QuoteTHREADS MERGED
Éanna
ill refer you to this thread to continue the argument !
http://foot.ie/showthread.php?t=13459
THREADS MERGED
Éanna
Goalie..........Given
Cenre backs..O'Brien, Cunningham, O'Shea
Wingbacks....Carr, Reid.
Midfield 3......Keane (Roy), Kavanagh, Kilbane
Forwards, Keane (Robbie), Duffer.
How good or bad is this...thanks gally.
We tried playing with "wingbacks" in Mick McCarthys early days and to say it didn't work is a huge understatement. I personally would opt for:Originally Posted by gally
Given
Carr
Cunningham
O'Brien
O'Shea
Keane
Holland (his ability, or lack thereof, has been questioned on other threads but when playing alongside Keane he tends to punch above his weight)
Miller
A. Reid
Keane
Duff
I realise that Miller is inexperienced and that his natural position is central midfield but having seen him playing at outside right for Celtic I reckon that he could do a good job for us. Apart from anything else it would be great just to have a decent right sided player playing there again. Also, a lot of people feel that Duff should play at outside left. While I agree that is his best position the question here is what is the best team that we can put out. If Andy Reid progresses as well as he looks he will he would have to start. With the small pool of quality players available to us we have to make the best out of what we have. Andy reid looks to me to be a much better prospect than Clinton Morrison and that he is capable of contributing a lot more to the team effort. I feel that even though Duff's best position is outside left he does an excellent job up front as well, certainly far better than any of the other potential partners for Keane so to me it makes perfect sense to have him up front alongside Keane with Reid taking his place on the wing.
a Kavanagh-Keane partnership is by far the best for the centre. People give out about Connolly (not that I would want to play him) but he puts a lot more in for Ireland then Matt Holland ever did. Kilbane would be second choice for the central role.
Midfield seems to be the only area with problems, I would have different players play at home versus away especially in the tougher away games:
Home
Duff Keane ( Pick a body home ) Reid
Away
Kilbane Keane ( Pick a body away ) Finnan/Duff
Pick a body home Holland/Kavanagh/Kinsella/HealyMiller/Delap
Pick a body away Holland/Kavanagh/Kinsella/Healy
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Nationalism is an infantile disease, the measles of mankind
Looks like Duff could be missing from the first two
http://www.unison.ie/sportsdesk/foot...=12&si=1179930
UCD sha-la-la
How is Kilbane an automatic starter ffs!? What rubbish.
Given
O'Shea/Finnan
Carr/Finnan
O'Brien/Breen
Cunningham
(Alot of options in defence only Cunningham is automatic choice really)
Duff
A Reid
Keane
Miller/Delap - Holland, Kavanagh and Kilbane aren't upto it and Healy will have to prove himself with Sunderland on his return
Morrison
Keane
Delap, apart from one fantastic goal has had a very average season with a lot of injuries. How he and Miller(one fairly good season in the SPL) are in and Kilbane, Holland and Kav are written off is beyond me. Kilbane has had a far better Premiership season than any of the other players mentioned as well as putting in fine displays for Ireland. Kav was arguably the best midfielder in the First Division until he got injured and although i'm not Holland's biggest fan he is a captain of one of the best teams in England.
Delap is better then Kilbane, that's why. Plain and simple. Kilbanes had a decent season, so has Delap, no more and no less, but Delap is a better player. He's also a central mid fielder, compared to someone who's played a handful of matches there. He was even singled out as one of their best and most important players by strachan before he left. And he (Kilbane) has not put in 'fine' preformances for Ireland. He has, as he does, worked his absolute arse off and also he has, as he does, lacked the quality needed at this level to put some end product on all of his running. If your impressed by people who run around alot, that's fine, but I'd rather see someone who has some quality play for us.
Hollands not upto it, based on him being ****, absolutley **** for us since the world cup. There's no other way to describe it. He could be Maradona at club level, I couldn't care less, he's had his chance and pretty much four years of ineptness tells me it's time he was made a squad player at best.
Kavanagh was not the best mid fielder in the first division at all. No argument at all. If he was, there might be a few premiership clubs actually after him, they're not. He's a decent player, but not good enough to start at international level.
Miller has shown in the champions league and for the Ireland U21s that he's good enough to play. He's also an attacking mid fielder, which suits Keane, and would make a good partnership. Anyone who's good enough to look a star in the champions league is good enough to play for us.
Keanes an automatic choice, so it'll probably be Miller beside him, or Delap if Miller is taking time to settle into the Man U team.
I've got as high hopes for Miller as anyone but he's looked extremely average far more than he's looked exceptional in the games i've seen him play this year(Villareal and Livingston recently he was annonymous). Being outshone by Pearson IMO. If he's not warming united's bench next season i will be very pleasently surprised.
Delap being better than Kilbane is a matter of opinion. If you don't care about club form then value Delap on his limited Ireland performances. He's looked nothing more than workmanlike (the very thing Kilbane is criticized for) in a green jersey as far as i'm concerned.
Not saying Miller and Delap aren't equal candidates for midfiled roles but they are not far and a way better than the other options. It's a much of a muchness
Delap has been never anything more than average for Southampton and has done little to suggest otherwise in his limited opportunities at full level. Kilbane on the other hand has had an excellent season and in the last few friendlies has adapted to the central midfield extremely well for a winger. He is the perfect partner for Keane who is not the force of old going forward and will do the defensive part of the job which leaves Keane to rome !
well here's my 2 cents for our best team. Given picks himself in goal(although this shouldn't have been the case when Kiely was about and if it wasn't we'd still have 2 truly great keepers in the squad).
