Transfer rumours

[HulaHoop]

Well you were banging on about all the money you brought in last year through prize money etc and your euro run but can you tell me here and now if you came even close to breaking even or is it a case that your figures are a state secret while you ****e on about every other clubs finances.Given that many budgets are down and you are signing a greater number of full timers this year with far far reduced income this season unless your operation has scaled back significantly that break even scenario will be lot harder to attain lower wages or not

The 2010 accounts will be on the CRO website later on in the year. If you would like to see the accounts before that date then please click here.

[Charlie Darwin]

Well you were banging on about all the money you brought in last year through prize money etc and your euro run but can you tell me here and now if you came even close to breaking even or is it a case that your figures are a state secret while you ****e on about every other clubs finances.Given that many budgets are down and you are signing a greater number of full timers this year with far far reduced income this season unless your operation has scaled back significantly that break even scenario will be lot harder to attain lower wages or not

What?

[de bowez]

What?

Massively reduced prize money is the major one.

[Jicked]

What?

I presume he's referring to LoI prize-money, which if we were to win the league again would be down €100k on last season. Blow for Rovers alright even if we did win the league, but as far as far, far reduced income, surely some of that €100k would be made up in the difference of playing Europa League last year and Champions League qualifiers this year.

[Schumi]

surely some of that €100k would be made up in the difference of playing Europa League last year and Champions League qualifiers this year.

You think you'll make more money from Europe this year than from playing Juventus last year?

[SkStu]

so nobody has a clue about how much Rovers' budget is this year but think they will be told it is affordable.

Grand so. Carry on.

[Charlie Darwin]

I presume he's referring to LoI prize-money, which if we were to win the league again would be down €100k on last season. Blow for Rovers alright even if we did win the league, but as far as far, far reduced income, surely some of that €100k would be made up in the difference of playing Europa League last year and Champions League qualifiers this year.

OK, I figured that, but in reality you don't receive prize money until the following year so in terms of the 2011 budget we'll be operating with a windfall of prize money (200k instead of 100k I believe, since I'm informed we budgeted for second).

Assuming we budget for second place again, it'll be for 50k instead of the expected 100k - meaning "reduced income" of perhaps 4-5% of total income? It's still a large amount of money but it's hardly impossible to bridge with increased matchday and commercial income. If anything, it'd be a failure if the club couldn't build on the success of last season and make significant advances in both, but I can understand the need to budget prudently in that regard.

The fact is that it is the well-run clubs with reasonably large fanbases (Rovers, Sligo, Dundalk) that are least vulnerable to drops in (supposedly) windfall payments.

[SkStu]

You think you'll make more money from Europe this year than from playing Juventus last year?

i see the point your making Schumi but the participation money alone for the CL would run close to the all sources of income generated from their run last year including their game against Juve, i would estimate.

[SkStu]

OK, I figured that, but in reality you don't receive prize money until the following year so in terms of the 2011 budget we'll be operating with a windfall of prize money (200k instead of 100k I believe, since I'm informed we budgeted for second).

Assuming we budget for second place again, it'll be for 50k instead of the expected 100k - meaning "reduced income" of perhaps 4-5% of total income? It's still a large amount of money but it's hardly impossible to bridge with increased matchday and commercial income. If anything, it'd be a failure if the club couldn't build on the success of last season and make significant advances in both, but I can understand the need to budget prudently in that regard.

The fact is that it is the well-run clubs with reasonably large fanbases (Rovers, Sligo, Dundalk) that are least vulnerable to drops in (supposedly) windfall payments.

good infor CD, thanks, but surely - given the number of season tickets Rovers sell and the state of the economy at the moment - it will be nigh on impossible for Rovers to significantly increase their matchday and/or commercial income?

[Rasputin]

And the reason for our budget being the biggest in the league will have more to do with cutbacks elsewhere than an increase in our budget. People seem to want to talk about our 5 strikers being overkill, but Sheppherd, Kelly, Kilduff and Gary O'Neill have replaced Fenn, Stewart, Baker and Barrett, and I'd imagine only Gary O'Neill
would be on similar wages to that which established players like Baker would have been on. Add in last year's increased prize-money from winning the league, reaching the Cup Final, a good European run, the Juve TV money and selling over 2,500 season tickets the last couple of years and I don't see any reason to think everything's not fine. With other clubs finally working off sustainable budgets (well...) it's the perfect chance for us to capitalise having been doing the same for the last few years.

This is all well and good but what happens when the accounts come in this season and your sizeable debt from last year has increased again?
What was last years debt about, was it around 600k or so, ive forgotten tbh.

[Charlie Darwin]

i see the point your making Schumi but the participation money alone for the CL would run close to the all sources of income generated from their run last year including their game against Juve, i would estimate.

I don't think so. Each round in the CL is 130k or something to that effect? Two rounds of the Europa League were worth 90k apiece (I think) with about 200k in bonus TV money from our friend Berlusconi. I think we'd need to reach the Europa play-offs to even match that without a bumper TV payday?

good infor CD, thanks, but surely - given the number of season tickets Rovers sell and the state of the economy at the moment - it will be nigh on impossible for Rovers to significantly increase their matchday and/or commercial income?

