Part-time football

**Umberside** · 24/08/2009, 12:26 PM

With so much talk about this lately, I suppose it's worth having a thread where it can all be kept together.

The belief is that we're going part-time at the end of this season (we said that last year too), which I don't think will improve the league.

I believe full-time football has a place in the League of Ireland, along with sense and financial prudence.

**superfrank** · 24/08/2009, 12:29 PM

I'd say everybody agrees that full-time football is the way to go but what's more important, imo, is keeping the clubs that are already here still going.

At the mo, there just isn't enough revenue out there for clubs to sustain full-time football.

**Rovers1** · 24/08/2009, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by superfrank

I'd say everybody agrees that full-time football is the way to go but what's more important, imo, is keeping the clubs that are already here still going.

At the mo, there just isn't enough revenue out there for clubs to sustain full-time football.

I'd go with SF. 10 full time clubs just isnt sustainable. A mix of full time/part time (all PD clubs)is the best way forward IMO.

**Dillonman** · 24/08/2009, 12:44 PM

I think the best way forward at the moment is for all clubs to operate on a part time basis but to facilitate a squad with a mixture of full timers and part timers, this is the only way forward, the GAA has killed alot of attendances this Summer(pure joke) at all clubs!

**Umberside** · 24/08/2009, 12:46 PM

The League of Ireland's results in Europe depend on full-time football.

Take Sligo for example, they're part-time and lost to a team form Albania.

St Pats are full-time, and they beat a team from Russia.

**marinobohs** · 24/08/2009, 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by Umberside

With so much talk about this lately, I suppose it's worth having a thread where it can all be kept together.

The belief is that we're going part-time at the end of this season (we said that last year too), which I don't think will improve the league.

I believe full-time football has a place in the League of Ireland, along with sense and financial prudence.

I think this has been "done" before but yes ideally full time football is the best option - improving skill and fitness levels and attracting a better standard of player to the League. The problem is it appears to be financially impossible within the current League structure.

It has always been my view that an all Ireland League would be the only way full time could work but given the realitively poor crowds at SETANTA cup games this may not be enough.
Unfortunately it seems unlikely that this will change anytime soon as in the last season or two lower league teams have had less to spend and more players have "come home" so we have benifited from the collapse of the TV deal they had.
Some clubs have tried some forms of hybrid part time set ups (Pats I know had one based on a scandinavian model) but nobody has found a system yet that they were completely happy with (without going broke !).
individual wage caps or limits have proved impossible to make stick as some club (in a leap for glory) will always break ranks. Central contracting for players (similar to Rugger and the MLS in America) has often been mentioned but can't see the FAI having the where with all to make it work (think **** up - brewery - couldn't organise).

Horrible lack of clarity around what players earn individually so it is impossible to figure if they could / would work full time for less money.

**sligoman** · 24/08/2009, 12:53 PM

Stupid thread, obviously full-time is the best option but it's not sustainable for most clubs at the current time.

Originally Posted by Umberside

Take Sligo for example, they're part-time and lost to a team form Albania.

We're full-time...although not by looking at the table.

**Umberside** · 24/08/2009, 1:01 PM

Originally Posted by sligoman

We're full-time...although not by looking at the table.

I can't remember a team having so many injuries. Sligo would possibly be competing for Europe if they had their full squad to choose from.

**dcfcsteve** · 24/08/2009, 1:14 PM

I think we should go back to football games of old.

'Uppies' versus 'downies' ; games of how-ever-many-a-side ; the ability to move the ball in any way you want ; no fixed time limit etc.

And preferably played on concrete by drunken youths.

**peadar1987** · 24/08/2009, 1:14 PM

I would be in favour of the FAI restructuring the salary cap so say only 50% of income could be spent on wages, but a proportion of income, say 10%, would have to be spend on advertising and club promotion, at least for a few seasons.