At right back it's a toss up between Carr and Finnan. Two great backs both underachieving in my opinion. To say they both have to be included in first 11 is nonsense though IMO as neither is a great right midfielder.
At left back O'Shea. Funny season for him but still think he's our best option.
Cunningham again picks himself. Please stop aging Kenny!!
Breen or O'Brien for other central defensive role. Neither are ideal as prone to the odd lapse but also either with Kenny makes a good centre of defence.
Centre Midfield Keane and Kilbane. Kilbane gets the nod for me as he is the player who has impressed the most in that position in recent times. He's looked better than Kav/Delap/Kinsella/etc. I think those 2 will be very good together.
Left and right midfield depend on how next season goes. If Reid is impressive in the Premiership then i'd go Duff on the right and Reid on the left. Duff is good enough to play anywhere and he does just that brilliantly for Chelsea. If we have Reid reaching his potential on the other side it's worth having Duff on the right. If Miller is a regular in United side then perhaps Miller on the right and Duff on the left.
Clinton and Robbie are our best option in attack but still think this combination is weak. Am hoping one of Heffernan/McGeady/Elliott/etc emerge as a realistic option to replace Clinton in the coming season. The Ant/Lee/Byrne/Crowe are only useful as back up options and not realistic challengers for a world class forward line IMO.
Agree totally with above mail ! Fair play to someone with a bit of sense !
Miller probably looked average because months on the sidelines aren't exactly good preperation for big matches. To slag him off for that is nonsense.
Kilbane offers NOTHING going forward, so why put him beside Keane who does the donkey work and does it more effectively than Kilbane does? He'll leave Keane to rome? Keane hasn't done that for years. He's not firmly a sit on front of the back four man, he needs someone who can attack beside him, ala Liam Miller.
How can you say you'll start Kilbane as he's looked better than the other options when playing for Ireland when Delap and Miller have barley played, and when Delap did come on recently he was very impressive.
And the myth that Duff can play anywhere is rubbish too. His best preformances have always been on the left. Why move our best player? Stick Reid on the right, his game suits being on his wrong foot far more than Duff who's more of a winger.
The fact is, Miller is better than Kilbane. Duff picks himself on the left, and Keane in the middle. Reid is favourite on the right atm. So while we all love Kilbanes work rate and the loyalty he showed at Preston, he isn't good enough to get into our strongest mid field.
Slash/ED, as soon as Miller proves it for Man U in the Premiership I'll be more than happy to agree with you. I really want him to prove his potential but one season and a handful of excellent performances does not a player make and if he's on United's bench then he shouldn't be in Ireland's first team.
Can't agree with you on the Kilbane thing but won't argue as your either a Kilbane fan or you're not. There's no middle ground with that fella.
Duff has played an awful lot of games on the right this season and while i agree he is best on the left he is still superb on the right.
Miller is not better than Kilbane. Miller has the potential to be way better than Kilbane and the potential to be as good as Keane but as yet that is still potential IMO.
Whats the fascination with Miller ? The minute anyone Irish even gets into a first team or plays a few decent games people rave about them ! Kilbane has the experience and good attacking side of a midfielder needed to play against switz and france. Hopefully will given time to settle into manu will prove he is good enough for a start !
By the time the WCQ come around though, Miller will be a month or so into his Man U career, so will have shown alot by then. Why does everyone think he'll be on Uniteds bench? Look at the amount of games Darren Fletcher gets, from what I've seen, Miller is a better player, and the less said about Phil Neville the better! Also, Keane will either be gone or playing fewer and fewer matches. As for Duff, if you're playing Duff and Andy Reid as I would, it has to be Reid on the right. We rely too much on Duff to be arseing about with his position, we've made that mistake far too many times. He's best on the left, so that's where he plays. Reids game, being a player who doesn't hug the touchline and cuts in alot, wouldn't be too hampered by playing on the right.
The fascination with Miller, Only1Kilbane, is that he's a good player who's played at the highest club level and been outstanding. Kilbane played at the highest level in international football and was dire. Experience is no substitute for ability. Miller has alot of it. Kilbane does not. He's also more suited to playing beside Keane.
Delap was one of my favourites to start the qualifiers before Keane cmae back but now he's back we need a more attacking player to partner Keane. Kavanagh would definitely be my first choice. IMO he didn't have a good game against Brazil (although others say he did), that was because he was playing the holding midfiled role with Kilbane playing alongside him.
At club level he gets forward an awful lot and with Keane alongside him he will be allowed do just that. People say Reid has scored a lot of goals from midfield, I agree, he has scored 13 in 46 league games. Kavanagh scored 7 in 27 league games, thats nearly the same ratio as Reid. Kavanagh has a lot more to his game than anyone else IMO and is a certain starter in my books.
Kilbane is definitely a close second behind Kav. The jury is still out on Miller and with 5 friendlies before the qualifiers we'll get to see enough of him (From recent form Doyle is actually looking better than Miller but Liam's under a lot of pressure from the Celts). Holland is about 6th choice.
BTW - Is the squad announced tomorrow?
I think so, not sure though, but will this be the squad for just the Romania match or for the Romania match right through to the London tournament? Give or take the many many many drop outs we'll have by the end.
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