Welsh clubs in trouble?

**Plastic Paddy** · 30/04/2004, 6:25 AM

It was published at the end of March. Here you go S�C:

http://www.richardcommission.gov.uk/...rt/index-e.asp

No huge suprises, to be honest. Richard is looking for increased powers, including the power to make primary legislation � la Scotland and also at precepting.

My day job is in local government as a policy specialist, so this kind of thing is right up my street. If I can be of any use to you in your project, just PM me and I'll be happy to help.

PP

**parnell ranger** · 30/04/2004, 7:33 AM

Originally Posted by eoinh

Was there ever a welsh terrorist group?

I remember the SNLA from Scotland.

The Cardiff City hooligan element come close

**Paddy Ramone** · 30/04/2004, 8:03 AM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Fair play SOC. Didn't want ot get into it in detail but there you go...

Amate of mine who's VERY interested in nationalist causes lived in Cardiff for a bit. He gopt talking to some bloke in a bar there who was considering setting up a Welsh terrorist group. My mate says he was the strangest bloke he's ever met.

There were Welsh terrorist groups called the Sons of Glyndwr and the Workers Army of the Welsh Republic who set fire to English holiday homes. The Provisional IRA bought arms of Welsh terrorists back in the 60's.

The Welsh nationalists have a stronger affinity with the Bretons and Cornish than the Irish and sympathise with independence movements in those countries. The Irish are closer to the Manx and the Scottish.

**Paddy Ramone** · 30/04/2004, 8:14 AM

Originally Posted by eoinh

Although when to comes to things like keeping their culture, language and heritage alive the welsh seem way ahead of the scots.

The welsh language is very strong - you cant say the same for scots gaeilge

There are more Scots Gaelic native speakers than Irish native speakers. Lallans or Scots which some say is a dialect of English and others say is a language is very strong in Scotland.

**pete** · 30/04/2004, 9:03 AM

The Welsh would never leave the UK as would be bankrupt overnight. On the otherhand if the Scots could keep their north sea oil money they'd probably be able to balance the books.

**Paddy Ramone** · 30/04/2004, 9:18 AM

While Welsh nationlism is weak, they have to be admired for preserving their language which is in a much more stronger position than Irish. I think Irish people should ask themselves the question what's the point of independence if we lose our language and identity and become just like the 51st state of the US.

**Plastic Paddy** · 30/04/2004, 9:28 AM

Originally Posted by Paddy Ramone

While Welsh nationlism is weak, they have to be admired for preserving their language which is in a much more stronger position than Irish. I think Irish people should ask themselves the question what's the point of independence if we lose our language and identity and become just like the 51st state of the US.

In fairness, legislation has upheld the status of the Welsh language in schools, etc., since 1993. AFAIK, it wasn't until the passing of the Official Languages Act last year that any such statute existed in the 26 counties. Nothing as yet exists for the other six.

PP

**eoinh** · 30/04/2004, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by Paddy Ramone

While Welsh nationlism is weak, they have to be admired for preserving their language which is in a much more stronger position than Irish. I think Irish people should ask themselves the question what's the point of independence if we lose our language and identity and become just like the 51st state of the US.

Im average intelligence i would say yet i cant speak a word of Irish except for a few sayings. Why is this?

Well if youre ramming Peig down the throats of Children or the only documentary on TV that you see in Irish is "Hands" then you have your answer.

Irish should have been dealing with the "now" subjects. because it dealt with historical subjects its remained historical. It will never recover now i would very cofidently predict. Its a pity.

Its a bit embarrising when you go abroad that i cant speak my own language.

**Paddy Ramone** · 30/04/2004, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by eoinh

Irish should have been dealing with the "now" subjects. because it dealt with historical subjects its remained historical. It will never recover now i would very cofidently predict. Its a pity.

Yes, it should be more relevant. I think it would also be good if children were thought the meanings of their surnames and place names which are mainly Gaelic in origin. Like the Irish origin of Riordan is little royal bard. I think it obvious that it meant that from the old Irish spelling which had bhard in it but not with the modern spelling.

