QuoteYup, completely agree. He doesn't even have any Irish grandparents.Originally Posted by tricky_colour
come on, is that the best you can come up with? us could easily, and probably does mean, "us pundits" or "us people" not us as in "us english". he couldve written that article about any player in the world and used the word "us" the way he did
Yup, completely agree. He doesn't even have any Irish grandparents.
That question was less stupid, though you asked it in a profoundly stupid way.
Help me, Arthur Murphy, you're my only hope!
It's quite simple; Ireland needed a midfielder, Townsend wanted international football, the bandwagon supports a winning team. Everybody's happy?
I'm always amazed at the way some people just don't get the "dual" bit of dual nationality.
25 years growing up in England and he's to be condemned because he used the word 'us' in a commentary. Never mind he gave sterling (no puns) service to Us (that's us Us not them Us), played out of his skin, turned up for B Internationals when he was captain of the first team just to give a bit of leadership and consistency...
short memories.
Legally -and it's all that matters -Townsend is as Irish as the biggest sean bean bocht gaelgeoir, hurley swinging, timber-showing schkelper out there ...and if they don't like it -F*** 'Em.
" I wish to God that someone would be able to block out the voices in my head for five minutes, the voices that scream, over and over again: "Why do they come to me to die?"
God I missed you!Been away for a while and just come back to check on the playoffs. Nice to see that on other subjects we still get the same c*jones being spoken
I see what you're getting at, although even the Nazis regarded that not being born in Germany did not disqualify you from being German.
Where exactly the f*ck were you when the history class started discussing emigration? Oh I forgot the 'E' word is about as likely to be brought up in Irish schools as the 'N' word being brought up at a Barak Obama barbeque. Get a grip! The vast majority of Irish people - in fact count that as the vast majority of anyone - left their country not because they're choosing one country over another. They left because they couldn't find any work. What: The fact that there has been loads of work in Ireland over the last ten years and that emigration has gone out of fashion is totally coincidental?
Where did you get all that rubbish from?
My two cents: Townsend's grandparents are/were three English and one Irish. I think that probably sums up what I see as his real identity.
Here they come! It’s the charge of the “Thanks” Brigade!
Lets get further bogged down in somantics.
Read my original statement again - I pointed out that Townsend was "far more commited" as opposed to Stephen Ireland never having any commitment whatsoever.
In summary - Townsend never walked out and f*cked around the team and fans with coy interviews about a possible return.
Quoting years at random since 1975
Can't a person have dual nationality? If a person has an Italian mother and a Swiss father, can't he feel he is a Italian and Swiss? What if this same person was born in France and grew up in France -does that him French?
Just because a person has played professional sport for a country doesn't mean that they must exclusively belong to that country from that point onwards. Similarly, they're not forced to revoke their citizenship for other countries. The fact is that Andy Townsend is both English and Irish. Only sport forces you to choose one over the other, but just for sporting competitions of that code.
I think we can all agree that Sheringham is a w**ker!
"A silent mouth is sweet to hear"
Well he has not gained any Irish admirers with his childish remarks.
He was a good player and if he was able to run(fast) he would have been really top class.
No, they don't understand. The people who don't understand are all born and raised in Ireland and have never lived anywhere else. Yours and my experience (born in Ireland to Irish parents but moved overseas as a young kid) is frankly beyond their comprehension.
But there are 1 million Irish passport holders living overseas (mostly economic refugees from the 1980s and their kids) who understand exactly what you mean.
Townsend captained the Irish team at the World Cup in 1994 when England stayed home and watched on the telly. It's obvious that he put loyalty between the two teams aside and chose to play for the stronger team.
Steady on Brine. While obviously some people will always be a bit unimaginative or narrow minded, I'm sure most who lived all their lives in Ireland can well understand why others had to move, and why their kids feel a connection to the old country. Would you say that the experience of those who have never left is beyond your comprehension?
Anyway, I've the hump with Townsend. Nothing to do with international football, I agree he was one of your top players. It's just his claim to have given Chelsea "three good years", when as all fans know he was phoning it in for the last season and a half
Its important to remember that Townsend, Cascarino and Sheringham are really good friends - thick as thieves and all that. sheringham knows Andy well enough to get away with saying things like that and not to cause Townsend offence.
