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Thread: Paddy McCourt

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flexy View Post
    Nigel Worthington is an idiot!!!!!!!!! again he over looks McCourt in the N Ireland squad, I look at some of the players in that squad and wonder what he sees in some of the players hes picked. No wonder Northern Ireland has lost players to the Republic with his mindless attitude. Milk Cup 2 yrs ago James McLean played great at the Milk Cup, on that team were Corey Evans Wipeee Cathgart and Josh Mcguines they have all represented Nireland now because McLean is playing in LOI he wont have a look at it him. Is it getting to the stage that he will only call protestant players into his team or at least have a look. Remember he took a few Irish league players away in the summer did he look at the LOI no enough said
    It is a matter of opinion whether McCourt merits a place on footballing grounds in the NI squad or not.

    However, your clear assertion that NW is ignoring McCourt due to anti-Catholic prejudice, or is anti-LOI, is disgraceful, false, ignorant and almost certainly actionable.

    In fact, it's so much so that it's difficult to know where to start, such is the amount of bile, misinformation and downright lies you've crammed into your post.

    You refer to NW losing players to the ROI. Maybe so, but it's hardly down to his personal approach; on the contrary, it was he who persuaded Tony Kane and Michael O'Connor to return to NI (both Catholics, btw). Moreover, he has included Kane in his senior squad and awarded O'Connor all his 9 NI caps. Further, NW's latest young protege is Jonny Gorman, whom he persuaded to switch to NI from the ROI! (And seeing as Gorman qualified for the ROI via ancestry, his background may well be Catholic/Nationalist, not that anyone cares)

    Now let's take James McClean (or ""McLean" as you insist on calling him) specifically. McClean has never played outside Derry City, yet NI picked him for their U-21's, when players with English/Scottish clubs etc were overlooked. Indeed, he was selected by Steve Beaglehole, appointed to the NI set-up by Nigel Worthington, who relies very heavily on his judgement.
    You complain that fellow Milk Cup players have been capped before him. Let's make the comparison. Corry (not "Corey") Evans is Captain of MU Reserves and whilst that does not equate to their "second" team, it denotes a hell of a sight more potential than McClean. Moreover, he has been given a 1st team Squad Number, went on their pre-season tour to the USA (and played) and has been on the bench a couple of times in the EPL. Moreover, he can play several positions in defence or midfield. He is also a year younger than McClean.
    As for Craig Cathcart, he has played a season and a half on loan in the Championship (Plymouth and Watford), before signing this season for Blackpool in the EPL, where he has played all their games to date. Despite that, he has yet to make his International debut, so you haven't even got that right.
    And as for Josh Magennis (not "McGuines"), he has just signed for Aberdeen, where he has started the season in their 1st team. This follows on from having played a handful of games for Cardiff whilst still a teenager. He, too, is a year younger than McClean. As for his two NI caps, both of these were gained on a US Tour where, for contractual reasons, they were billed as "A" Internationals. NW, however, described it as a "development tour". Moreover, although I care not a jot otherwise, I suspect Magennis may actually be Catholic, considering his middle name is Brendan and I've seen him cross himself after scoring (for NI, btw). These are hardly conclusive, but I've never known any Prod called Brendan, nor any to cross himself.

    Next up is your claim that because McClean is playing LOI, NW won't look at him. How do you square that with the fact of NW giving Niall McGinn his international debut whilst still with, ahem, Derry City? Or the fact that he wanted Alan Mannus (LOI) to join the US Tour in preference to Alan Blayney (IL), before Mannus turned him down? The simple fact is, there are only a handful of LOI players who qualify for NI, as opposed to dozens/hundreds in the IL. Also, the USA Tour to which you refer was slap bang in the middle of the LOI season, whereas it was end-of-season for IL players. Moreover, he wouldn't even have taken any of the IL players he did (bar one or two?), had he not suffered well over a dozen withdrawals from players in England/Scotland.

    As for your disgraceful slur that NW is only interested in "Protestant" players, this is utter garbage - and offensive garbage at that. For just looking at the IL players NW has called up and capped alone, these have included nearly as many RC's as Prods eg Marty Donnelly, Rory Patterson and Michael Gault.