It sounds drastic, but these times call for drastic measures. It's already been proven time and again that if the clubs are left to their own devices, at least one will ruin things by driving up player wages, hiring all the best players, then promptly going bust. I know this isn't the FAI's fault, but as the organising authority of the league, they now have the power to stop this from happening again, and encourage prudent spending and sustained growth of the league

**Umberside** · 24/08/2009, 1:29 PM

Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

I think we should go back to football games of old.

'Uppies' versus 'downies' ; games of how-ever-many-a-side ; the ability to move the ball in any way you want ; no fixed time limit etc.

And preferably played on concrete by drunken youths.

Those were the days

**superfrank** · 24/08/2009, 2:02 PM

Originally Posted by Umberside

The League of Ireland's results in Europe depend on full-time football.

Maybe, but just look at how many clubs have run themselves into trouble by chasing Europe. The phrase "you've got to spend money to make money" comes to mind.

Thing is though, LoI teams don't have enough money to make it.

**Umberside** · 24/08/2009, 2:10 PM

Originally Posted by superfrank

Maybe, but just look at how many clubs have run themselves into trouble by chasing Europe. The phrase "you've got to spend money to make money" comes to mind.

Thing is though, LoI teams don't have enough money to make it.

I think St Pats are a glowing example of how to do things right. They've collected a competitive bunch of players for realistic wages and could be going to the Europa League group stages if it wasn't for a poor second half defensive display.

Interstingly too, St Pats had no pressure to qualify for the next round because they are in good financial health, whereas Derry and Bohs depended on it.

And I don't believe it's because of a poor squad that they've underachieved in the league this season, along with Sligo they've had unbelievable injury problems.

The current structure at St Pats should be held up as a symbol of good thinking & pure intelligence in the league.

**marinobohs** · 24/08/2009, 2:10 PM

Originally Posted by peadar1987

I would be in favour of the FAI restructuring the salary cap so say only 50% of income could be spent on wages, but a proportion of income, say 10%, would have to be spend on advertising and club promotion, at least for a few seasons.

It sounds drastic, but these times call for drastic measures. It's already been proven time and again that if the clubs are left to their own devices, at least one will ruin things by driving up player wages, hiring all the best players, then promptly going bust. I know this isn't the FAI's fault, but as the organising authority of the league, they now have the power to stop this from happening again, and encourage prudent spending and sustained growth of the league

That should help keep the game here full time allright ! Also, some clubs have for years found ways around the wage structure by cash in hand ,expenses etc. This was traditionally done to avoid tax /PRSI but the same scams could be used to avoid the 65% rule. I remember hearing from one player that he had not got a payslip in three years
Incidentally, Bohs as a members club was never able to avail of these methods (detailed accounts published etc) which some cynics have linked with our pay costs for bar staff................

**Umberside** · 24/08/2009, 2:12 PM

Originally Posted by marinobohs

I remember hearing from one player that he had not got a payslip in three years

Shocking

Hope it was a long time ago.

**marinobohs** · 24/08/2009, 2:15 PM

Originally Posted by Umberside

Shocking

Hope it was a long time ago.

About two years ago. One former club official that was well known for such practices actually reported two other clubs to Revenue for the same thing

**marinobohs** · 24/08/2009, 2:17 PM

Originally Posted by Umberside

The current structure at St Pats should be held up as a symbol of good thinking & pure intelligence in the league.

Yep, just point me in the direction of a multi millionaire ready to pump a few million into Bohs and I will be happy to follow the St Pats model

**superfrank** · 24/08/2009, 2:21 PM

Originally Posted by Umberside

The current structure at St Pats should be held up as a symbol of good thinking & pure intelligence in the league.

Good thinking and intelligence doesn't win you the LoI. Also, unless you've seen their books, how can you say that they're paying "realistic" wages and are in "good financial health"?

Not all clubs' financial problems get dragged out into the open. There was no public mention of our own troubles last year until we had to cut players wages and our entire budget.