Eligibility Rules, Okay

[Not Brazil]

NB; I think you mentioned a few pages back that Derry City were still members of the IFA. Is this true?

It is.

[Not Brazil]

Read it mainly as a rant mainly about those people, mainly clowns, who claim to be 'both' British & Irish*.

I suspect the irony of your assertion is lost on you in the context of a discussion about eligibility for both international sides on the island of Ireland.

[Not Brazil]

Just another thing on the role of Gerry "EPN" Armstrong, presumably you inherently disagree with the IFA even setting up such a position, NB, because if players are having second thoughts about playing for NI, then they shouldn't be considered at all? Or am I picking you up incorrectly?

I have serious misgivings about aspects of the role Armstrong seems to be involved in eg, "It's time me and James McClean had a chat".

No, it's not Gerry - the chatting should have been done long ago.

I'm for weeding players out of the IFA system, who have designs on playing for the South. Players with ambitions to develop and progress into the Northern Ireland senior squad should form the cornerstone of our underage setup. In other words, players whose childhood dream is to represent Northern Ireland.

I've no issues at all with players from Northern Ireland who wish to play for the South doing so - I believe such players should make those intentions known to the FAI at the earliest available opportunity ie. before representing Northern Ireland at Under 19 level, or above.

For those who continue to fence sit - their bluff should be called asap. ie. the IFA should help them make their mind up.

McClean's moment of truth has been and gone.

[Not Brazil]

I presume NB is also "uneasy" with Lee Camp representing NI. Lee Camp was always aware of his eligibility for NI but chose England and had relative success with England at underage level.

No - not uneasy at all about Camp.

Lee Camp is English born and bred - it seems natural to me that his first love would be England.

The difference between Camp and Bruce is obvious - one publicly turned down a call to represent Northern Ireland in extremely patronising/disparaging terms, the other didn't.

[Not Brazil]

Lee Camp, Johnny Gorman, Alex Bruce, Caolan Lavery,Oliver Norwood, Joe Dudgeon, Callum Morris etc...... all had time invested in them by the FAI, English FA & Canadian FA - I don't see the same 'poor wee us' attitude emanating from those associations.

Have any of the above players ever intimated that it was their childhood dream to represent Northern Ireland?

[Not Brazil]

In Northern Ireland it's the same thing. Lets not kid ourselves here. We live in a backwater where your political ideaoligy is confirmed the day you are born. The only Catholics I've ever seen really embracing their Norn Irishness is Rory McIlroy and Gerry Armstrong. Though even Rory doesn't come out for the football team.

It is not the "same thing".

Plenty of "Catholics" see themselves as Northern Irish primarily.

http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2010/Commu...s/NINATID.html

Many "Catholics" see themselves as more than "Irish only".

Many "Catholics" and "Protestants" do not identify themselves as either Nationalist or Unionist.

http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2010/Polit.../UNINATID.html

Rory does "come out" for the Northern Ireland team - check out the recent BBC documentary on him, following his US Open triumph.

I would refer you to the thread in "Current Affairs" concerning Identity.

[Not Brazil]

This mythical (P) meaning what exactly...

Because he had no other choice at the time....

That they'd given up GAA?? Shouldn't you all be supporting Aontroma....

1. Erm, "Provisional".

2. Why do you say Sammy Clinghan did not have a choice at the time???

3. Glad you raised that about Aontroma - despite the County having a "Unionist majority", I'm unaware of anyone from the "Unionist community" having represented Aontroma at senior level, in either football or hurling, in the past 80 years. Seems to be an exclusively nationalist/republican thing to me.

Besides - the County HQ is situated in a staunchly Republican area - perhaps the Aontroma County Board should consider moving from Casement to a more "cross community" venue - that way they might attract more support from the "Unionist community" of County Aontoma?

Perhaps there are anomolies with nationalist/republican gripes about the Northern Ireland set up?

[Predator]

No - not uneasy at all about Camp.

But Camp is denying a young Northern Irishman, whose dream it is to play for Northern Ireland, the chance to realise that dream, don't you understand? He's taking up a space despite it not being his dream!

[DannyInvincible]

I'm for weeding players out of the IFA system, who have designs on playing for the South. Players with ambitions to develop and progress into the Northern Ireland senior squad should form the cornerstone of our underage setup. In other words, players whose childhood dream is to represent Northern Ireland.

That's not Armstrong's role though, is it? In fact, Armstrong's role is to do the exact opposite of weeding out players; his role is to attempt to convince players who might have designs on playing for the FAI to stick with the IFA. Essentially, his job is to prolong for as long as possible or to make permanent what you see as a pretence.

[Not Brazil]

But Camp is denying a young Northern Irishman, whose dream it is to play for Northern Ireland, the chance to realise that dream, don't you understand? He's taking up a space despite it not being his dream!

Has Camp ever represented Northern Ireland, at any level, whilst harbouring ongoing aspirations of playing for England?

If we have any such players in our underage set-up, they need to be weeded out.