    Finally, it was NW who took another look at Paddy McCourt, six years after his debut, during which time he was discarded by McIlroy and ignored by Sanchez (a Catholic former LOI manager btw). Of course, as I have alluded above, it is open to question whether Paddy should be in the present NI squad. But I would point out that the three players who have kept him out of the side in his preferred position were first Keith Gillespie and Damien Johnson (a Catholic, btw), then Niall McGinn of Derry City and Glasgow Celtic, a former GAA=playing Catholic from Donaghmore.

    Of course ignorance of the facts is one thing, but for you to "fill in the gaps" with malicious insinuations and accusations of your own imagination, only betrays who the real bigot is. You ought to be ashamed of yourself, but I don't for one moment believe that that that will even register with you.

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    Talk about making a mountain of a molehill.

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  4. #63
    Like the Fonz. Only a dog. Mr A's Avatar
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    The thing that really depresses me is that people would even know what religion their players were.

    (Not a swipe at EG by the way, just a general comment. NI is what it is.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    It is a matter of opinion whether McCourt merits a place on footballing grounds in the NI squad or not.

    However, your clear assertion that NW is ignoring McCourt due to anti-Catholic prejudice, or is anti-LOI, is disgraceful, false, ignorant and almost certainly actionable.

    In fact, it's so much so that it's difficult to know where to start, such is the amount of bile, misinformation and downright lies you've crammed into your post.

    You refer to NW losing players to the ROI. Maybe so, but it's hardly down to his personal approach; on the contrary, it was he who persuaded Tony Kane and Michael O'Connor to return to NI (both Catholics, btw). Moreover, he has included Kane in his senior squad and awarded O'Connor all his 9 NI caps. Further, NW's latest young protege is Jonny Gorman, whom he persuaded to switch to NI from the ROI! (And seeing as Gorman qualified for the ROI via ancestry, his background may well be Catholic/Nationalist, not that anyone cares)

    Now let's take James McClean (or ""McLean" as you insist on calling him) specifically. McClean has never played outside Derry City, yet NI picked him for their U-21's, when players with English/Scottish clubs etc were overlooked. Indeed, he was selected by Steve Beaglehole, appointed to the NI set-up by Nigel Worthington, who relies very heavily on his judgement.
    You complain that fellow Milk Cup players have been capped before him. Let's make the comparison. Corry (not "Corey") Evans is Captain of MU Reserves and whilst that does not equate to their "second" team, it denotes a hell of a sight more potential than McClean. Moreover, he has been given a 1st team Squad Number, went on their pre-season tour to the USA (and played) and has been on the bench a couple of times in the EPL. Moreover, he can play several positions in defence or midfield. He is also a year younger than McClean.
    As for Craig Cathcart, he has played a season and a half on loan in the Championship (Plymouth and Watford), before signing this season for Blackpool in the EPL, where he has played all their games to date. Despite that, he has yet to make his International debut, so you haven't even got that right.
    And as for Josh Magennis (not "McGuines"), he has just signed for Aberdeen, where he has started the season in their 1st team. This follows on from having played a handful of games for Cardiff whilst still a teenager. He, too, is a year younger than McClean. As for his two NI caps, both of these were gained on a US Tour where, for contractual reasons, they were billed as "A" Internationals. NW, however, described it as a "development tour". Moreover, although I care not a jot otherwise, I suspect Magennis may actually be Catholic, considering his middle name is Brendan and I've seen him cross himself after scoring (for NI, btw). These are hardly conclusive, but I've never known any Prod called Brendan, nor any to cross himself.

    Next up is your claim that because McClean is playing LOI, NW won't look at him. How do you square that with the fact of NW giving Niall McGinn his international debut whilst still with, ahem, Derry City? Or the fact that he wanted Alan Mannus (LOI) to join the US Tour in preference to Alan Blayney (IL), before Mannus turned him down? The simple fact is, there are only a handful of LOI players who qualify for NI, as opposed to dozens/hundreds in the IL. Also, the USA Tour to which you refer was slap bang in the middle of the LOI season, whereas it was end-of-season for IL players. Moreover, he wouldn't even have taken any of the IL players he did (bar one or two?), had he not suffered well over a dozen withdrawals from players in England/Scotland.

    As for your disgraceful slur that NW is only interested in "Protestant" players, this is utter garbage - and offensive garbage at that. For just looking at the IL players NW has called up and capped alone, these have included nearly as many RC's as Prods eg Marty Donnelly, Rory Patterson and Michael Gault.