You'd think so, but it's not really the way it's been going, is it? It's still cheaper to go to a football match and bring home a bottle of wine than it is to go to the pub for a few hours - even more so when you factor in babysitters. People are cutting down but they're finding cheaper ways to entertain themselves, not going without entertainment entirely.

Not to mention a certain Dublin club that recently went bust and may have a few fans up for grabs

[Schumi]

i see the point your making Schumi but the participation money alone for the CL would run close to the all sources of income generated from their run last year including their game against Juve, i would estimate.

I thought the Italian TV money was worth more than the money from UEFA last year, the CL money is hardly that much bigger?


Edit: What Charlie Darwin said!

[SkStu]

Fingal CC no likey South Dublin CC... plus three of them sound like theyre off to the Drogs this year (kiss of death for Drogs imo). That leaves about 4 fans for us and Pats and UCD to fight over. I say we give two to UCD and have a 3-way deathmatch for the other two.

I thought the CL money was more than 130k. You'd think i'd know, eh? I still think it will be hard for Rovers to increase their attendances significantly this season.

So the bottom line though is that Rovers are clearly fcked.

[SkStu]

I thought the Italian TV money was worth more than the money from UEFA last year, the CL money is hardly that much bigger?


Edit: What Charlie Darwin said!

yep - im clearly underestimating the amount of sponds that Juve brought in last year and overestimating the rewards for CL participation. Either way, it does suggest a drop in income this year.

[ashbournebohs]

All very relevant re the signing or replacing of players but there are a lot of other factors at play.For instance players bonuses(now our rovers brethern will insist they dont exist as they are the best run club) which eat into prizemoney and as i stated earlier reduced income means a lot of things.Gate receipts will be lower at a lot of clubs rovers included as people feel the pinch and the perception that the league is going backwards.Sponsorship will be down and tv money from rte etc will undoubtably be reduced.
Thats just a few off the top of my head and dont get me wrong they will be the same for all clubs maybe a bit les for rovers because they do their business very well .The point im making is that i dont see rovers budget coming down too much versus other clubs and their income may very well come down a bit.They wont go bang theyve done that already but watch out for the losses as they can build up and rovers have no asset so they would have to fold and set up another SRFC holding company and start again.

[marinobohs]

Do you really think Shamrock Rovers are about to go the way of Shels in 2006 or Bohs 2010?

NO, Jicked because you dont own a ground to borrow on. Over extending budgets appear to be the norn for teams that win the LOI and (in fairness without knowing contract details) it looks as if shams could be going down a similar route.
The point of my post was that "its within budget" is a refrain familar to those assosiated with all the clubs mentioned - shels,shams, drogs,cork, bohs - until the bottom fell out.
Would be almost refreshing to hear a board come out and say we signed so and so but it is outside our budget

Most clubs are never far fom financial meltdown and increasing budgets at a time of economic disaster (and associated difficulties in income maintenance) is hardly the smartest fiscal approach.

[Jicked]

NO, Jicked because you dont own a ground to borrow on. Over extending budgets appear to be the norn for teams that win the LOI and (in fairness without knowing contract details) it looks as if shams could be going down a similar route.
The point of my post was that "its within budget" is a refrain familar to those assosiated with all the clubs mentioned - shels,shams, drogs,cork, bohs - until the bottom fell out.
Would be almost refreshing to hear a board come out and say we signed so and so but it is outside our budget

Most clubs are never far fom financial meltdown and increasing budgets at a time of economic disaster (and associated difficulties in income maintenance) is hardly the smartest fiscal approach.

I think the biggest reassurance (for us, biggest disappointment for Bohs fans it seems) is how Rovers passed on players this pre-season. Even though we could afford certain players, once they were out of our budget we walked away and let them join rival clubs. Gary O'Neill, Ken Oman are two we know about for sure, I'd imagine there was more. That shows it's very much a different situation to say Bohs 12 months ago, where they felt they had to beat us to signing certain players, at any cost.

[Fivesilver]

We're in talks with Brian Cash according to the Star

Thank god for that
It took us several seasons to get rid of him - I live in fear of waking up some morning and finding out he's back in the Showgies.

[superjohnny]

I think the big plus for rovers is that they have shifted 2500 season tickets already for this campaign, i dont remember a time at shels, drogs, cork or bohs sold a 1/4 of that..

[El-Pietro]

NO, Jicked because you dont own a ground to borrow on. Over extending budgets appear to be the norn for teams that win the LOI and (in fairness without knowing contract details) it looks as if shams could be going down a similar route.
The point of my post was that "its within budget" is a refrain familar to those assosiated with all the clubs mentioned - shels,shams, drogs,cork, bohs - until the bottom fell out.

Just to remind everyone, when Cork City won the league in 05, we did it quite cheaply.

We didn't start to overextend until Rico was kicked out for being too frugal.