Eligibility Rules, Okay

[ArdeeBhoy]

Agree or enforce what, exactly?

Any arbitrary age figure one chooses to pick from the air...

Of course, the IFA have the "freedom of choice" to select who they wish to represent them at international level - within the framework of FIFA eligibility rules. There is no compulsion upon them to select players with ambitions of representing another Association at Senior International level.

Except I was talking about the players...

[gastric]

Thank you French Toasht. I am glad someone else finds this term objectionable. In fact, I see red when it is used and this is why I have felt compelled to mention historical facts that NB seems to gloss over. I am also livid over the treatment that the most educated man on the planet on this issue, Danny, has received in attempting to debate this issue. Threats, false truths and exclusion have pushed me over the edge.
The word idiotic has been used against my last post. I stand by it. This whole episode has galvanised my belief that there is no possible way to move this issue forward when you are dealing with individuals who have their heads in the sand. I also feel there is something sinister about characters who claim they have evidence of the FAI recruiting players. Enough talk, produce the evidence and I will happily eat humble pie.

It also angers me that on this thread in to be part of this debate, you end talking in terms of Catholic, Protestant, Nationalist and Unionist. This is not part of the world I live in and to end up using such antiquated terms I find appalling. I have mentioned before that the positive discrimination that now exists in the IFA in relation to Catholics is superficial and does not in anyway deal with the real issue, the alienation of Catholics that the IFA has failed to tackle over the years.

Finally, why are we attempting to solve an issue which was ratified by CAS after it was appealed by the IFA? Players can play for us when they want and should not be subject to any conditions to placate individuals or organisations.

[ArdeeBhoy]

Amen to that...

[Not Brazil]

When I was 12 and 13, I only had two interests in life, playing sport and girls. It was with age that I figured out who I was, what my identity was and what culture was representative of me. To force a kid make a decision on such an arbitrary question at such a young age is wrong, whatever way you look at it.

I think it's fair and reasonable to ask an 18 year old what his international career desires are.

[French Toasht]

Finally, why are we attempting to solve an issue which was ratified by CAS after it was appealed by the IFA? Players can play for us when they want and should not be subject to any conditions to placate individuals or organisations.

Exactly. It always amazes me that the CAS decision on Daniel Kearns is 27 pages long yet this thread is 140 pages in length. The CAS decision deals with the issue on eligibility in a succinct and straight forward manner, yet somehow the IFA and their fans seem unable to comprehend what the sport's governing body and the justice system have laid out in simple terms.

Ireland have qualified for the Euros in Poland in the summer, yet somehow on these boards the most debated topic is on a settled issue. As far as my interest in other international teams go, it extends no further than Spain, Italy and Croatia and whoever else we might my play in our upcoming Euro 2012/ WC 2014 campaign. The IFA and their team are about as relevant to me as Turkmenistan or Malawi.

[Not Brazil]

this is why I have felt compelled to mention historical facts that NB seems to gloss over. I am dealing with individuals who have their heads in the sand.

Finally, why are we attempting to solve an issue which was ratified by CAS after it was appealed by the IFA? Players can play for us when they want and should not be subject to any conditions to placate individuals or organisations.

If you want to play "historical facts", no problem.

Perhaps this is not the appropriate forum for such discussion?

The eligibility issue has been decided.

What remains is for the IFA to develop a strategy that ensures, as far as possible, that their resources are used to develop young players who have a desire to represent Northern Ireland throughout their International career.

[Not Brazil]

It also angers me that on this thread in to be part of this debate, you end talking in terms of Catholic, Protestant, Nationalist and Unionist. This is not part of the world I live in and to end up using such antiquated terms I find appalling. I have mentioned before that the positive discrimination that now exists in the IFA in relation to Catholics is superficial
and does not in anyway deal with the real issue, the alienation of Catholics that the IFA has failed to tackle over the
years.

But you just can't help yourself anyway.

Dear God.

Idiotic is about right.

[gastric]

Idiotic is to think that somehow you can change a legal decision that has been already made. CAS has deemed that all players in NI can play for us and it is not age related. Your theories are pie in the sky and retorting to insults does not in anyway surprise me. All I regret is that I reacted to your last insult. I suggest you accept reality and the self-inflicted demise of your so called national team.

[Not Brazil]

Idiotic is to think that somehow you can change a legal decision that has been already made. CAS has deemed that all players in NI can play for us and it is not age related. Your theories are pie in the sky and retorting to insults does not in anyway surprise me. All I regret is that I reacted to your last insult.

I do not seek to change the CAS ruling.

Insults?

Look up the thread at your childish outburst.

[dantheman]

If you want to play "historical facts", no problem.

Perhaps this is not the appropriate forum for such discussion?

The eligibility issue has been decided.

What remains is for the IFA to develop a strategy that ensures, as far as possible, that their resources are used to develop young players who have a desire to represent Northern Ireland throughout their International career.

This is absolutely true, however its also applies in reverse. The FAI must also adopt a similar policy, which included training camps in Northern Ireland (by proxy would be better).

There has been a long, boring and tiring campaign by OWC fans to portray the actions of the FAI as sectarian. To remove this slur completely some of these camps should be in loyalist areas of the north.

[gastric]

I do not seek to change the CAS ruling.

