Norn Iron rubbish part 23452346526

**bwagner** · 07/12/2009, 2:04 PM

Can anyone answer my question ? without having a cheap shot like Not Brazil

**Gather round** · 07/12/2009, 2:09 PM

Originally Posted by bwagner

Can anyone answer my question ? without having a cheap shot like Not Brazil

Do you mean 'are these players Roman Catholics'? If so, I think the ones you mentioned are/ were. Maybe others too. Who cares?

**ArdeeBhoy** · 07/12/2009, 2:14 PM

Originally Posted by osarusan

Yes, unlike the current situation where everybody has a national team which they can feel is representative of them.

The merger would undoubtedly leave a sizeable number of NI citizens without any team which they feel represents them. You, apparently, have no problem with that.

Of course they do. Not.

And as if the current situation is any different to what you suggest.

**bwagner** · 07/12/2009, 2:15 PM

I care hence why im asking, right

**Gather round** · 07/12/2009, 2:18 PM

B Wagner- sorry, didn't mean that to sound so abrupt. I don't care and none of my friends who support NI care either, so I suppose we just get a bit surprised when other people who don't support the team care.

**Not Brazil** · 07/12/2009, 2:19 PM

Originally Posted by bwagner

I care hence why im asking, right

But why do you care where footballers say their prayers, or if they even bother with that malarky at all?

**Gather round** · 07/12/2009, 2:21 PM

Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Of course they do. Not

(I know I'm wasting my time but) any chance of you explaining that, AB? Osarusan's point was perfectly straightforward. Football fans in Ireland can support whichever team they prefer at present. With your preferred alternative, many wouldn't be able to.

**bwagner** · 07/12/2009, 2:27 PM

jesus lads its just a question :O)
I have mixed parents so it just interests me as im not from the area (and dont fully understand). I never go to mass.

I think its great to see mixed players and i wear my Norn Iron 82 jersey in Dundalk dispite the abuse :O)

**Gather round** · 07/12/2009, 2:31 PM

Good man, sorry about the abuse. Maybe you should shop in Newry instead

**janeymac** · 07/12/2009, 2:34 PM

Originally Posted by Gather round

You're either looking at the wrong statistics, or misinterpreting them. In the last NI Assembly election in 2007 (past electoral behavior being the best, if hardly a 100% reliable indicator of future voting intention), nationalist parties got 42% of the vote. That's a long way behind the 58% who vote non-nationalist. You'd have to rely on some combination of

I thought it was a referendum that would decide the future of Northern Ireland - and if that is the case the breakdown of nationalist / unionist seats in Stormont would not be an indicator as to how the vote would turn out. For instance, Sinn Fein lost seats in the Dail last time around, but actually increased its overall vote.

If you want to look at it by seat percentages - aren't most the councils now controlled by nationalists at the moment?

Anyway, the way things are (not) going anywhere fast, will Stormont survive? Westminster mightn't be as tolerant with the cash to support a football team when they know their good pals down in Dublin could save them a few bob, just like we do with the rugby.

**Not Brazil** · 07/12/2009, 2:40 PM

Originally Posted by bwagner

jesus lads its just a question :O)
I have mixed parents so it just interests me as im not from the area (and dont fully understand). I never go to mass.

I think its great to see mixed players and i wear my Norn Iron 82 jersey in Dundalk dispite the abuse :O)

Strange that people who would wish to be "united" with the Northern Ireland team and it's supporters would abuse you for having the temerity to wear a Northern Ireland shirt.

Fair play to you for wearing it.

Genuinely not sure where some of the players say their prayers, but I think Damien Johnson is from a Catholic background - although, having sat beside him on a flight home from the West Indies tour, I would also be pretty certain that he isn't overly religious at all.

There are numerous kids from a Catholic background in the underage teams - so I'm told. I really couldn't give a flying one about that though.

**Gather round** · 07/12/2009, 2:44 PM

Originally Posted by janeymac

I thought it was a referendum that would decide the future of Northern Ireland

It could be, but if nationalists got a majority in an Assembly, Westminster or Euro election, that would maybe trigger a referendum. Maybe if the majority was big enough, the Brits and Unionists would just give up immediately and get on the first plane/ boat out

and if that is the case the breakdown of nationalist / unionist seats in Stormont would not be an indicator as to how the vote would turn out

I didn't mention the breakdown of seats, merely that nationalists only got 42% of the vote. That's not going to change to 51% + in a referndum any time soon.

For instance, Sinn Fein lost seats in the Dail last time around, but actually increased its overall vote

Interesting in itself (I assume much of the increase was in Dublin and other cities where the quota to get elected is higher than in rural seats).

But not really relevant to a border poll for NI.

If you want to look at it by seat percentages - aren't most the councils now controlled by nationalists at the moment?

Many are, but that doesn't change the reality of 42% losing out to 58%. Ballycastle and Magherafelt councils may outnumber Bangor's, but since the latter's population is about twice the other two combined, it's not really that significant.

Westminster mightn't be as tolerant with the cash to support a football team when they know their good pals down in Dublin could save them a few bob, just like we do with the rugby

Aye, that's right. The cost saving on the IFA is a top priority for Gordon Brown.

**janeymac** · 07/12/2009, 2:44 PM

Originally Posted by Not Brazil

Not sure about the Republic's fanbase, but the vast majority of Northern Ireland fans I know aren't regular worshipers - in fact, a lot of them are atheists.

