matter, both of them grew up in 'little Donegal' in the Gorbals. There was no dilemma for either of them, it was a natural decision to declare for Ireland. Being Irish was already a part of their upbringing.

There is something about Jermaine that does not resonate with the Irish fans. There is no science to that, so perhaps Stutts' gut test has some rational validity.
Apart from ability, very few question Paul Green about his motives or connections. Fans can accept a player at honest face value.
It's not appreciated when a player dallies for a long time or discusses publicly about whether to declare or not. That alone demeans the honour.

Yep - for a long time it was simply announced that "x" player had declared for us. Players tended to make their decision quickly and it was then reported by the media.

All of this "weighing up of options" approach most certainly demeans the honour and is a bit of an insult.

[Macy]

There is no comparison with Ray or Owen Coyle for that matter, both of them grew up in 'little Donegal' in the Gorbals. There was no dilemma for either of them, it was a natural decision to declare for Ireland. Being Irish was already a part of their upbringing.

They both would've played for Scotland, if they'd been called up first, and both knew it wasn't going to happen by the time they were asked by Ireland. That fails my gut test tbh.

[SwanVsDalton]

Yep - for a long time it was simply announced that "x" player had declared for us. Players tended to make their decision quickly and it was then reported by the media.

All of this "weighing up of options" approach most certainly demeans the honour and is a bit of an insult.

Not a Pennant advocate but that might be slightly related to oversaturated contemporary sports coverage. I'm not convinced the likes of Aldridge, Townsend et al made their decision quickly, there likely was indecision, but it went unreported because they wern't asked about declaring ten times a day.

Crucial difference between them and Pennant is they had the good sense to keep schtum while he hmm's and haa's in public.

[EastTerracer]

They both would've played for Scotland, if they'd been called up first, and both knew it wasn't going to happen by the time they were asked by Ireland. That fails my gut test tbh.

I think you need to do a bit more research Macy. While Coyle wasn't capped until 1994 it wasn't the case that he jumped on the bandwagon as he got older (and with the World Cup around the corner). Coyle had declared for us several years before and came on as sub in the famous 4-1 B-International win over England in 1990 (when he was still with Clydebank). I think he got U-21 caps as well. This was definitely not a case of a 27 year old playing with Bolton who suddenly saw a short-term opportunity to get to a world cup (Bernie Slaven might have been a more convincing example!). Both of Coyle's parents are from Donegal and he was brought up in a very Irish household (Finn Harps are his LoI team if you need any convincing).

[geysir]

They both would've played for Scotland, if they'd been called up first, and both knew it wasn't going to happen by the time they were asked by Ireland. That fails my gut test tbh.

Well, your gut test does meet objective standards.
It is public knowledge that Owen selected Ireland over Scotland. He had 2 invitations on his kitchen table inviting him to join the respective u21 squads of both Ireland and Scotland. Owen has said that it was a no brainer for him to chose Ireland and in the knowledge that the squad he was being called up into was for a game against Scotland. He received his first cap against Scotland. He is also a proud Scot.

Ray had not been selected by Scotland and he has publicly admitted he wanted to play for Scotland. That's undisputed. Ray was an uncapped dual national by the time Charlton invited him to declare and this he did so without the slightest hesitation, even though he was still young for a midfielder (age 24), just in his 1st season in the 1st Div and still had a good chance that he would eventually come under serious scrutiny for a Scottish intl call up.
That survives my gut test.

[geysir]

Just to add that Ray was rejected by Scotland for their underage team.
It is presumptuous to think that Ray would not have accepted an invitation to declare for Ireland when he was 17 years old or at any time up to the age when he did declare.
James McCarthy has said more or less that Ireland called him, Scotland didn't.
Read into that what you may, but I suspect that James was fed up with the constant barrage of questions and negativity around his decision to declare for Ireland, that he repeats the line 'Scotland didn't call me'. Even to this day, Ray gets questioned by Scots about his decision to declare for Ireland over Scotland, the simple retort is 'Scotland didn't call me', 'Scotland ignored me'.
Owen Coyle is also still questioned about his 'Scottishness' and he answers that he is a proud Scot. He doesn't mention that he still turns out for ireland to play with the "seniors". Yet there are people who cynically pick over every little line uttered and say that Owen is conveniently playing the Scotland card.
It should be a bit obvious that Scotland is different, that forms of social bigotry are well entrenched and that some footballers chose to present a diplomatic front and wish to deflect some of the begrudgery. McGeady on the other hand, took the barrage of bigotry full on.

[sean r]

where is 'Aye-land'.???

[danonion]

I cannot agree with anyone that suggests that he would not get a place in our team. While I am not at all suggesting that he would be one of our first choice widemen, we do have an injury prone lot, and it seems rare when we have Hunt, McGeady and Duff fit all at the same time.

In my opinion I think he is probably a better footballer than Liam Lawrence, while his attitude and actions in the past disgust most of us, he is a good right-sided player who hugs the touchline and puts in good balls, and is more responsible on the back-foot than you'd expect.

Having said all that, he doesn't really pass my 'gut' test either; I would accept him if called up to the squad and he turned up and played, but I would prefer if that did not happen.

[Stuttgart88]

I think he's a decent player actually, pacy and a traditional winger. He'sa wrong 'un though, a real trouble maker so I've never warmed to him.

That has nothing to do with my gut instinct on this one though. This one just doesn't feel right. It's hard to articulate.

[tetsujin1979]

put it this way, I'd rank Pennant getting a call up as slightly more acceptable than if Joey Barton suddenly discovered an Irish grandparent. Talent and ability aside, I just don't like him.

[TrapAPony]

Was very good today for Stoke. Interesting to read some comments from the Stoke fans about him :

''was superb again''
''Very lively in the first half and early second half. He's consistantly good''
''was superb, we looked lost when he went off''
''Constant threat and some very good crossing, he's got to score at some point''
''We look great with him & **** without him''


http://oatcakefanzine.proboards.com/...&thread=153676

..and seems to be the fans MOM today with Walters.
http://www.stokecity-mad.co.uk/interactive/loadpoll.asp

[Charlie Darwin]

Whelan getting really good reviews too from the sound of it. Would be handy to have him play a few games in the run-up to Macedonia.

[fruice]

Lads i cant understand why some of ye have the hump about pennant playing for us. ok maybe we are his second choice but im sure this was the case with alot of the english born lads. its not like we are blessed with players falling on our door step. in my view take what we can get you never know when we might need him.

[geysir]

That's very pessimistic. Can our future be so bleak?

[fruice]

i wouldnt agree its realistic a fella with plenty of expierence doesnt fall out of the sky every day.

[purplemonkeydis]

definite starter if trapatoni would let him play that is,he could form a midfield with andy reid maybe. :P he would supply serious threat to fullbacks