Norn Iron rubbish part 23452346526

[Shilts]

Except for Bosnia and Herzagovina or Trinidad and Tobago???

[Fixer82]

if the argument is on anthem alone then the teams/associations will be merged much sooner than I thought.

Look at how it's done in rugby. I personally despise Ireland's Call, but if that's what it takes to have the 6 counties players join our rank then make it so....

Everything is cross-border now. I reckon the football teams will probably be among the last things to be cross-border. But I think it will happen.
I'm with George Best. Unite the teams!

FIFA I think would look at each case individually. In much the same way they dealt with Darron Gibson etc. specific case...

[Not Brazil]

if the argument is on anthem alone then the teams/associations will be merged much sooner than I thought.

Look at how it's done in rugby. I personally despise Ireland's Call, but if that's what it takes to have the 6 counties players join our rank then make it so....

It's not about the Anthem.

The IFA will not be giving up it's autonomy.

People need to accept that fact, and move on.

Some "6 Counties" players will choose to play for the ROI - others (the vast majority) are proud to wear the Nortrhern Ireland shirt.

You have your "All Ireland" team. Leave us who want nothing to do with it to get on with supporting our team.

[Gather round]

if the argument is on anthem alone then the teams/associations will be merged much sooner than I thought

It isn't. Read (any random page of) the thread.

Look at how it's done in rugby. I personally despise Ireland's Call, but if that's what it takes to have the 6 counties players join our rank then make it so....

It isn't. NI-based based players and fans supported the team for decades before the IRFU belatedly became (slightly) more welcoming to them.

Everything is cross-border now. I reckon the football teams will probably be among the last things to be cross-border. But I think it will happen.

It isn't and they won't. Two different countries, we're not interested .

FIFA I think would look at each case individually. In much the same way they dealt with Darron Gibson etc. specific case...

The specific case is that Northern Ireland fans don't want to merge with your football team, so it isn't going to happen. FIFA aren't and won't be interested.

[Fixer82]

Well there's a surprise. Two Ulster men saying NO! NO! NO!

[Gather round]

Go away and stop stirring, you numbskull.

[kingdomkerry]

Id love to see it happen. However NI fans are of a unionist nature. Unionists are sectarian. Therefore NI fans are sectarian. Their fans are against it for bigoted reasons. Im sure i'll get challanged over this but its the truth.

[Gather round]

However NI fans are of a unionist nature

Not all of them.

Unionists are sectarian

Only some of them.

Therefore NI fans are sectarian

That's illogical captain.

Their fans are against it for bigoted reasons

Most reasonable people would agree that those trying to close down another team against its fans' wishes are the real bigots.

Im sure i'll get challanged over this but its the truth

It isn't. Go away and stop stirring.

[Not Brazil]

Id love to see it happen. However NI fans are of a unionist nature. Unionists are sectarian. Therefore NI fans are sectarian. Their fans are against it for bigoted reasons. Im sure i'll get challanged over this but its the truth.

I'm sure all rational poster on this site - the vast majority - will agree that your comments say more about your mindset, than that of any "Unionist".

Get it into your skull - we do not wish to see our team gobbled up by ANYONE - be that into an All Ireland set up, or, All UK set -up.

To throw around lazy, broadbrushed, labels, insinuating NI fans are all sectarian, is, frankly, pathetic.

I don't care where you, or anyone else for that matter, (least of all Northern Ireland players) say their prayers.

[O'Shea's Boot]

Id love to see it happen. However NI fans are of a unionist nature. Unionists are sectarian. Therefore NI fans are sectarian. Their fans are against it for bigoted reasons. Im sure i'll get challanged over this but its the truth.

Pretty shallow post KK - I have many friends from Northern Ireland who would be Unionists and are not in the least sectarian. All unionist means is they want to maintain the Union between GB/NI .....you and I might not agree (or in my case not very interested) but that doesnt make them sectarian

[third policeman]

Hey GR. You speak with total certainty about what NI fans want and dont want but how do you know? Who asked them and when? It would be really interesting if someone conducted a survey in NI on the issue of a single football team for Ireland. I would not predict the outcome but would not be totally surprised if the result was in favour. But I asume GR that you would not accept the legitimacy of this as it would not be restricted to "proper NI supporters" - ie the people who are by conviction already opposed to it.

