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Thread: Potentially eligible players thread

  1. #2201
    Coach BonnieShels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by osarusan View Post
    Except if they are Northern Irish.

    Oh yeah, I went there!
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    Banned TheOneWhoKnocks's Avatar
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    Just because someone said someone else said Robinson is eligible doesn't mean it's true. It's just Chinese whispers.

    Del - Grealish played for us at under age level plenty of times. He came out and admitted that he identifies as English, that he supported England.

    Lots of people play for lots of countries for purely footballing reasons.

    If Bamford (or anyone) wants to play for Ireland they will do what Arter, Christie and McGoldrick done and declare their intentions.

    They are grown men.

  3. #2203
    Seasoned Pro joe_denilson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    Just because someone said someone else said Robinson is eligible doesn't mean it's true. It's just Chinese whispers.

    Del - Grealish played for us at under age level plenty of times. He came out and admitted that he identifies as English, that he supported England.

    Lots of people play for lots of countries for purely footballing reasons.

    If Bamford (or anyone) wants to play for Ireland they will do what Arter, Christie and McGoldrick done and declare their intentions.

    They are grown men.
    *Arter only had to clarify that because of media speculation. He's played for us since he was 16.

    But yes if Bamford wants to play for us,(or anyone) it would be nice if he nailed his colours to the mast so to speak.

    If I were him, what would hold me back is that he's nowhere near our squad so it might come off as arrogant to do it now. He should wait until he's recovered some form and then just do a small soundbite with OTB or something. Quite simple.

  4. #2204
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Don't get your point about Grealish TOWK? His first choice eventually turned out to be England but we already know Bamford's first choice is also England, he's clearly stated as much. That doesn't mean he doesn't also identify with his Irish heritage.

  5. #2205
    Capped Player DannyInvincible's Avatar
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    Hello all. Not been around for a good while - been digital-detoxing - so I was just catching up and skimming through stuff I'd missed on this thread last night. Good to see it still thriving near the top, as ever. And, of course, TOWK still winding everyone up...

    I saw someone mention a video where David McGoldrick discussed his life-long emotional connection to Ireland and how he used to always get his match programmes signed by the Irish players when he was younger (as his allegiance was/is still being questioned by TOWK, even though TOWK already accepted over two years ago, back in 2014, that McGoldrick has wanted to play for Ireland since he was a kid). This was the video in question:



    Also, TOWK was having a go at Arter and another player for referring to Ireland as "the country" instead of "my country". I'm pretty certain I've heard James McClean refer to Ireland as "the country" and "this country" (see: http://www.the42.ie/james-mcclean-re...78970-Nov2016/ and https://www.joe.ie/sport/watch-james...terview/550195) in post-match interviews and only a brave man would attempt to cast doubt over his credentials, passion or commitment.

    Gary Breen is another (former) player who has referred to Ireland as "the country". He had two Irish parents and grew up feeling very much Irish. Or are we to question his commitment too?

    Is it really that big a deal whether a player says "the country" or "my country" so long as he's doing the important talking for Ireland with his feet?

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  7. #2206
    Banned TheOneWhoKnocks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeLorean View Post
    Don't get your point about Grealish TOWK? His first choice eventually turned out to be England but we already know Bamford's first choice is also England, he's clearly stated as much. That doesn't mean he doesn't also identify with his Irish heritage.
    My point is that it's an exercise in futility talking about Bamford because a) he is not good enough for an Ireland call up, let alone an England call up; b) England is his clear preference and people should respect that; c) I don't get the mentality behind people almost hoping someone doesn't fulfil their potential so they can play for us.

    Jamie O'Hara and Wayne Rooney identify with their heritage too.

    Plenty of eligible players have no interest in playing for Ireland for various reasons but still identify with their Irish heritage.

    Just because an English player declares for Ireland doesn't make them more or less Irish.

    You don't get my point about Grealish? You don't remember the bollockings I got when I correctly called that he would declare for England? You don't get my point, yet you thanked a comment referring to posts that are over a year old and have little or nothing to do with my comments over the last few pages.
    Last edited by TheOneWhoKnocks; 21/01/2017 at 2:44 PM.

  8. #2207
    Reserves Wangball's Avatar
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    An interesting aside but Rob Brennan, the anglo-Irish London based journo, put up a tweet about the FAI looking into the eligibility of Robinson and one of the people who liked it was Bradley Lewis, Bradley played with us up to U21 level and would've been a team mate of Robinson @ Villa! Some inside knowledge on the fact perhaps??
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  9. #2208
    Banned TheOneWhoKnocks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joe_denilson View Post
    *Arter only had to clarify that because of media speculation. He's played for us since he was 16.