Nothing whatsoever to do with how often you attend church/chapel but what religion you were brought up in does have a bearing. For instance, the north of Germany would be culturally protestant, the Bavaria/south catholic and France would be culturally catholic. England would be culturally protestant, Ireland culturally catholic. Northern Ireland is culturally both - and the easiest way of describing these different cultures is to do so by religion.

So, enough of this nonsense about whether you go to church or not as it is irrelevant.

**Not Brazil** · 07/12/2009, 2:50 PM

Originally Posted by janeymac

Nothing whatsoever to do with how often you attend church/chapel but what religion you were brought up in does have a bearing. For instance, the north of Germany would be culturally protestant, the Bavaria/south catholic and France would be culturally catholic. England would be culturally protestant, Ireland culturally catholic. Northern Ireland is culturally both - and the easiest way of describing these different cultures is to do so by religion.

So, enough of this nonsense about whether you go to church or not being irrelevant.

Well, it's not for me to tell you if it's relevant to you or not.

It's not relevant to me, whatsoever.

I think the problems in Northern Ireland centre on nationality, and national identity. You may hold a different opinion. That's fine.

The "easiest way" isn't always the correct way.

I have absolutely no beef whatsoever with where anyone chooses to say their prayers.

**Gather round** · 07/12/2009, 2:52 PM

Originally Posted by janeymac

Nothing whatsoever to do with how often you attend church/chapel but what religion you were brought up in does have a bearing. For instance, the north of Germany would be culturally protestant, the Bavaria/south catholic and France would be culturally catholic. England would be culturally protestant, Ireland culturally catholic. Northern Ireland is culturally both - and the easiest way of describing these different cultures is to do so by religion

I lived in Germany (fairly equidistant between north and south) for only six months as a student in the 80s, Herr/ Frau Janeymac may have much more experience of the country. I've also visited Berlin, Hamburg, Cologne and Munich (the four largest German cities), some many times. I never really felt the country's culture was particularly religious at all, or had any sense it changed broadly from one part of the country.

So, enough of this nonsense about whether you go to church or not being irrelevant

It's irrelevant to NB, me, and most of the NI fans we know. If it's relevant to you, fine, but I suspect we're a bit more representative of NI fans than you are.

**bwagner** · 07/12/2009, 2:55 PM

Originally Posted by Gather round

Good man, sorry about the abuse. Maybe you should shop in Newry instead

No way mate Newry has been over run by the dubs hehe.
They have ruined it with all the traffic.

But back to subject - I am excited about the up coming youth from both teams.

I think the reason I was asking is because if we were more aware that their are catholic players in the northern team - more southerns would sopport the team. As it is a team for all backgrounds.

**janeymac** · 07/12/2009, 2:57 PM

Originally Posted by Not Brazil

Well, it's not for me to tell you if it's relevant to you or not.

It's not relevant to me, whatsoever.

I think the problems in Northern Ireland centre on nationality, and national identity. You may hold a different opinion. That's fine.

The "easiest way" isn't always the correct way.

I have absolutely no beef whatsoever with where anyone chooses to say their prayers.

I agree with you about the identity of Northern Ireland / unionists. I don't think that is a problem though for NI nationalists. They know who they are.

But its not about saying prayers! Its how you behave. For instance protestant culture would be to shut down on a Sunday and not play games etc. whereas that would not be in the catholic psychic who would regard sport as being a celebration of life.

**third policeman** · 07/12/2009, 3:02 PM

Originally Posted by osarusan

By merging the FAI and IFA and having one team, you'd be creating another international team where a sizeable proportion of the population purportedly represented by the team don't actually support it.

Maybe, but we dont have any data on that do we. That's why in an earlier post I suggested that the issue of merger should be the subject of proper consultation in both jurisdictions. If a merged football team did not succeed in commanding broad support then, I agree, from my perspective it would not be a sensible way forward. This is not a scientific poll, but interestingly none of my Unionist friends and relations in the North would have any problem supporting a merged football team, in the same way that they support the Ireland Rugby and cricket teams

**janeymac** · 07/12/2009, 3:05 PM

Originally Posted by Gather round

I lived in Germany (fairly equidistant between north and south) for only six months as a student in the 80s, Herr/ Frau Janeymac may have much more experience of the country. I've also visited Berlin, Hamburg, Cologne and Munich (the four largest German cities), some many times. I never really felt the country's culture was particularly religious at all, or had any sense it changed broadly from one part of the country.

Nothing got to do with church going. Did you not notice that the southern German's were much better crack? I think its something to do with knowing if we confess we will be forgiven for our sins.

It's irrelevant to NB, me, and most of the NI fans we know. If it's relevant to you, fine, but I suspect we're a bit more representative of NI fans than you are.

Being culturally a catholic, I wouldn't be representative of NI fans whatsoever probably!

**jinxy lilywhite** · 07/12/2009, 3:06 PM

Originally Posted by bwagner

jesus lads its just a question :O)
I have mixed parents so it just interests me as im not from the area (and dont fully understand). I never go to mass.

I think its great to see mixed players and i wear my Norn Iron 82 jersey in Dundalk dispite the abuse :O)

what abuse?????

not saying it doesn't happen but just asking. also don't let the b*stards get you down.

Man I hate religion