    Finally, it was NW who took another look at Paddy McCourt, six years after his debut, during which time he was discarded by McIlroy and ignored by Sanchez (a Catholic former LOI manager btw). Of course, as I have alluded above, it is open to question whether Paddy should be in the present NI squad. But I would point out that the three players who have kept him out of the side in his preferred position were first Keith Gillespie and Damien Johnson (a Catholic, btw), then Niall McGinn of Derry City and Glasgow Celtic, a former GAA=playing Catholic from Donaghmore.

    Of course ignorance of the facts is one thing, but for you to "fill in the gaps" with malicious insinuations and accusations of your own imagination, only betrays who the real bigot is. You ought to be ashamed of yourself, but I don't for one moment believe that that that will even register with you.
    .......meanwhile back at the ranch, have we reached the conclusion that Worthington simply doesn't rate McCourt?

    If so, I suppose its better to have an arse elbow disconnect as regards his football knowledge than be a bigot (which only Flexy has alleged and which I certainly don't subscribe to).

    There's a bigger point out there which is why players like McCourt are no longer prized in the game, generally in favour of some honest grafter. Sometime soon someone is going to need to remember that football has entertainment at its heart and that a team of 11 identikit footballers isn't the ultimate aim of a manager.

  6. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy View Post
    Talk about making a mountain of a molehill.
    So not even you can defend Flexy's bigoted rant, therefore you try to minimise its importance...

    You're worse than he is.

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  8. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneRedArmy View Post
    .......meanwhile back at the ranch, have we reached the conclusion that Worthington simply doesn't rate McCourt?

    If so, I suppose its better to have an arse elbow disconnect as regards his football knowledge than be a bigot (which only Flexy has alleged and which I certainly don't subscribe to).

    There's a bigger point out there which is why players like McCourt are no longer prized in the game, generally in favour of some honest grafter. Sometime soon someone is going to need to remember that football has entertainment at its heart and that a team of 11 identikit footballers isn't the ultimate aim of a manager
    http://fourfourtwo.com/blogs/serieaa...on-course.aspx
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...ario-balotelli
    As can be seen from above, Italian football is currently grappling with a problem of racism.
    How would you like it if I came on this site and posted eg a clear accusation that Trappatoni and Tardelli etc were racist, on the basis that they hadn't picked Clinton Morrison, "supported" by a garbled mix of ignorance, distortions and downright lies?
    For to make such a claim would be no more outrageous than to claim that Nigel Worthington must be sectarian etc because he declines to pick Paddy McCourt or James McClean, when anyone who knows anything about the game in NI would know that NW doesn't have a sectarian bone in his body..
    Of course I understand that maybe you are not so outraged as I am that this sort of bile doesn't get Flexy banned etc - after all, it's not your team which he libelled.
    But you must know that Sectarianism has long been the scourge of Ireland, and by extension, Irish football, most especially in NI.
    Moreover, the recent poaching controversy etc risks exacerbating that scourge, at a time when many, many people in NI are working hard to try to eradicate it.
    Therefore when I find my team/manager libelled like that by so loathesome a poster as Flexy, I will challenge it at every turn.
    Otherwise other ignorant/prejudiced/gullible/feeble-minded readers may accord Flexy a degree of credibility which he most certainly does not deserve, thereby leading to the general impression that "nothing has changed at the IFA etc", when it most certainly has.
    Which in turn risks leading to the situation whereby the FAI is seen as the Taig Association in Ireland, with the IFA being the Prod one.
    And if you or other feel that that is some sort of overreaction, then tough titty - if you are not going to challenge overt bigots like Flexy, then you are going to have to put up with me fighting back against them.




    Quote Originally Posted by OneRedArmy View Post
    There's a bigger point out there which is why players like McCourt are no longer prized in the game, generally in favour of some honest grafter. Sometime soon someone is going to need to remember that football has entertainment at its heart and that a team of 11 identikit footballers isn't the ultimate aim of a manager
    Imo you're way behind the times with that question - though perhaps not in the way you intended.

    I remember listeneing to a game on the radio some years back where the commentator observed that "For such a talented footballer, Player X certainly works hard", only to be corrected by the former footballer beside him: "He's such a talented footballer because he works so hard."

    Such is the level of personal fitness in the game presently, plus the tactical sophistication (amongst the top teams, at least), that it doesn't matter how skillful a player, even team, is: if you lose the ball, it could take you ten minutes of chasing after it again, only getting it back when the other team has scored.

