Joe Coll

[SkStu]

Dont say i never did anything for you Paul!

Gary Dempsey's weekly column

Follow Gary on Twitter (@Dempz8)

Schoolboy football has to change in this country if we are to produce better quality players. I recently went to watch my cousins play in a junior game and the county under-13 team happened to be training on the pitch beside me. What I saw was beyond belief!!! This was suppose to be training for the best 20 odd players in the county, and no joking it was 27 minutes before they touched a ball.

Now if you have to work on fitness with players at 11/12 years of age there's something seriously wrong. These players need ball ball and more ball. They need to be taught how to pass it, how to control it, how to receive it and where to move to get it . They should be doing this from 7/8 years of age in my opinion.

I've seen training sessions also where there's 14 or 15 kids training and the coach only has two footballs. Minimum there should be a ball for every two players if not a ball each. You will regularly see before a schoolboy game two fellas in the goal and the rest of the team taking shots at them, Stone Age stuff!! Crazy stuff.

I also attended another schoolboy game to watch some of my Academy players play and again the things I saw and heard were ridiculous. I had just walked in the gate and a ball had been played over the top and the goal keeper never came off his line to pick it up and the manager starts screaming at this little kid of 11 in the goal 'would you ever get off your line and pick it up'. The keeper from then on was a nervous wreck, didn't want to know really because he was TERRIFIED of making a mistake and god forbid let in a goal.

You go to any schoolboy game and listen on the sidelines to the information and shouts from the parents and managers, its embarrassing. You will certainly hear 'Jesus Christ lads, wake up'. I heard this from a county team manager, and 'would you just clear the ball and stop messing with it at the back,'... God forbid the kids might take the ball down and try to pass it.

What I see anytime I go to a game is some great players that are terrified of making a mistake and are made to play the game totally the wrong way. I see managers and coaches that are hell bent on winning at all costs, no matter what it takes or how they play. Its ALL about winning.

In Spain, Holland and these countries, schoolboy football is non competitive, they play smaller sided games, in smaller goals. This leads to players getting more touches on the ball, more skill and more goals. How many under 12 games have you seen when a player gets a touch but then might not see the ball again for 15 minutes, happens everywhere and its madness.

I work with young players in my academy and see when you take that fear away from them and tell them to go ENJOY themselves and EXPRESS themselves and without worrying about losing or making a mistake its an absolute joy to watch. They will listen to you and try and play the right way. Yes they lose the ball, yes they make mistakes but so what? This is how they learn, but they do it knowing full well that I'm not going to be screaming at them and frightening the life out of them where they end up going through the game not wanting the ball, for fear of another bollocking from the sidelines.

We HAVE good young players in this country and its up to us to produce them, coach them properly, teach them the game and watch them learn and develop. Coaches and parents have a huge responsibility in this. Coaches have to get rid of this win at all costs mentality and start thinking about these young players. Let them play, take the fear factor away and watch them grow and they will surprise you!

Socially we have a big obligation to these kids too, teaching them other disciplines in life. I read a great line the other day on Twitter and it read 'Try not limit seeing progress as just the league table. It's by far not the only indicator of success and winning at grassroots football'

Politics in schoolboy football too will be the ruining of players in this country, I've heard of a county that make their players sign an agreement before The Kennedy Cup saying they wont leave their local league, why is this? I have come up against so many obstacles with my Academy its ridiculous, beyond belief to be honest. I've had one league assassination tell their members not to play us in friendly games, make sure their kids are insured, make sure coaches are Garda vetted......all rubbish because of one thing, pure jealously.

They don't agree with privately run academies and there are plenty of good people working at clubs and not getting paid etc, this is what they come out with. Yes, there are thousands of fantastic people, UNBELIEVABLE people who do unbelievable work in clubs up and down the country, but very few are qualified coaches!! And there lies the problem. Some believe it or not will be doing more harm than good!!