    But yes if Bamford wants to play for us,(or anyone) it would be nice if he nailed his colours to the mast so to speak.

    If I were him, what would hold me back is that he's nowhere near our squad so it might come off as arrogant to do it now. He should wait until he's recovered some form and then just do a small soundbite with OTB or something. Quite simple.
    In fairness, he played for Ireland up to U-19 level and hadn't played in several years since. Loads of players have bounced between countries.

    I wasn't having a go at Arter, Christie or McGoldrick when I said that.

    Ireland was not Christie's first preference, but he didn't faff about like Hogan and I can respect his transparency. That was my point.

    Arter & McGoldrick, too, were always vociferous about their intentions. That too was my point.

    There's no media circus like there was with Pilkington in the past, and now Hogan.

    Although you can't blame the players in all circumstances as sometimes it's the Irish media pushing the issue, not them.
    Last edited by TheOneWhoKnocks; 21/01/2017 at 2:43 PM.

  10. #2209
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    My point is that it's an exercise in futility talking about Bamford because a) he is not good enough for an Ireland call up, let alone an England call up; b) England is his clear preference and people should respect that; c) I don't get the mentality behind people almost hoping someone doesn't fulfil their potential so they can play for us.
    You don't have to involve yourself in a conversation you consider futile. I think he's plenty good enough to make Ireland squads but has just made a few poor career moves. He's played with us before and he said he'd be open to the idea of doing so again. Who are you to contradict him?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    Jamie O'Hara and Wayne Rooney identify with their heritage too.
    So what? I was only responding to you questioning the idea that Bamford might identify with his Irish heritage, it doesn't make him any less English if he does.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    Plenty of eligible players have no interest in playing for Ireland for various reasons but still identify with their Irish heritage.
    Bamford has already played for Ireland, so he was obviously interested in playing for Ireland. That doesn't mean he's interested in being tied though obviously but nobody is saying that he is as of yet. Nobody is disputing that England is his first preference.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    Just because an English player declares for Ireland doesn't make them more or less Irish.
    No idea why you've made this point.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    You don't get my point about Grealish? You don't remember the bollockings I got when I correctly called that he would declare for England? You don't get my point, yet you thanked a comment referring to posts that are over a year old and have little or nothing to do with my comments over the last few pages.
    You got the bollockings for your reasoning and your inability to accept that things aren't always black and white when it comes to national identity, not for your feeling that he would declare for England. You can pat yourself on the back for coming out the right side of a 50/50 prediction all you want but it doesn't mean your argument was any more reasonable or even logical.

    If you're talking about me thanking Danny's post above it was more of a welcome back thanks than anything else, but as usual he schooled you with logic and reason and had the evidence to back it up, so that's always worth acknowledging too.

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  12. #2210
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    I've just clicked on those links re: McClean and he says "this country", not "the country".

    So not the same thing is it?

    Never mind the added context.

    Never mind the fact that the comment he alludes to was intended to be humorous in the first place.

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    Banned TheOneWhoKnocks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeLorean View Post
    You don't have to involve yourself in a conversation you consider futile. I think he's plenty good enough to make Ireland squads but has just made a few poor career moves. He's played with us before and he said he'd be open to the idea of doing so again. Who are you to contradict him?



    So what? I was only responding to you questioning the idea that Bamford might identify with his Irish heritage, it doesn't make him any less English if he does.



    Bamford has already played for Ireland, so he was obviously interested in playing for Ireland. That doesn't mean he's interested in being tied though obviously but nobody is saying that he is as of yet. Nobody is disputing that England is his first preference.



    No idea why you've made this point.



    You got the bollockings for your reasoning and your inability to accept that things aren't always black and white when it comes to national identity, not for your feeling that he would declare for England. You can pat yourself on the back for coming out the right side of a 50/50 prediction all you want but it doesn't mean your argument was any more reasonable or even logical.

    If you're talking about me thanking Danny's post above it was more of a welcome back thanks than anything else, but as usual he schooled you with logic and reason and had the evidence to back it up, so that's always worth acknowledging too.
    - I know it's not a black and white issue. I always articulated my reasons for stating why I believed Grealish would declare for England over Ireland with logic, reason and facts. Several dozen times. And I never insulted you or Danny when doing so, while you two resorted to namecalling several times. Never the sign of someone winning a debate is it? It's completely asinine that you are ignoring this, but typical.