    Therefore it is no longer a choice between being either a gifted ball player or a hardworking grafter; if you are not prepared to be both, then you aren't going to be either. (For an example of how a wonderfully entertaining player can also work his socks off, you only need look at the likes of Lionel Messi - often considered the "best" player in the world)

    Which is only what Strachan, Mowbray and Lennon have concluded about McCourt for Celtic* and McIlroy, Sanchez and Worthington have concluded for NI**. Or maybe they're all wrong, too?

    * - Or does anyone think that Celtic are so coming down with skilful ball players that they don't otherwise need McCourt?
    ** - Ditto NI
    Last edited by EalingGreen; 31/08/2010 at 1:12 PM.

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    Seasoned Pro OneRedArmy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    Won't somebody pleeeeeasssseeee think of the children
    On the basis that
    1) I'm not a mod
    2) I clearly stated my disagreement with the allegation in question
    3) The epic levels of guff you've subjected this site to on matters various (subjective assessment I know) rendering me somewhat immune to oververbose hyperbole

    I'll focus on the second bit of your post

    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    Imo you're way behind the times with that question - though perhaps not in the way you intended.

    I remember listeneing to a game on the radio some years back where the commentator observed that "For such a talented footballer, Player X certainly works hard", only to be corrected by the former footballer beside him: "He's such a talented footballer because he works so hard."

    Such is the level of personal fitness in the game presently, plus the tactical sophistication (amongst the top teams, at least), that it doesn't matter how skillful a player, even team, is: if you lose the ball, it could take you ten minutes of chasing after it again, only getting it back when the other team has scored.

    Therefore it is no longer a choice between being either a gifted ball player or a hardworking grafter; if you are not prepared to be both, then you aren't going to be either. (For an example of how a wonderfully entertaining player can also work his socks off, you only need look at the likes of Lionel Messi - often considered the "best" player in the world)

    Which is only what Strachan, Mowbray and Lennon have concluded about McCourt for Celtic* and McIlroy, Sanchez and Worthington have concluded for NI**. Or maybe they're all wrong, too?

    * - Or does anyone think that Celtic are so coming down with skilful ball players that they don't otherwise need McCourt?
    ** - Ditto NI
    I think you've reinforced my point. To paraphrase Forrest Gump, "football is is what football does". By stating that you must have 10 workers to be successful in a modern football team because successful modern football teams have 10 workers.......... you see where I'm going here?
    Its not a proving anything, its simply a self-reinforcing prophecy.

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    International Prospect Lim till i die's Avatar
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    McCourt probably doesn't get picked because Northern Ireland aren't good enough at international level to have any passengers on the field regardless of how fancy they are??
    Davd, the winds blown, the winds blown, all of my dreams away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lim till i die View Post
    McCourt probably doesn't get picked because Northern Ireland aren't good enough at international level to have any passengers on the field regardless of how fancy they are??
    Have you seen Sleeping Brunty play recently?

    I'd be delighted if McCourt challenged to play regularly. Unfortunately, throughout his career- whether at Rochdale, in the LoI or now Celtic reserves- he hasn't.

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    I know very little about Northern Ireland other than that they wouldn't be great tbh!!

    I was just wondering was that the most obvious reason.
    Davd, the winds blown, the winds blown, all of my dreams away.

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    There's plenty of room in any team for lazy players if the positives of their inclusion outweigh the drawbacks. Inzaghi is probably the laziest player I've ever seen on a football pitch, but he was so good at what he did that he played for club and country.

    McCourt is talented, but maybe Worthington has decided that what the side benefits in skill from his inclusion doesn't make up for what they lose in graft.

    And like LTID, I don't really know enough about the team to say this must be the case, just speculating on reasons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    It is a matter of opinion whether McCourt merits a place on footballing grounds in the NI squad or not.

    However, your clear assertion that NW is ignoring McCourt due to anti-Catholic prejudice, or is anti-LOI, is disgraceful, false, ignorant and almost certainly actionable.

    In fact, it's so much so that it's difficult to know where to start, such is the amount of bile, misinformation and downright lies you've crammed into your post.