Football is now nearly unique in being the only significant support where people from both parts of Ireland dont compete as part of the same team. The result is that we dont qualify for major tournaments and that (as this dabate sadly illustrates) the game is tainted by sectarian sentiment and ludicrous anachronistic hostility! Speaking as someone who has "mixed-heritage" and affinity with both teams, it is a total no brainer!

[jinxy lilywhite]

Id love to see it happen. However NI fans are of a unionist nature. Unionists are sectarian. Therefore NI fans are sectarian. Their fans are against it for bigoted reasons. Im sure i'll get challanged over this but its the truth.

Oh my word that is an unbelievable statement and it is very untrue and very harsh. I think I would be safe to say that you have never been to Northern Ireland or 6 counties depending on your take. Some of the bigoted crap get thrown out at the old landsdowne when rangers players play for opposing countries. Also as well who said that to be Irish you have to support a foreign british club like celtic.
I'd say I have been to NI at least 5 or 10 times every year in my 30 years on earth, and not just in Catholic areas but in some unionist areas. I have only ever got verbally abused once. Now once for me is enough but there is no way I could tarnish their whole population with the bigots and bible bashers. You must remember in NI that the minority seem to be able to voice their views as the majority.

Back to topic: As a southerner I don't want to see an All Ireland team or even an All Ireland league. Fcuk that I like having the border and no matter how some of you see, there are differences between both communities on the island. Some major and some subtle but there are differences. I am proud to be irish as are many unionist of their own heritage but an AIL or an All Ireland team makes a mockery of national rivalry in general. and btw England, Scotland and Wales would have a better case for a United Kingdom team rather than an All Ireland side

[Gather round]

Hey GR. You speak with total certainty about what NI fans want and dont want but how do you know?

Afternoon TP. I've repeated it (by necessity) many times on the thread. NI fans want there to be a NI team, by definition. What the stirrers on this thread are suggesting would see an effective end to that team.

Who asked them and when? It would be really interesting if someone conducted a survey in NI on the issue of a single football team for Ireland

Their affiliation is self-evident, as I explained. As for a poll, I also asked specifically above (I think in reply to the Fly) whether there had been one. I don't share your interest in organising such a poll, but I'll certainly read it if and when it appears.

I would not predict the outcome but would not be totally surprised if the result was in favour. But I asume GR that you would not accept the legitimacy of this as it would not be restricted to "proper NI supporters" - ie the people who are by conviction already opposed to it

You assume wrongly, it's a free country and anyone can organise any public opinion survey they like. Of course such a hypothetical result would be surprising and a bit embarrassing, but to me it would be otherwise irrelevant rather than illegitimate. NI has a team, its fans want that team to continue, RoI fans in NI (like those in Glasgow, Preston or Mansfield) can already support and play for their own team. What's not to like?

Football is now nearly unique in being the only significant support where people from both parts of Ireland dont compete as part of the same team

Yes, so what?

Actually, not invariably so what. Ireland's two best cricketers play for England, its second best golfer wants to represent Britain in the Olympics, as did many other NI competitors in Beijing. Etc. etc.

The result is that we dont qualify for major tournaments

Ha ha. We don't qualify regularly and separately for major tournaments because we

a) don't have a huge pool of potential players to compete with the big five or six

b) continue to drop points to other similarly-sized and ranked teams

c) regularly get embarrassed by the minnows.

I honestly can't see any of that changing just because you have a 6 million population to choose from rather than 4.5 million (which comparison is spurious anyway, given your choice of qualified players from outside Ireland now and for years past.

and that (as this dabate sadly illustrates) the game is tainted by sectarian sentiment and ludicrous anachronistic hostility!

Look, I'd prefer if the sh*t stirrers on this thread weren't being so sectarian, ludicrouys and anachronistic, but they are. So they're getting answered in turn.

Speaking as someone who has "mixed-heritage" and affinity with both teams, it is a total no brainer!

If you want to support both teams, that's great. I don't, but I don't want to abolish yours. I'm sure it'll challenge strongly for a play-off place in Euro 2012.

