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Thread: Citizenship Referendum

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    Seasoned Pro brendy_éire's Avatar
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    Citizenship Referendum

    Great! Another one! Sure aren't they hard to beat, every politican loves a good oul vote.

    This one's on whether children born in Ireland are automatically entitled to Irish citizenship. I reckon Brussels might have something to do with this one. They're probably not happy that anyone born in Ireland can simply claim Irish citizenship, thus EU citizenship. The amendment will also get rid of the whole 'payment for passports' craic, of getting a passport for investing in the country.

    What's everyone's opinion on this? I'm all for it. Our immigration system needs tidying up. We're the only state in the EU to give automatic citizenship to children born in Ireland. It makes us look like a soft target for economic migrants. Hopefully the referendum will sort that out.

    (could this be made into a poll?)
    Have you ever won the treble?

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    Director dahamsta's Avatar
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    Sure and begorrah if Bertie doesn't like de result he gets, we can always have anudder one.

    Spell out a poll and I'll merge one in.

    adam

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    Seasoned Pro brendy_éire's Avatar
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    Originally posted by dahamsta
    Spell out a poll and I'll merge one in.
    Poll: Do you agree with the Government's proposed constitutional amendment allowing the right to citizenship to be decided by legislation?
    Answer: Yes. No.
    Have you ever won the treble?

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    I'm all against it.

    Apart from being discriminatory, it's not a great idea economically. Refugees moving to Ireland from outside the EU- whether they move for economic or political reasons or some combination of both- have made an effort and taken risks to be there. They're much more likely to stay than someone from Britain, Spain or America I would guess. Their enterprise and their children's are worth having.
    Last edited by Duncan Gardner; 10/03/2004 at 6:28 PM.
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    Director dahamsta's Avatar
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    Too long brandy_eire. Tighten it up a bit if you can.

    Personally speaking I wouldn't let the current Government decide what toilet paper to use.

    adam

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    Seasoned Pro brendy_éire's Avatar
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    Originally posted by dahamsta
    Too long brandy_eire. Tighten it up a bit if you can.

    Personally speaking I wouldn't let the current Government decide what toilet paper to use.

    adam
    Do you agree with the Government's proposed constitutional amendment?
    Have you ever won the treble?

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    Thank god its going to a referendum and they're not allowing that shower in leinster house to decide it. I don't see any reason why we should deny citizenship to people born on this island- imagine what would happen if Britain or the US or Australia decided to withdraw that right and send all the Irish back from those countries, in the 50's 60's 70's or 80's? this country would have gone even further down the tubes.

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    Godless Commie Scum
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    Originally posted by Éanna
    I don't see any reason why we should deny citizenship to people born on this island- imagine what would happen if Britain or the US or Australia decided to withdraw that right and send all the Irish back from those countries, in the 50's 60's 70's or 80's? this country would have gone even further down the tubes.
    I don't think they ever conferred that right to be able to withdraw it. Certainly in Britains case anyway. As it is now, a kid born in the North has automatic right to Irish citizenship, but not UK citizenship. Whatever about the US and Oz, we're the only European country that has no residency period tied in with citizenship.
    If you attack me with stupidity, I'll be forced to defend myself with sarcasm.

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    We are the only country in the EU who allow Citizenship on birth. It was on Morning Ireland that a significant number of non-Eu nationals come to Ireland to have their children and then go to another EU country, seeing as the child is now an EU citizen.

    Dont really see how it effects us that much. The effect is being felt more in places like the Uk. Perhaps the rest of the EU are leaning on Bertie.
    Oh no not them again

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    people who are born in Ireland are entitled to Irish citizenship in my view.


    Immigration into a country makes the recieving country richer not poorer egs Britain, usa, australia. those who are old, sick or have large families dont tend to move.


    It makes more sense to me to deny citizenship to those who are born outside of ireland to irish citizens. c'mon is tony cascarino really irish?