[Predator]

Has Camp ever represented Northern Ireland, at any level, whilst harbouring ongoing aspirations of playing for England?

If we have any such players in our underage set-up, they need to be weeded out.

You've dodged the point. Camp is currently occupying a space that you feel should be reserved for players who have dreamt of playing for Northern Ireland.

[Not Brazil]

That's not Armstrong's role though, is it? In fact, Armstrong's role is to do the exact opposite of weeding out players; his role is to attempt to convince players who might have designs on playing for the FAI to stick with the IFA. Essentially, his job is to prolong for as long as possible or to make permanent what you see as a pretence.

Yes, that is Armstrong's remit.

That is why I'm not overly enthusiatic about his role. - I certainly don't think he should be bothering players who have made their intentions clear.

I notice in his column today in the Sunday Life, that Gerry is questioning why players such as Duffy and McClean didn't switch earlier. It's a very good question. It also sends a message to fence sitters ie. get off the fence, one way or another.

[ArdeeBhoy]

If we have any such players in our underage set-up, they need to be weeded out.

That's as nonsensical a sentence as I've ever read on here...
What are they going to do? Use a polygraph??

[Not Brazil]

You've dodged the point. Camp is currently occupying a space that you feel should be reserved for players who have dreamt of playing for Northern Ireland.

Let me be clearer for you - any player born in Northern Ireland harbouring ongoing ambitions of representing the South, should be weeded out of our system at the earliest possible convenience. Perhaps Gerry could play a role in this process?

Ditto, any English born player currently in our underage setup who has ongoing ambitions of representing England at senior international level should be weeded out.

[Not Brazil]

What are they going to do? Use a polygraph??

No - but maybe play smarter than they do at present.

[Predator]

I notice in his column today in the Sunday Life, that Gerry is questioning why players such as Duffy and McClean didn't switch earlier. It's a very good question. It also sends a message to fence sitters ie. get off the fence, one way or another.

The reason Duffy did not switch earlier is because he was effectively harangued into staying and then offered carrot-caps as a reward. Worthington even got David Moyes ("his ma's from Coleraine you know") in on the act at one stage and on Moyes' advice Duffy ended up staying a little longer. McClean is a different kettle of fish.

Anyway, these players can opt out whenever they want, as is their right.

[Predator]

Let me be clearer for you - any player born in Northern Ireland harbouring ongoing ambitions of representing the South, should be weeded out of our system at the earliest possible convenience. Perhaps Gerry could play a role in this process?

Ditto, any English born player currently in our underage setup who has ongoing ambitions of representing England at senior international level should be weeded out.

Let me be crystal clear for you: Camp is denying a player who has dreamt of playing for NI a place. For consistency's sake, you should be weeding him out too, you know, for the moral of it all, and all, like.

[ArdeeBhoy]

I suspect the irony of your assertion is lost on you in the context of a discussion about eligibility for both international sides on the island of Ireland.

Except was replying to our correspondent from Loch Garman, which is relevant to this debate, whether you like it or not.

Have any of the above players ever intimated that it was their childhood dream to represent Northern Ireland?

Has anyone, ever??

1."Provisional".

So you are 'implying' McClean and every SF voter supports/supported the 'PIRA' ???
Hmm, not even the likes of Paisley and the other nuts would make such an assertion...

2. Why do you say Sammy Clinghan did not have a choice at the time???

See previous replies to various posts passim.
Most of which you chose to ignore.

3. Glad you raised that about Aontroma - despite the County having a "Unionist majority", I'm unaware of anyone from the "Unionist community" having represented Aontroma at senior level, in either football or hurling, in the past 80 years. Seems to be an exclusively nationalist/republican thing to me.

Presumably you're excluding members of the RUC who previously participated?
Even if it is 'exclusively nationalist', which it isn't, so what?

Besides - the County HQ is situated in a staunchly Republican area - perhaps the Aontroma County Board should consider moving from Casement to a more "cross community" venue - that way they might attract more support from the "Unionist community" of County Aontoma?

Irony alert. Presumably you haven't noticed the location of your own home ground and attendant local colour scheme??

Perhaps there are anomolies with nationalist/republican gripes about the Northern Ireland set up?

What, if anything, is this saying??

[ArdeeBhoy]

You've dodged the point. Camp is currently occupying a space that you feel should be reserved for players who have dreamt of playing for Northern Ireland.

Sure, when did the IFA and their apologists ever worry about Hypocrisy...

[Not Brazil]

The reason Duffy did not switch earlier is because he was effectively harangued into staying and then offered carrot-caps as a reward. Worthington even got David Moyes ("his ma's from Coleraine you know") in on the act at one stage and on Moyes' advice Duffy ended up staying a little longer. McClean is a different kettle of fish.

Anyway, these players can opt out whenever they want, as is their right.

According to Bluffy's da, Shane "loved" playing for Northern Ireland - and Worthington is a "top man".

At least he was flushed out in the end. Ditto McClean.