[Not Brazil]

Hey GR. You speak with total certainty about what NI fans want and dont want but how do you know? Who asked them and when? It would be really interesting if someone conducted a survey in NI on the issue of a single football team for Ireland. I would not predict the outcome but would not be totally surprised if the result was in favour. But I asume GR that you would not accept the legitimacy of this as it would not be restricted to "proper NI supporters" - ie the people who are by conviction already opposed to it.

Players born in Northern Ireland have the right to play for either the ROI or Northern Ireland.

You wish to deny choice, by seeing the fourth oldest Association in world football just throw in the towel.

Sorry - but that isn't happening.

[Fixer82]

there are differences between both communities on the island. Some major and some subtle but there are differences. I am proud to be irish as are many unionist of their own heritage but an AIL or an All Ireland team makes a mockery of national rivalry in general. and btw England, Scotland and Wales would have a better case for a United Kingdom team rather than an All Ireland side

there's also huge differences between someone from Dublin and someone from Connemara but we're still Irish and of this island.

why would England, Scotland, Wales have a better case for a UK team? what ya basing that on?? You are reinforcing the border by not wanting to have anything to do with the northern part of the island. what about people who've spent a lot of time in the north as kids? or all the people in the north who support the republic?

ps KingdomKerry your comments are ill-judged and ill-informed and should be ignored. To say all Unionists are bigoted is just plain silly!!!

[Not Brazil]

why would England, Scotland, Wales have a better case for a UK team? what ya basing that on??

The people of the United Kingdom share a common, singular, Citizenship.

The four "home" countries exist as seperate entities, footballing wise, by dispensation from FIFA.

Some big wigs at FIFA already want to impose a singular UK team - that will be robustly resisted by Northern Ireland fans (and I expect by fans of the other "home" countries too)

[Not Brazil]

what about people who've spent a lot of time in the north as kids? or all the people in the north who support the republic?

What about them?

If they choose to support the Republic, that's fine.

The thing is, you can support who you like.

When people start want to deny choice - some of whom were most vociferous in the "right to choose" debates that surrounded the "Eligibility" issue surrounding Northern Irish born players - it stinks of gross hypocricy.

Why does anyone wish to deny Northern Ireland fans the right to support our International team...about which we are as proud and attached as you are of yours?

[Fixer82]

Some big wigs at FIFA already want to impose a singular UK team - that will be robustly resisted by Northern Ireland fans (and I expect by fans of the other "home" countries too)

yes but do you really think it's plausible or has a chance of happening?
I wouldnt have thought so.

I dunno, I'd like to see it happening and I think it makes sense, as would I like to see a United Ireland. But if it doesn't ever happen, I'd like to think the fans would have a better relationship with each other in the future. The fact that there are northern Ireland fans on this forum is a good sign of that I suppose

[jinxy lilywhite]

there's also huge differences between someone from Dublin and someone from Connemara but we're still Irish and of this island.

why would England, Scotland, Wales have a better case for a UK team? what ya basing that on?? You are reinforcing the border by not wanting to have anything to do with the northern part of the island. what about people who've spent a lot of time in the north as kids? or all the people in the north who support the republic?

ps KingdomKerry your comments are ill-judged and ill-informed and should be ignored. To say all Unionists are bigoted is just plain silly!!!

There are differences between dubs and folks from Connemara but Connemara folk haven't been living indepent of Dublin for 88 years.

I am reinforcing the border because it is there. There is a border on this island and it has been in place since the inception of this state. Like it or not that is the way it is and it isn't going to change for any time soon.
I do not want to ignore Northern Ireland but they want the same right to self determination as our grandfathers did in 1916 to 1922 (even if it is their national football team) and if that is the express wish of their people then we can't coerce them to do so. We can't say here that we want a united national team and not consult those whose team/players we want to use.

I based the england, scotland, wales, united kingdom team as it is literally one country. since devolution they all have parliaments/assemblies but power is with westminster in London and England, Scotland & Wales don't sit separately in the UN

[Not Brazil]

yes but do you really think it's plausible or has a chance of happening?
I wouldnt have thought so.

The "All UK" team thing keeps rearing it's ugly head at FIFA - I, too, don't think it will happen though.