    You refer to NW losing players to the ROI. Maybe so, but it's hardly down to his personal approach; on the contrary, it was he who persuaded Tony Kane and Michael O'Connor to return to NI (both Catholics, btw). Moreover, he has included Kane in his senior squad and awarded O'Connor all his 9 NI caps. Further, NW's latest young protege is Jonny Gorman, whom he persuaded to switch to NI from the ROI! (And seeing as Gorman qualified for the ROI via ancestry, his background may well be Catholic/Nationalist, not that anyone cares)

    Now let's take James McClean (or ""McLean" as you insist on calling him) specifically. McClean has never played outside Derry City, yet NI picked him for their U-21's, when players with English/Scottish clubs etc were overlooked. Indeed, he was selected by Steve Beaglehole, appointed to the NI set-up by Nigel Worthington, who relies very heavily on his judgement.
    You complain that fellow Milk Cup players have been capped before him. Let's make the comparison. Corry (not "Corey") Evans is Captain of MU Reserves and whilst that does not equate to their "second" team, it denotes a hell of a sight more potential than McClean. Moreover, he has been given a 1st team Squad Number, went on their pre-season tour to the USA (and played) and has been on the bench a couple of times in the EPL. Moreover, he can play several positions in defence or midfield. He is also a year younger than McClean.
    As for Craig Cathcart, he has played a season and a half on loan in the Championship (Plymouth and Watford), before signing this season for Blackpool in the EPL, where he has played all their games to date. Despite that, he has yet to make his International debut, so you haven't even got that right.
    And as for Josh Magennis (not "McGuines"), he has just signed for Aberdeen, where he has started the season in their 1st team. This follows on from having played a handful of games for Cardiff whilst still a teenager. He, too, is a year younger than McClean. As for his two NI caps, both of these were gained on a US Tour where, for contractual reasons, they were billed as "A" Internationals. NW, however, described it as a "development tour". Moreover, although I care not a jot otherwise, I suspect Magennis may actually be Catholic, considering his middle name is Brendan and I've seen him cross himself after scoring (for NI, btw). These are hardly conclusive, but I've never known any Prod called Brendan, nor any to cross himself.

    Next up is your claim that because McClean is playing LOI, NW won't look at him. How do you square that with the fact of NW giving Niall McGinn his international debut whilst still with, ahem, Derry City? Or the fact that he wanted Alan Mannus (LOI) to join the US Tour in preference to Alan Blayney (IL), before Mannus turned him down? The simple fact is, there are only a handful of LOI players who qualify for NI, as opposed to dozens/hundreds in the IL. Also, the USA Tour to which you refer was slap bang in the middle of the LOI season, whereas it was end-of-season for IL players. Moreover, he wouldn't even have taken any of the IL players he did (bar one or two?), had he not suffered well over a dozen withdrawals from players in England/Scotland.

    As for your disgraceful slur that NW is only interested in "Protestant" players, this is utter garbage - and offensive garbage at that. For just looking at the IL players NW has called up and capped alone, these have included nearly as many RC's as Prods eg Marty Donnelly, Rory Patterson and Michael Gault.

    Finally, it was NW who took another look at Paddy McCourt, six years after his debut, during which time he was discarded by McIlroy and ignored by Sanchez (a Catholic former LOI manager btw). Of course, as I have alluded above, it is open to question whether Paddy should be in the present NI squad. But I would point out that the three players who have kept him out of the side in his preferred position were first Keith Gillespie and Damien Johnson (a Catholic, btw), then Niall McGinn of Derry City and Glasgow Celtic, a former GAA=playing Catholic from Donaghmore.

    Of course ignorance of the facts is one thing, but for you to "fill in the gaps" with malicious insinuations and accusations of your own imagination, only betrays who the real bigot is. You ought to be ashamed of yourself, but I don't for one moment believe that that that will even register with you.
    For somebody that cares "not a jot", you seem to know the religion of a lot of players.

    Anyway, I don't think Mcourt is going to make much differace to a rubbish side like Northern Ireland

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    ..........
    Last edited by Gather round; 31/08/2010 at 3:48 PM. Reason: finger slipped, double post

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lim till i die View Post
    I know very little about Northern Ireland other than that they wouldn't be great tbh!!

    I was just wondering was that the most obvious reason.
    Quote Originally Posted by Den Perry View Post
    Anyway, I don't think Mcourt is going to make much differace to a rubbish side like Northern Ireland
    Here's Northern Ireland's admittedly modest record over the last two international tournaments. Look familiar?

    P22-W10-D5-L7-Pts 35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gather round View Post
    P22-W10-D5-L7-Pts 35
    Looks like Limericks record!

    I genuinely wasn't having a dig at the North, I wouldn't cross the road to watch the Republic.
    Davd, the winds blown, the winds blown, all of my dreams away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by osarusan View Post
    McCourt is talented, but maybe Worthington has decided that what the side benefits in skill from his inclusion doesn't make up for what they lose in graft.

