Ward plays left back most weeks in the Premiership but is constantly omitted. Kilbane is playing central midfield for Huddersfield in League 1. Green was an unused sub for Derby at the weekend. Even the likes of Wes Hoolahan who plays week in week out for Norwich would have been a better bet. Too much deadwood in the squad IMO.Originally Posted by irishfan86
Last edited by TrapAPony; 24/01/2011 at 2:56 PM.
"We lost because we didn't win"- Ronaldo
Honestly lads, but Trap is playing with fire by not including McCarthy. I understand the lad is coming back from a long injury and has not even kicked a ball for Wigan, even though he was on the bench on Saturday. And I also understand that Roberto Martinez may not even want him to travel over for the game given his rehabilitation status. But it would have been a nice gesture to include him all the same. He should have been in there ahead of Green and Whelan.
Which leaves us now with a situation where he won't have been tried before the Macedonia game. Do you think Trap will, all of a sudden, decided to pick him for that game just because he has recovered his fitness?
Trap should have taken the gamble. If the boy doesn't see his name in the squad then what will that tell him?
here we go again.
Why do i even bother getting myself excited over the announcement of Irish squads anymore?
As others have already asked, how in the flamin heck are McShame, Kilbane and Green in this squad ahead of Ward and McCarthy for starters. It is sofa king frustrating.
I really despise Trap and his scouting and selection policies. There, ive said it.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
Chill out. McCarthy was in the squad for Norway and pulled out through injury, the same injury which keeps him, just, out of this squad. He'll get involved soon enough.
As for Ward, he probably deserves a run but it's by no means a slam dunk since his most eye-catching performances were in advanced roles and Elokobi displaced him for a spell (Ward's been back in because of Elokobi's suspension). We might be desperate but he's not making a cast-iron case. And those who have - Clark and Coleman, Stokes - are getting their reward.
It's not a bad squad. In fairness, including seven strikers for one game indicates Trap is really making it a priority to give all the strikers a go before the qualifiers. A bit less conservative.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
Ward's not made a convincing case, McCarthy's just back from injury. Get over it.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
we will not qualify for the Euros. Get over it.
Seriously, so we have a difference of opinion on a manager (shock, horror) - no need to be so arrogantly dismissive.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
Maybe if you tone down your comments - i.e. despising of Trapattoni, you wouldn't be getting comments that you perceive as arrogantly dismissive.
Calm down. Your comment on a LB who isn't a convincing LB and an injured midfielder not making the squad is histrionically over the top imo and hardly indicative of despicable 'scouting and selection' policies. Especially since those who have made a great case - Clark, Coleman, Stokes - are all included.
Still my response was equally OTT, so I apologise and replace 'get over it' with 'take a deep breath.'
But in terms of 'here we go again', can we ever engage in a squad announcement (not least one for a friendly) without some marginal call resulting in 'won't someone think of the children?!' style reactions? Lively debate's one thing but it's getting a bit self-parodic imo.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
Has O'Dea??
Trapp has a history of baffling decisions when it comes to omissions and inclusions. I think McCarthy's omission is a valid concern.
Last edited by dr_peepee; 24/01/2011 at 4:20 PM.
I guess i share the general sentiments in this thread.
Disappointing to see McShane, Kilbane(no probs with him being there as a sub, but not as a starter, as has been noted he's not even playing LB anymore) and co. still knocking around but at least Clark and Wilson are in, hopefully he doesn't just stick out his usual 11 now(Kilbane, Green, Whelan etc) and gives the new lads a proper run.
There's the right way, the wrong way.... and the Max Power way!! :-D
To be sure I'm not saying the squad is perfect, we're all going to have people in or out. But, in my mind, the squad has progressively included the fit, untested players it should have.
In the case of O'Dea, he - like McShane and Green - are, for better or worse, in possession of a squad berth. It's up to other players to displace them, a task that shouldn't be that difficult. But, for me only a fit McCarthy and Meyler have made a case to do that.
I don't really fancy O'Dea but he's a CB, who can fill in at LB, and those are his natural positions. Ward isn't a centre back and, imo, isn't a particularly good LB, albeit one who gets a run out in the Prem. However poorly stocked we are at LB simply turning out in the Premiership isn't a reason for inclusion.
Who would you have instead of O'Dea? Personally I'd have chosen Bruce (hardly a major upgrade) but he's in decent form for a good team. Or, throwing caution to the wind, Stephen O'Halloran - get him on the training ground to have a look since he could be the best bet long term.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
im perfectly calm SvD. In fact i am more bemused at this stage. Trappatoni's squad since day one have led me to this state of mind as i realise the futility of getting angry about it. There is also an element of futility in voicing my frustrations on this forum, which you have confirmed for me. How dare we question Il Duce or how dare we hope that the players that we rate get picked ahead of the players he rates which has always been based on a questionable selection/scouting policy.