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    Originally posted by eoinh
    c'mon is tony cascarino really irish?
    course he woz mate.

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    IMO, if you are born somewhere in the world, you should be alowd be a national of that country. Now, whether your parents should be alowd become a citizen of that country is another question (Id lean towards no).

    The Poll: Should children born in Ireland automatically be given citizenship here?
    As I say, we're just young & a bit nieve.

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    I seem to remember a discussion on here a few days ago discussing if the Irish are racist or not.

    Surely the introduction of such a referendum is just another example of the growing hostility of people on this island towards non-nationals.

    Given the fact that the supreme court has already declared that the parents of a child born in Ireland do not get the right to reside here, I see no need to introduce such a change in our citizenship laws.

    In summary, I'd vote no.



    Then again, I'll oppose any amendment this governemet puts forward after the disgraceful way in which they ignored the democratic result from the initial Nice referendum.

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    Originally posted by liamon
    Surely the introduction of such a referendum is just another example of the growing hostility of people on this island towards non-nationals.
    If you substitute "government" or "facist minister for justice going unchecked" for "people" I'd say you're spot on. Its not so much the question thats being raised, as how its being raised and when that disturbs me. Pat Rabbitte is right (rare enough you'll hear me say that) McDowell is trying to make race and election issue. The guy is a bigger threat to Irish democracy than the IRA as far as I'm concerned.

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    Originally posted by Conor74
    McDowell wrote an article in the Sunday Business Post as long ago as 2002 pointing out that the outcome of the Supreme Court case could well necessitate a referendum on the issue of citizenship.
    Well if he thought of it 2 years ago, why hasn't he done anything about it?!

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    Conor,
    Leaving aside your atavistic attitude to him, Pat Rabbitte is 100% correct. There is NO other reason for bringing this issue up at this time, except for electoral reasons, and to win the votes of the vast amount of people in this country who cannot tolerate people from Africa and Eastern Europe living in this country.
    There are no economic, security or EU considerations or reasons for this.
    McDowell has been in Government and been the AG for a good few years now. He has been in a position to do something about this for a year or more. As regards writing in the Sunday papers,
    this is the same guy who wrote an article about the shame he felt at looking at immigrants queueing in the rain, and how SOMETHING must be done.
    Himself and that other total waste of space, Harney, are great for talking about things, getting their "views" in the papers, but they DO NOTHING except push their own extreme agenda.
    In a few short years they have, ably abetted by McCreevy and Ahern, destroyed what ever was left of a society in this country, and turned us into an economy where nothing matters except money, image and the individual.
    Give me ONE reason why a Constitutional amendment must take place now.

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    Seriously Conor, has the current FF led government ever made any mistaks in your opinion?
    You defend every single decision they make and tow the party line. Can you not step outside your political affiliations for just a few minutes and consider alternate viewpoints?

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    My thoughts are that we must tighten up these laws, they were originally there to protect the child to ensure a family unit, which is for the child’s benefit, the idea was people only had children because they wanted children. I ask how can you protect the child when it is their parents that are using them as a pawn for the movement through the country where every other adult has to apply for a visa if a non eu applicant. They are creating a child to force an issue. Not all are but enough to create this problem.

    To create a child to use as a means to and end is what is wrong, it is being abused I feel is being tightened up. We live in a world where our ideal is being exploited, it was there with good intention but it is now being abused, a child should not be the pawn here. If you take that away then they won't be having children so as to remain here.

    What is being proposed and I am open to correction on this is, if the child is born to people with the right to be in Ireland the will be able to claim citizenship until they are 18 and then they will be entitled to apply for full citizen ship.
    It's only just begun...............
    If the last 21 years were class, here's looking forward to the next 21 years. It is our time

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    Is there any proposal where we could withdraw citizenship from some irish people?

    http://www.forastrust.ie/

    Bring back Rocketman!

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    Originally posted by pete
    Is there any proposal where we could withdraw citizenship from some irish people?

    starting with "tom the gom"

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