    And like LTID, I don't really know enough about the team to say this must be the case, just speculating on reasons
    Indeed. No-one doubts McCourt has skill, but he just hasn't offered enough in club football at the higher levels. Of the players he might replace, Brunt's bone idle but plays regularly in the English Prem, McCann's a reliable grafter and even Healy is still just about able to live off his goals in Euro 2008.
    Last edited by Gather round; 31/08/2010 at 4:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    For to make such a claim would be no more outrageous than to claim that Nigel Worthington must be sectarian etc because he declines to pick Paddy McCourt or James McClean, when anyone who knows anything about the game in NI would know that NW doesn't have a sectarian bone in his body..
    Of course I understand that maybe you are not so outraged as I am that this sort of bile doesn't get Flexy banned etc - after all, it's not your team which he libelled.
    But you must know that Sectarianism has long been the scourge of Ireland, and by extension, Irish football, most especially in NI.
    Moreover, the recent poaching controversy etc risks exacerbating that scourge, at a time when many, many people in NI are working hard to try to eradicate it.
    Therefore when I find my team/manager libelled like that by so loathesome a poster as Flexy, I will challenge it at every turn.
    Otherwise other ignorant/prejudiced/gullible/feeble-minded readers may accord Flexy a degree of credibility which he most certainly does not deserve, thereby leading to the general impression that "nothing has changed at the IFA etc", when it most certainly has.
    Which in turn risks leading to the situation whereby the FAI is seen as the Taig Association in Ireland, with the IFA being the Prod one.
    And if you or other feel that that is some sort of overreaction, then tough titty - if you are not going to challenge overt bigots like Flexy, then you are going to have to put up with me fighting back against them.
    I don't disagree with you, but you're aware of the 'Report' button on each post?

  20. #78
    Banned Den Perry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EalingGreen View Post
    So not even you can defend Flexy's bigoted rant, therefore you try to minimise its importance...

    You're worse than he is.
    You actually stated that I was a bigot on the thread entitled, Northern Ireland, in May 2009. Perhaps I should have called for you be banned, seeing as I took great offence. However, I am able to fight my own battles and don't need to go telling tales to moderators etc. If you don't like what people post, then p*ss off and don't post here.

  21. #79
    First Team Gather round's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Den Perry View Post
    You actually stated that I was a bigot on the thread entitled, Northern Ireland, in May 2009. Perhaps I should have called for you be banned, seeing as I took great offence. However, I am able to fight my own battles and don't need to go telling tales to moderators etc. If you don't like what people post, then p*ss off and don't post here.
    I think your call for an EG ban might have failed Den, not least because you said on that thread "However its what I perceive to be the bigotry of the vast majority of NI fans that causes my disike..." (which, needless to say, you failed to back up with any evidence whatever).

    If you think NI's team is rubbish, fine, but start smearing all the fans and you need to do a bit better.

  22. #80
    First Team EalingGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneRedArmy View Post
    On the basis that
    1) I'm not a mod
    2) I clearly stated my disagreement with the allegation in question
    3) The epic levels of guff you've subjected this site to on matters various (subjective assessment I know) rendering me somewhat immune to oververbose hyperbole
    Quite simply, if someone posted a similarly bigoted rant about Trapatoni, there would be outrage (and understandably so). Instead it was about Worthington, so I chose to express my outrage; yours just happened to be the first post following the original (and also had a secondary point), which was why I responded to you.

    Quote Originally Posted by OneRedArmy View Post
    I think you've reinforced my point. To paraphrase Forrest Gump, "football is is what football does". By stating that you must have 10 workers to be successful in a modern football team because successful modern football teams have 10 workers.......... you see where I'm going here?
    Its not a proving anything, its simply a self-reinforcing prophecy.
    In the old days, a player could get away with being lazy and unfit if he was also particularly skillful. Since then, players are overwhelmingly fitter, stronger and harder working.
    My point was that that does not somehow make them any less skillful or attractive to watch etc.
    In other words, I'd rather watch a skillful player working hard for 90 minutes than a skillful player working hard for 20 minutes, as do managers.
    And just as a player will get the heave-ho if he doesn't work hard enough, so will he if he isn't skillful* enough, either.

    * - There are other skills besides dribbling, such as tackling or heading etc.

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