We all must try harder because like I've said the potential is there, the passion is there, the commitment is there, the skill is there, I've seen it, so lets all work harder and do right by the kids and in my opinion that's what its all about, the kids, the players, its all about them enjoying our beautiful game. JUST LET THEM PLAY!!!

[Irish_Praha]

i really wanted to read that but the white on black text after 10 hours sitting in front of a pc is just too difficult. Actually even after 1 hour id say its too difficult read white on black background.

Paul i thought you were the computer (hacker) expert
If you are at a PC just right click and choose select all, then you will have blue text on a grey/white background.
I'm sure you can do something similar with your phone too.

[Charlie Darwin]

I've had one league assassination tell their members not to play us in friendly games, make sure their kids are insured, make sure coaches are Garda vetted......all rubbish because of one thing, pure jealously.

Now now.

[paul_oshea]

Ya, I just think I was making the point that no one should ever write a web page or blog or whatever with white text on a black background.

[brine3]

Yeah, I used to play as a teenager in Holland and we always played on tiny goals in training, on a small pitch. Good for developing your touch and for quick passing. Each team would have two goals and you could score on either of them. Was good for developing positioning too.

But the Dutch coaches shout at players and are feckers as well. The Dutch "system football" is so ingrained in the kids there thay they are also afraid to express themselves. If I attempted to pass the ball more than 10 yards I'd be shouted at, because they assumed we'd lose posession. It was just assumed that giving a ball over the top was always wrong, end of. Whereas due to being more exposed to the more stoneage elements of football as a kid, I could actually see an opening to play the ball into space and dink it over the top, or give a cross-field ball that would land at a player's foot. The Dutch players couldn't do that, because they only ever trained on tiny pitches. After a while they actually trusted me to play these kinds of passes. This was around the time that Beckham was breaking through and people in Holland were starting to appreciate the art of the cross.

I'll never forget the time we went to play away at the league leaders that had plastered us 5-0 at our place. We always played 4-3-3, but they had destroyed us. I suggested we keep it tight, play a bit more defensive than usual and play 4-5-1, or 5-3-2. The other players criticised me, suggesting that would be "anti-voetbal" and the coach said that, no, we would surprise the opponents by playing 4-2-4 against them. We lost by even more than in the first match.

So Dutch youth football isn't all it's cracked up to be. They play in a very rigid 4-3-3 system and are unable to play in any other way. Roy Keane had them sussed out in Amsterdam. I remember that match in the Arena very well. The Dutch are unable to play the ball over the top (as kids they never learned that) and like to build up from the back. So for the whole match Roy Keane and Kinsella were choking them, playing far up the midfield and crowding out the Dutch play and intercepting passes. Look at the positional genius of an injured Roy Keane here, from 2:00 onwards. The Dutch try to play the ball out twice and Roy Keane intercepts both times. McAteer scores in the end.

I guess my conclusion is that Holland and Spain aren't the holy land. There are many different ways to play football, and kids should be taught them all. That makes them appreciate all the game has to offer and be more flexible players. But at young ages, age 8-14, the most important thing is to learn to control the ball and the basics of teamwork: passing and covering for each other. Nothing else really.

[mark12345]

Just saw this Mark which reminded me of your post...very interesting read about our coaching mentality which we've talked about here before.

http://theleagueofirelandblog.blogsp...column_18.html

Thanks Stu. Yeah Gary Dempsey is spot on. Pity the powers that be wouldn't read his blog and take it to heart. I suspected the mentatlity was still the same in Ireland and Gary's blog just proves it.

[Charlie Darwin]

Was just watching that junior football doc on Setanta and the Home Farm coach epitomised many of the bad qualities Dempsey talks about - i.e. win at all costs, make it difficult for them, etc. It's dispiriting.

On the other hand, when I was a wee lad south Dublin football changed from full-size pitches to small pitches/goals, so I went from big goals at under-7s to little goals at under-8s. We hated it at the time but I can see why it made perfect sense, although I despair that the powers-that-be only did it because it meant we were better able to run around on the smaller pitch.

