Are Barcelona in major financial trouble?

**The Fly** · 09/07/2010, 3:21 AM

Doesn't sound good.........(unless you're an Arsenal fan)

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-0...ers-wages.html

**Dodge** · 09/07/2010, 6:38 AM

Arsenal have more debt...

The short answer is no. As long as their income remains so high, they'll be OK.

**gaisc�och** · 09/07/2010, 7:32 AM

Is it possible it has something to do with the TV monies not having been distributed yet?
Barcelona probably just have to sell another two players to cover the wages for a full year.

**pineapple stu** · 09/07/2010, 8:56 AM

E150m of a loan just to pay wages. Wow...

**Closed Account 2** · 09/07/2010, 9:07 AM

€150m loan from a bank... wonder if it's from a Spanish bank as there is a degree of uncertainty over Spanish financial institutions at the moment.

**Dodge** · 09/07/2010, 9:12 AM

A fair bit is lost in translation there. Can't find the article but Sandro Rosell clearly explained the reason behind the loan, and wages wasn't one of them

He said that they have a transfer kitty of €50m and the money raised by sale of Toure and the Ukrainian (sorry can't even attempt to spell his name correctly) would be added to that. Definitely not the actions of a club in crisis

**Charlie Darwin** · 09/07/2010, 9:24 AM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Arsenal have more debt...

The short answer is no. As long as their income remains so high, they'll be OK.

The other clubs in La Liga are putting pressure on them now to share TV revenues out more equitably. The article there notes that Barca have a 1 billion-euro deal over 7 years for the domestic league alone. The winner of the Premier League gets about 50 million pounds a year.

If they were forced to distribute TV revenue in a manner similar to the Premier League, we might just find out the two big clubs are houses of cards.

**John83** · 09/07/2010, 2:25 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

A fair bit is lost in translation there. Can't find the article but Sandro Rosell clearly explained the reason behind the loan, and wages wasn't one of them

He said that they have a transfer kitty of €50m and the money raised by sale of Toure and the Ukrainian (sorry can't even attempt to spell his name correctly) would be added to that. Definitely not the actions of a club in crisis

Madrid behaved similarly when they were screwed. It took the sale of their training ground (for €150,000,000, I think), to sort them out. Clubs like Barca and Real Madrid have a lot more options when they're in financial trouble than an LoI club.

**Dodge** · 09/07/2010, 3:25 PM

No argument, but Rosell won the election on the basis of sorting out their finances (His motto was "it can't continue"). However when he pushed he said they weren't that bad and that it only needed a quick bit of corrective action

Again I'm paraphasing hugely

**culloty82** · 09/07/2010, 4:32 PM

Four Four Two had a piece this month comparing ownership in England, Spain and Germany. Neither Barcelona nor Real got off lightly, as it said that any candidates for the Real presidency have to raise €60m, which automatically limits the field to moguls like Perez, while Laporta was criticised for using Barca as a platform to run for Catalan president. The German model seems interesting - it's a legal requirement that 50% + 1 share of the holding company of a football club (i.e. Bayern Munich plc) has to be owned by the original non-profit club (e.g. Bayern Munich FC), so no businessman can assume overall control, and huge debts like Barcelona's would be unthinkable in the Bundesliga.

**outspoken** · 09/07/2010, 4:37 PM

Barca are in no danger what so ever. Their president has very strong ties to one of the biggest banks in Spain so he will have no problem in getting a loan on very low interest. At the moment its only a small cash flow problem as the company that owns TV rights is finding it hard to pay out which is very bad news for the entire La Liga as it is the clubs main income but looking short term everything will be ok.....for now!

**Closed Account 2** · 12/07/2010, 12:15 AM

Originally Posted by Kieran Burke

Barca are in no danger what so ever. Their president has very strong ties to one of the biggest banks in Spain so he will have no problem in getting a loan on very low interest. At the moment its only a small cash flow problem as the company that owns TV rights is finding it hard to pay out which is very bad news for the entire La Liga as it is the clubs main income but looking short term everything will be ok.....for now!

Well Spanish banks could be in a spot of bother:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...nking-industry

If there is a double dip most experts are tipping Portuguese, Italian and Spanish financial sectors to take a battering (also Irish banks to a lesser extent).