My reference to "here we go again" was an exasperated reference to my own repetitive criticisms of Trappatonis squads and selection.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
Agreed. I don't really mind the squad, it's got enough new faces in it where I will take great issue if he doesn't play them. Coleman, Clark and Wilson should all get good game time.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
Has Green? Has McShane? Has Keogh? Has Treacy? - all are subs for Championship teams and Kilbane is plying his trade in lowly League one. Might as well call up Lanre Oyebanjo.
Last edited by TrapAPony; 24/01/2011 at 4:43 PM.
"We lost because we didn't win"- Ronaldo
At a glance, the notable omissions are Ward and McCarthy right? I think it's now abundantly clear that Trap doesn't rate Ward at all. I thought Cunningham's absence may have opened the door but that possibility can be written off. Another manager may have included McCarthy in anticipation of him getting some games between now and the game. I'm glad I didn't get my hopes up about his inclusion. The usual deadweight suspects making up the numbers. I don't fancy McShane, Green or O'Dea at all at this stage. Is the former even getting a game at Hull? Looking forward to seeing Coleman and Clark. In the starting lineup, please.
I agree. Not too upset about the squad but this game is a glorified friendly and should be used accordingly with those names firmly in mind. Green and Kilbane starting would be very disheartening.
Ward is a LB and plays week in week out for a PL team and doesn't get called up? It's a huge problem area for us. The only person in that squad who I'd be comfortable playing there is O'Shea * correction - Clark can also play there and has done well in the games he has featured for Villa this season.
McCarthy is coming back from injury but I think it would be worthwhile if he was invited to attend the training sessions.
Will he play Coleman, Wilson and Westwood? These guys need the experience. I just fear he is going to play his so called strongest team (in his head) and we'll learn nothing.
Last edited by shakermaker1982; 24/01/2011 at 4:45 PM.
"If God had meant football to be played in the air, he'd have put grass in the sky." Brian Clough.
You'll NEVER beat the Irish.......you'll just draw with us instead!!!
Forgot to put my team down (based on that squad selection)
Westwood
Foley Dunne Clark O'Shea
Coleman Wilson Fahey Duff
Long Doyle
Mixture of youth and experience.
"If God had meant football to be played in the air, he'd have put grass in the sky." Brian Clough.
You'll NEVER beat the Irish.......you'll just draw with us instead!!!
Come on. There's a broad spectrum of thought on here and my comment was in response to provocatively worded post from yourself. The oft quoted, simplistic view that this forum is fervently pro-Trap doesn't stack up.
There's plenty of debate, questioning of Trap etc. But the stronger the view, the stronger the rebuttal - a questionable selection policy is very much different from a despicable one.
And vice versa - if I was to say 'I don't just support Trap's selection policy, I think his selection of Paul Green is the single most masterful piece of managerial selection since Steve Stauntion and Alan O'Brien', I'd never be allowed to post on here again. Rightly so too.
Anyway tone or justification aside, we'll just debate the points from here on in. Agreeable?
Genuinely, can someone pro-Ward tell me why he should be in? Essentially I don't think his presence in the Prem is reason enough, even with Kilbane in League One. And he hasn't been playing week in week out at LB for a couple of months....
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
Trap- on TV3 news a few mins ago.
Said McCarthy was left out because he is just back and that he will continue to 'follow' him and he will get his opportunity in the next game - or something to that effect.
Also hinted that Clarke will get the nod at LB!
http://www.tv3.ie/sport.php
SvD:
You championed the case of O'Dea based on his ability to play 2 positions (neither particularly well imo). Ward has played at LB, LW and striker in his premiership and championship career. Kilbane is no longer playing premiership, no longer playing championship and no longer playing LB. Can you explain to me what rationale is employed as to why he should be in the squad for a friendly ahead of Stephen Ward who, while not the best LB in the premiership, is of acceptable/passable quality in that position and is also the most versatile Irish player in the Premiership.
I find Traps selection policy, which we are paying a truckload for, to be despicable at worst or lazy at best. His modus operandi is conservative selection, conservative tactics and primitive style aimed at achieving short term success. Only the problem is it hasnt achieved any success unless you count moral victories in the form of 3 draw and a loss to two terrible, if once great, teams. And i dont think that the success element will have changed come the end of this campaign. If that proves to be the case then he needs to go.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
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