The "Bailout" That Is In Actual Fact A High-Interest Loan, Not Free Money.

**bennocelt** · 17/11/2010, 7:00 AM

Also should see the press here as well. A lot of jokes going on about Ireland and its rightful place in the world at the moment. The likes of Richard Littlejohn are creaming their pants at the moment
Its our own fault though

**shakermaker1982** · 17/11/2010, 7:29 AM

Originally Posted by Spudulika

Anybody see Newsnight tonight? I was stunned by the growing anti-Irish sentiment that has been building all day. Even when broadcasting outside the Queens gaff they were getting digs in on UTV, BBC etc. When the BBC journo shouted out after Lenihan "When will you end this chaos?" it looked like a cringeworthy paper thin imitation of Michael Moore. At least Michael Moore was being held back, Lenihan gave interviews to BBC, ITV, RTE etc just 3 metres away, yet the Newsnight crew wanted to make it a nasty slap at the man. The Chancellor claimed the UK need a strong Ireland for exports, that it's important to keep us alive, BBC are looking to stir the siht.

If you think the British media are being harsh then check out the German papers!

What do you expect though? Imagine if your next door neighbour had been throwing his cash around, buying fancy cars, building an extension + swimming pool, gloating about how good he had it and now all of a sudden you've got to dig into your pockets to help this chump out because he hasn't got a pot to **** in?

Where did all the money go when Ireland was booming?

Heads should roll. The people should be on the streets kicking off.

**mypost** · 17/11/2010, 7:54 AM

Originally Posted by shakermaker1982

If you think the British media are being harsh then check out the German papers!

What do you expect though? Imagine if your next door neighbour had been throwing his cash around, buying fancy cars, building an extension + swimming pool, gloating about how good he had it and now all of a sudden you've got to dig into your pockets to help this chump out because he hasn't got a pot to **** in?

Where did all the money go when Ireland was booming?

Heads should roll.

Everyone is paying, the UK will be contributing 7 billion alone. Ireland's taxpayers have also paid, are, and will continue to pay for the recklessness of the wealthiest when the country had a few bob.

Nobody likes our situation, not even ourselves.

**hedderman** · 17/11/2010, 9:09 AM

Speaking of Newsnight last night, did anyone see Dick Roche make an absolute fool of himself? I think one comment was, regarding the Donegal bye-election, that people should vote for Fianna Fail to ensure "stability and growth." Mind boggling. Would be nice to see a bit of humility from our government at the moment.

**dantheman** · 17/11/2010, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

.....and a lot of fish.

My granny always said fish gave you brains!

**dahamsta** · 17/11/2010, 10:51 AM

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

How would the country raise money in that case?

Tax effectively. Most of the larger companies operating in Ireland, which is usually stated as the reason we have a low tax rate in the first place, pay a far lower effective rate than even 10%. Google pays an effective 2.4%. Higher earners in Ireland also pay far less than they should be because of tax avoidance schemes. Close those loopholes gradually over the next 10 years, use the earnings to promote indigenous business, then they can feck off.

EDIT: Of course this is an incredibly simplistic explanation, and idea for that matter. The original point stands though: we shouldn't have bailed out the banks, and we've gained all we can gain from Europe. (I don't consider a bailout from Europe a gain. We didn't need to be here.)

**awec** · 17/11/2010, 11:13 AM

As someone who hopes to seek employment in Ireland upon graduation, should I be worried?

**dahamsta** · 17/11/2010, 11:15 AM

That's a very open-ended question awec. When do you graduate, what are you studying?

**awec** · 17/11/2010, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by dahamsta

That's a very open-ended question awec. When do you graduate, what are you studying?

Computer Science, so the IT industry. Graduate this spring/summer.

**dahamsta** · 17/11/2010, 11:20 AM

Well, I guess that depends on your specialty, and how clever you are. Google are always looking for clever people, but you have to be /really/ clever.

It's tough out there for everyone though, I wouldn't hold my breath and I'd seriously be considering options at this point. No-one walks into a job right now.