**Plastic Paddy** · 30/04/2004, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by Paddy Ramone

I think it would also be good if children were thought the meanings of their surnames.

On second thoughts, sometimes it's not a good thing. I'm the son of a black dog as Gaelige.

PP

**eoinh** · 30/04/2004, 10:59 AM

Michael McDowell - McDowell means "son of the Black Foreigner". Im going to vote no in the referendum but if it passes i reckon we should deport him.

**Paddy Ramone** · 30/04/2004, 11:13 AM

Originally Posted by eoinh

Michael McDowell - McDowell means "son of the Black Foreigner". Im going to vote no in the referendum but if it passes i reckon we should deport him.

I've read that black foreigners was what the Irish called the Danes to distinguish them the Norse. While the Danes aren't as blonde as the Norweigans, they're not really that dark and are fairer than the Irish.

Irish people with relatively dark complexions are called the Black Irish in America. I've heard that the first people on the Ireland were related to the Basques and even the Moors in Morocco.

**sadloserkid** · 30/04/2004, 1:17 PM

Originally Posted by �anna

Anyone know why Cardiff, Wrexham and Swansea were allowed played in England in the first place?

No Welsh league until very recently. I always presumed that was why to be honest...

**Plastic Paddy** · 30/04/2004, 1:26 PM

Originally Posted by sadloserkid

No Welsh league until very recently. I always presumed that was why to be honest...

The excellent Wikipedia carries a full explanation of the reasons behind the LoW's formation:

The League of Wales is the national football league for Wales and is at the top of the Welsh football league system. It was formed in 1992 with nineteen teams, when it was sponsored by Konica Peter Llewellyn Limited of Swansea and was known as the Konica League of Wales. From 2002 the league is named after its new sponsor, the J.T. Hughes Mitsubishi Welsh Premier. The League normally provides three teams for European club competitions (though they invariably do not progress far) -- the League Champions are entered in the UEFA Champions League, the runners-up in the UEFA Cup, and the third place team in the Intertoto Cup. Normally a fourth team is also entered in the UEFA Cup as winners of the Welsh Cup.

The creation of the first national football league for Wales in 1992 was a rather traumatic event. Because of geography, it has always been much easier to travel east-west than north-south, so it was natural for clubs to tend to look east to England for competitors, and the principal non-Football League teams such a Bangor City and Barry Town played in the English non-League pyramid. In the early 1990s UEFA insisted that clubs should not play in a "foreign" league (and arguments about the United Kingdom being one country do not wash with UEFA because all four countries participate in international competition in their own right), thus came about the creation of the League of Wales. Many of the northern clubs refused to participate in the new league initially, and for a time played their "home" English league games in exile at grounds to the east of the English border. Eventually the new order was accepted, although the presence in the English League of the professional Welsh teams, Cardiff City, Wrexham, and Swansea City, remains an anomaly in the eyes of UEFA, ameliorated only by their being debarred from competing for the Welsh Cup which used to provide one of them with near-guaranteed European competition each year.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_Wales

PP

**sadloserkid** · 30/04/2004, 1:31 PM

So basically Plastic paddy, you're trying to say that I'm right?

**Plastic Paddy** · 30/04/2004, 1:33 PM

Originally Posted by sadloserkid

So basically Plastic paddy, you're trying to say that I'm right?

That's about the size of it, yes.

PP

**Dodge** · 30/04/2004, 1:40 PM

On the language thione get Grainne Seoige and Sharoin Ni Bhoeloain to wrestle naked in jelly in the Point. There is not entrance fee but you must pass an oral exam as Gaeilge.

Once we get the men speaking Irish, we'll work on the women...

**S�C** · 02/05/2004, 11:02 PM

To be fair the Irish course is a good deal different now. Peg and her likes are gone replaced by a novel about a junkie blackmailing his father who's banging his receptionist behind the mother's back.