Insults?

Look up the thread at your childish outburst.

So, wanting 18/19 year olds to make a decision about their future is not wanting to change the CAS ruling? Presently, a player of any age can play for Ireland. How can you suggest this is not trying to change the CAS Agreement? By the way, your constant insults are beginning to show the reality of the situation is getting to you.

[ArdeeBhoy]

I think it's fair and reasonable to ask an 18 year old what his international career desires are.

Why?

In any other walk of Life people have relative freedom to choose.
Until they get a full competitive cap it's up to them. Even FIFA agree.
End of.

[punkrocket]

This is absolutely true, however its also applies in reverse. The FAI must also adopt a similar policy, which included training camps in Northern Ireland (by proxy would be better).

There has been a long, boring and tiring campaign by OWC fans to portray the actions of the FAI as sectarian. To remove this slur completely some of these camps should be in loyalist areas of the north.

I'd also like to see an equitable portion of the costs of such camps covered by the Ni taxpayer.

[The Fly]

Thank you French Toasht. I am glad someone else finds this term objectionable. In fact, I see red when it is used and this is why I have felt compelled to mention historical facts that NB seems to gloss over. I am also livid over the treatment that the most educated man on the planet on this issue, Danny, has received in attempting to debate this issue. Threats, false truths and exclusion have pushed me over the edge.

Relax - you'll give yourself an ulcer.

The word idiotic has been used against my last post. I stand by it.

Referencing the Ulster Plantation and protestant land-grabbing, as some sort of stick to beat another member with, was idiotic.

This whole episode has galvanised my belief that there is no possible way to move this issue forward when you are dealing with individuals who have their heads in the sand.

Indeed.

I also feel there is something sinister about characters who claim they have evidence of the FAI recruiting players. Enough talk, produce the evidence and I will happily eat humble pie.

I believe this to be another distraction. I couldn't care less whether IFA officials or NI supporters representatives claim to have evidence of FAI involvement in the recruitment of NI based players. So what if they do? The FAI is only looking after their own interests.

It also angers me that on this thread in to be part of this debate, you end talking in terms of Catholic, Protestant, Nationalist and Unionist. This is not part of the world I live in and to end up using such antiquated terms I find appalling.

Welcome to NI.

Though if you find such terms appalling, why did you reference events some 400 years ago in the context of a player eligibility thread?

I have mentioned before that the positive discrimination that now exists in the IFA in relation to Catholics is superficial and does not in anyway deal with the real issue, the alienation of Catholics that the IFA has failed to tackle over the years.

Correct.

Finally, why are we attempting to solve an issue which was ratified by CAS after it was appealed by the IFA? Players can play for us when they want and should not be subject to any conditions to placate individuals or organisations.

It's inevitable that this thread continues to thrive as more and more NI based players come on board the ROI train. NB and GR, probably the most notable contributors from the Norn Iron perspective, are merely suggesting ways in which the IFA can move forward on the issue whilst protecting their own interests. The only annoyance that I share with them is this kind of 'have you cake and eat it' attitude that some on our own side of the debate seem to advocate.

I firmly believe that the now....err....so-called.....ahem.....'Fly declaration' , is the most sensible solution all round.

[The Fly]

Idiotic is to think that somehow you can change a legal decision that has been already made. CAS has deemed that all players in NI can play for us and it is not age related.

He is not seeking to change or overturn the CAS's decision.

Your theories are pie in the sky and retorting to insults does not in anyway surprise me.

.........Opps!!

All I regret is that I reacted to your last insult. I suggest you accept reality and the self-inflicted demise of your so called national team.

He didn't issue any insults. You're misrepresenting him.

This isn't OWC you know.

[The Fly]

This is absolutely true, however its also applies in reverse. The FAI must also adopt a similar policy, which included training camps in Northern Ireland (by proxy would be better).

There has been a long, boring and tiring campaign by OWC fans to portray the actions of the FAI as sectarian. To remove this slur completely some of these camps should be in loyalist areas of the north.

Are you taking the ****?

The suggestion that the FAI should establish training camps in Northern Ireland is contentious to say the least, but the notion that they should be held in Loyalist areas is just insane.

[geysir]

I firmly believe that the now....err....so-called.....ahem.....'Fly declaration' , is the most sensible solution all round.

Just what the board needs, yet another opinionated Nordie who is of the firm opinion that he has the 'most sensible solution'.

[The Fly]

Just what the board needs, yet another opinionated Nordie who is of the firm opinion that he has the 'most sensible solution'.

Without it it would just be Southerners spouting hot air.

[DannyInvincible]

I couldn't care less whether IFA officials or NI supporters representatives claim to have evidence of FAI involvement in the recruitment of NI based players. So what if they do? The FAI is only looking after their own interests.

No disagreement there. It's the allegations that players have been intimidated and maybe even threatened by "elements" into playing for the FAI/out of playing for the IFA that I find a bit distasteful. Unless they are true, of course, but, in the absence of even the slightest figment of evidence, I suspect such accusations to be based in exaggerated and far-fetched fantasy.

[Predator]

The only annoyance that I share with them is this kind of 'have you cake and eat it' attitude that some on our own side of the debate seem to advocate.

What exactly is this 'have your cake and eat it' attitude that annoys you?