**awec** · 17/11/2010, 11:50 AM

cheers for the info dahamsta

**Mr A** · 17/11/2010, 1:03 PM

I work in IT.. was told I was going to be let go earlier in the year and hence have watched the job market pretty closely. There is loads of IT work in Dublin and even Galway is picking up. In fact we're recruiting again and are having bother getting enough qualified people.

If you do Java especially, you'll be sound.

**shakermaker1982** · 17/11/2010, 1:54 PM

I didn't think it could get any worse for Ireland but it has.............

George Osborne is offering help.

**EalingGreen** · 17/11/2010, 1:57 PM

Originally Posted by shakermaker1982

Could Ireland threaten to pull out of the Euro?

Let me see now.

The Irish Republic is the country which has (arguably) benefited most financially and economically from EU membership of the whole 27.

It is/was also amongst the most enthusiastic of members re the whole EU project.

It was pleased to join the Eurozone from the beginning, both for its financial/economic merits, but also because it allowed the country to cast off one of the last links/connections (currency) with its former colonial governor etc.

So far, so good.

Then the country's Government makes a whole series of catastrophic miscalculations and policy errors etc, many of which were downright corrupt, which left the country's economy up the creek, having incurred enormous debts to its EU partners.

And people are suggesting that all of the above should be forgotten, solely out of expediency and self-interest, even despite the damage it (leaving the Eurozone) would do to its fellow Europeans and the EU?

"How to win friends and influence people", eh?

**shakermaker1982** · 17/11/2010, 1:58 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11768336

any views on this article? Positive I must say.

**dahamsta** · 17/11/2010, 2:04 PM

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

And people are suggesting that all of the above should be forgotten, solely out of expediency and self-interest, even despite the damage it (leaving the Eurozone) would do to its fellow Europeans and the EU?

We're either a capitalist country or we're not. We're certainly not socialist and with our current system of democracy, you can't have it both ways. So yes, I stay drop it like a stone; or at least we should have a couple of years ago.

**shantykelly** · 17/11/2010, 2:47 PM

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Let me see now.

The Irish Republic is the country which has (arguably) benefited most financially and economically from EU membership of the whole 27.

It is/was also amongst the most enthusiastic of members re the whole EU project.

It was pleased to join the Eurozone from the beginning, both for its financial/economic merits, but also because it allowed the country to cast off one of the last links/connections (currency) with its former colonial governor etc.

So far, so good.

Then the country's Government makes a whole series of catastrophic miscalculations and policy errors etc, many of which were downright corrupt, which left the country's economy up the creek, having incurred enormous debts to its EU partners.

And people are suggesting that all of the above should be forgotten, solely out of expediency and self-interest, even despite the damage it (leaving the Eurozone) would do to its fellow Europeans and the EU?

"How to win friends and influence people", eh?

realpolitik. a very european invention, if i'm not mistaken.

**shakermaker1982** · 17/11/2010, 2:52 PM

It's the politicians first duty to look after its own citizens. Selfish I know EG but that is the way of the world. I'm with Dahamsta. The EU/EEC has been very good for Ireland the last 30/40 but if the deal they are offered is a very painful pill to swallow then they should look at alternatives. Do Irish citizens want every decision on fiscal and monetary matters to be now in the hands of the EU?

**bennocelt** · 17/11/2010, 2:59 PM

Originally Posted by shakermaker1982

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11768336

any views on this article? Positive I must say.

Tsk tsk, its by Marc Coleman, thats enough and all I need to know. Pretty much has no creditability left - what were the names of his two books again!!!!!

**jinxy lilywhite** · 17/11/2010, 7:53 PM

it probably is in the hands of people who know how an economy and a banking system work. if anything the 2 brians are lawyers by trade and not finance people. i know it was those people (& in particular one accountant) that got us in the mess but they would of really had no educational concept of how economies work or how they operate.
In response to your post we should be in control of our own destiny. if it means leaving the euro would be better than being in it we should look at that option. Also if we do talk openly about that option maybe we might get a better deal that what will be on the table in 10 days with a stupid govt promise of paying everyone back. You'd swear no one ever heard of caveat emptor.
We certainly will not be the last country to be in this predicament.