Personally I think Townsend was a terrific player for Ireland and always gave 100%. If he uses the 'us' word occassionaly who gives a sh!t? He was with us when it mattered
He made a smart comment about Sheringham and got one back, who gives a **** really. If anybody has their mind changed about him regarding the whole "we" issue then that is just sad. He is more than entitled to call England "we" having been brought up there.
Andy Townsend is only slightly more Irish than the Queen. He played for the Irish football team to enhance his career. There is nothing Irish about him. And yes I know he gave 100% how does this make him Irish ffs? It's because that was his style of play and he was a good player. He also gave 100% on the pitch for Villa does that make him a Brummie? Being a good football player doesn't automatically qualify you as being Irish it's not a question on the passport application. Cascarino is cut from the same cloth. Anyone claiming either is Irish because they put on a football jersey a handful of times a year is deluded.
I make a clear distinction between the likes of Cascarino, Townsend and Lawrenson to people born here that moved abroad or people born to Irish parents abroad who have always had some affinity towards Ireland such as the likes of Kilbane. The latter are Irish the former are footballers advancing their careers because they were either too sh*t to play for England or we nabbed them at a time when they looked unlikely to get into the England team. Try to understand the difference.
Last edited by youngirish; 12/09/2009 at 12:55 PM.
Andy is an Irish citizen, undisputed fact.
He is a dual national, also an undisputed fact.
The exercise of quantifying and comparing what that "Irish" means, is delving into the irrelevant and sometime ridiculous realms of individual subjectivity.
A Gaelgoir can assert that you are not fully Irish unless you are fluent in Gaelic.
"We" and "us" is on Today fm as i type talking about "we" and "us" (ie Ireland)
Like many others, Townsend was approached and 'recruited' by Jack Charlton as a pragmatic method of strengthening the team in a key area when there were no real Irish-born prospects coming through. Townsend may not have been fully conscious of his Irish background, but Charlton would argue that his job was about results, and to get the best players available to us, by hook or by crook. If any fans back then had a moral dilemma about that, they were in a quiet minority.
Houghton, Aldridge, Townsend and Cascarino may not have been as 'Irish' as we'd have liked them to be, but their contributions to the team, and the resultant success, helped to bring football to a new level in Irish public consciousness, and helped increase the numbers playing at youth level. In doing so, Charlton and his 'mercenaries' did a great service to Irish football, something that neither Hand nor Giles could achieve with their mostly Irish-born sides.
Following on from the Charlton years, the U-18 and U-16 teams that won the ECs in 1998 had relatively few 'recruits' (Alex O'Reilly, Shaun Byrne, Liam George off the top of my head), and last Saturday, we only had two English-born players in the starting XI, both with stronger Irish lineage than Townsend had. I think that the 'recruitment' of players like Townsend was a necessary evil - one I would not like to see repeated (like in Jon Macken's case), but was probably needed at the time.
I worked with aer lingus, so kind of...
Anyway, here's Irish legend Owen Coyle on the Scotland game v macedonia.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...urley-scotland
Nothing wrong with dual nationality. Just make Ireland #1But I was at the game on Saturday and in the second half I thought we were outstanding against Macedonia
54,321 sold - wws will never die - ***
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New blog if anyone's interested - http://loihistory.wordpress.com/
LOI section on balls.ie - http://balls.ie/league-of-ireland/
Great post Supreme Feet, that's pretty much how I feel too.
re your example of dual national Owen.Anyway, here's Irish legend Owen Coyle on the Scotland game v macedonia.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...urley-scotland
"But I was at the game on Saturday and in the second half I thought we were outstanding against Macedonia"
Nothing wrong with dual nationality. Just make Ireland #1
Maybe you were unaware that Owen turned down a chance to represent Scotland in order to declare for Ireland and his first game shortly after was against Scotland.
Or maybe you were aware and using it as an example of plain simple dual reality.
Last edited by geysir; 12/09/2009 at 8:23 PM.
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