[squareball]

8-14 years olds should only play in small pitches to learn the basics of good touch, positioning and short passing. They will have a better understanding on how to create space control a ball and protect it better when they graduate onto a bigger pitch. If kids have these skills perfected it will get them a long way. They will be playing on full sized pitches for the rest of their lives so will have plenty time to learn long passing.

[Charlie Darwin]

8-14 years olds should only play in small pitches to learn the basics of good touch, positioning and short passing. They will have a better understanding on how to create space control a ball and protect it better when they graduate onto a bigger pitch. If kids have these skills perfected it will get them a long way. They will be playing on full sized pitches for the rest of their lives so will have plenty time to learn long passing.

Well I think the point is that your limbs are smaller so a long pass is greatly reduced to begin with. I can understand the corollary though - we were itching to get onto the full-sized pitches and every season we'd hear we had to endure another year of small goals. We all envied the lads who were good enough to move to the DDSL and play in big goals.

[kennedmc]

The 64,000 dollar question right there. I've been banging away on this drum for years on this messageboard and no one wants to take up the debate with any sort of conviction. The issue is, as you quite astutely point out, the lack of technical ability of our youngsters. How do we improve it? My suggestion is that the FAI hire a few good South American youth coaches and let them work with the pick of Irish talent. Give the coaches a five or six year contract. Far better investment than spending telephone numbers on Trap.

Yeah good point. Actually I often dreamt that if I was a multi millionaire I'd bankroll for example 10 junior Spanish coaches to travel around the country and train our coaches purely on developing player technique. They in turn would pass this on to teams they coach between 8-12 year olds.

Unfortunately I'm not a rich man!

[BonnieShels]

Yeah good point. Actually I often dreamt that if I was a multi millionaire I'd bankroll for example 10 junior Spanish coaches to travel around the country and train our coaches purely on developing player technique. They in turn would pass this on to teams they coach between 8-12 year olds.

Unfortunately I'm not a rich man!

Funny, I have had similar thoughts if I won the Euromillions. Sigh.

I'd also become the new Ollie at Shels.

[geysir]

A bonn again Ollie?

[BonnieShels]

A bonn again Ollie?

Damn straight. I look forward to medal-ling in their affairs.

[paul_oshea]

OllieShels
BonnieShels

Funny, I've often had the same thoughts.

Hopefully skstu has too, cos in a few years he will be able afford it!

[BonnieShels]

OllieShels
BonnieShels

Funny, I've often had the same thoughts.

Hopefully skstu has too, cos in a few years he will be able afford it!

But what club would you pick? You don't have a local club etc. Har dee har har.

[paul_oshea]

I could transform a junior club into a Senior League or Intermediate side, and then buy our way into the LOI.

But i meant more so about coaches, i would also buy a whole load of south americans and arrange visas, and disperse them to clubs like Athlone and Sligo and Longford, and only allow them sign if they bring over their sisters.

[BonnieShels]

I could transform a junior club into a Senior League or Intermediate side, and then buy our way into the LOI.

But i meant more so about coaches, i would also buy a whole load of south americans and arrange visas, and disperse them to clubs like Athlone and Sligo and Longford, and only allow them sign if they bring over their sisters.

I know you did. We could yet arrange a Termonbarry Superleague between us all.

I very much like the second part of your plan.

[SkStu]

Hopefully skstu has too, cos in a few years he will be able afford it!

I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books, and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.

[ifk101]

http://www.herald.ie/sport/soccer/co...-29083878.html

[nigel-harps1954]

I've been told his attitude stinks. He went training with Harps, snubbed the offer of more training. Then Harps turned him down when he wanted to come back.
According to Declan McIntyre, Coll is not quite as good as people make him out to be. After working with him at international level, supposedly Shaun Patton of Harps under 19 team is twice the goalkeeper of him.

Happy enough with that to be honest. He'll only be playing Ulster Senior League with Derry this season anyway. 3rd choice keeper for the first team.