**EalingGreen** · 12/07/2010, 3:19 PM

Originally Posted by John83

Madrid behaved similarly when they were screwed. It took the sale of their training ground (for €150,000,000, I think), to sort them out. Clubs like Barca and Real Madrid have a lot more options when they're in financial trouble than an LoI club.

There was a lot more to the sale of Real Madrid's training ground than met the eye:
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/f...al-572010.html

Of course, the EU's enquiries came to nothing, since it was in too many peoples interests in Spain to admit just how scandalous the sale of the old training ground (with Planning Permission) was; and that's before we consider the granting by the Madrid City Council of a valuble site for free to Real to build a replacement (which the Independent only mentions in passing).

I guess since this all happened at the height of an economic boom etc, when Spaniards were all feeling good about themselves, no-one cared to question it too much. But I daresay if they tried to pull such a stroke today, it would cause a hell of a sight more fuss.

(Which is why I suspect, incidentally, that whilst there is no chance of Barca going bust, they may have to tighten their belt for a season or two, until they get their finances back in some sort of order)

P.S. The Independent quotes the sale price of Real's training ground as being �291 million (sterling)!

**rubadubdub** · 13/07/2010, 2:32 PM

pfft, Barca's income was �445 million and they want to borrow �150 million, it's nothing. It's the same as an individual with a salary of �44,500 wanting to get a personal loan for �15,000, not exactly going to break you!...

**EalingGreen** · 13/07/2010, 4:36 PM

Originally Posted by rubadubdub

pfft, Barca's income was €445 million and they want to borrow €150 million, it's nothing. It's the same as an individual with a salary of €44,500 wanting to get a personal loan for €15,000, not exactly going to break you!...

It's hardly the same. If you were on a salary of €44,500 and you went to the bank to borrow €15,000, say, to fit a new kitchen or, bathroom in your house, that would not be a problem. But if it was to pay your last 6 months mortgage arrears, or Credit Card bills etc, the bank would be likely to be a deal more concerned, since it would indicate you're not managing your affairs properly, so must be a credit risk.

In Barca's case, it's not as if they want the money eg to expand their stadium, build a new training ground, or even sign a couple of Christiano Ronaldos etc. If they're struggling to pay their wage bill, after the most successful (and lucrative) season any Spanish club has ever had, then that must be serious.

**Charlie Darwin** · 13/07/2010, 4:49 PM

It's not just their income you have to look at; it's their profit and debt levels.

Despite record receipts of €445 million, they only made a profit of €9 million, compared to €22 million last year. This means their spending is rising faster than their income.

They now have €326 million of debt to service, which is an increase of €124 million in just a year, and this doesn't seem to include to €150 million needed to cover the players' wages (as I understand, Barca pay players in two blocks, six months apart).

Their financial situation is nowhere near as precarious as Manchester United's or Liverpool's, but it does seem to indicate they won't be able to continue overpaying for players in the future (the bargain purchase of Villa is the first indication of this).

Add to that two potential shocks in the coming months and years:

- Spain offers generous ~25% tax credits to sports stars for their first five years of residence, but it will almost certainly be scrapped as part of the government's austerity measures. That would require Barca to offer higher wages to attract new player, meaning others would probably have to be offloaded.

- The other clubs in La Liga appear to be serious in their pursuit of a more equitable share of TV revenues. They seem to sense blood and could very well hold the big two to ransom, and that could chop a good €50m off the club's yearly receipts.

**John83** · 13/07/2010, 6:40 PM

Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

- Spain offers generous ~25% tax credits to sports stars for their first five years of residence, but it will almost certainly be scrapped as part of the government's austerity measures. That would require Barca to offer higher wages to attract new player, meaning others would probably have to be offloaded.

That gets me thinking. A lot of players at that level negotiate wages net of tax. It'd be interesting to see if their contracts mean that Barca (and the whole of la Liga) could be looking at a significant rise in their wage bill if that gets scrapped.

**Charlie Darwin** · 13/07/2010, 7:04 PM

I wouldn't have thought so. I remember Arshavin having a moan when the UK government increased the top rate of tax from 40% to 50% shortly after he joined Arsenal.