    - I know (Bamford) was interested then. Well, as interested as Grealish and Crowley were. But after moves to Chelsea, Premier League football and lots of Championship goals he is not as interested.

    - You posted that Bamford identified with his Irish heritage. In the links I was directed to he joked of having extended family members on one side of the family who wanted him to declare for Ireland. He didn't say anything specifically about identifying with his Irish heritage. Not that I see how it has any point.

    - Yes, he is open to the idea of playing for Ireland in the future if he is not good enough to play for England. Until that day comes and he contacts the FAI..

  14. #2212
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    I called you a moron once and it had nothing to do with the Grealish discussion, it was after you were gloating when Keogh made his howler at Wembley in the playoff final. I apologised almost immediately and you said at the time that you accepted my apology and even understood why I snapped at you. What other "namecalling" have I engaged in? I'm sure you have several examples.

  15. #2213
    Banned TheOneWhoKnocks's Avatar
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    It's not exactly a very rational thing to do is it?

    I think you are being obtuse. I'm not going to sift through thousands of comments to find the offending ones, but I remember you and Danny making several offensive comments about my intelligence - which I complained about at the time.

    Probably a synonym for moron.

  16. #2214
    Coach tetsujin1979's Avatar
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    Gentlemen, we have a rule about attacking the post. You would do well to remember it.

  17. #2215
    Capped Player DeLorean's Avatar
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    TOWK, if you're going to make accusations I think you should have to back them up. If what you say is accurate the comments should be either in this thread or the Grealish one, hardly that big a chore.

  18. #2216
    Capped Player DannyInvincible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    You don't get my point, yet you thanked a comment referring to posts that are over a year old and have little or nothing to do with my comments over the last few pages.
    The discussion on McGoldrick to which I was referring was in the middle of September. Before last night, I hadn't posted on the forum since August, so it was just something I came across going through the thread since then and thought it worth posting the video that samhaydenjr had mentioned (as he hadn't posted it himself at the time) whilst also pointing out that you had already accepted over two years ago that McGoldrick had a desire to play for Ireland since he was a kid, so what the reason was/is behind your decision to go back on that more recently and argue with people about it again, who knows?

    Your criticism of Arter and O'Dowda for having referred to Ireland as "the country" was in mid-November (on page 105); also relatively recent. I thought it was very unfair on those lads, which is why I brought it up. What that has to do with your present discussion with DeLorean over Grealish, I'm not sure either.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    I've just clicked on those links re: McClean and he says "this country", not "the country".

    So not the same thing is it?
    I referred to both his use of "this country" and "the country", which I'm pretty certain I've also heard him say, albeit not in the two links I provided.

    Anyway, here are some examples of other players born in Ireland using the phrase...

    Shane Long: https://www.joe.ie/sport/a-long-way-...ane-long/24456

    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Long
    [Stephen Ireland's] obviously a gifted player. I think it’s up to him, he has his own reasons for not playing for the country and who are we to judge?
    David Forde: http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/socc...iven-1.2151218

    Quote Originally Posted by David Forde
    He (Given) is entitled to do that (eye up his spot in the team). After what he’s done for the country, I’ve a lot of admiration for him; he’s been one of the best players for the country. It’s great that I’ve been playing for the last couple of years or whatever and long may that continue.
    Robbie Keane: http://www.irishmirror.ie/sport/socc...-wreck-8729782

    Quote Originally Posted by Robbie Keane
    All I did was want to do my best for the country and I think I’ve done that. I’ve no regrets whatsoever and the amount of messages I’ve got has been incredible.
    Robbie again: http://www.irishmirror.ie/sport/socc...-axing-1775227

    Quote Originally Posted by Robbie Keane
    Kevin [Doyle] has done fantastic for the country since he started playing.
    For some diversity, Robbie Keane referring to "the nation": http://www.the42.ie/ireland-germany-...77090-Oct2015/

    Quote Originally Posted by Robbie Keane
    I keep saying, it doesn’t matter who is playing or not. It’s about the nation and about everybody pulling together to try to achieve one goal, and that’s to qualify for France.
    I don't think I really need to bother searching for any further examples; they're examples of some of our most committed servants using it.

    Does it perhaps only jar with you when you hear it in an English accent, or, more likely, simply because you just haven't really taken to the guy saying it?

    Never mind the fact that the comment he alludes to was intended to be humorous in the first place.
    Which comment? Your criticism of Arter and O'Dowda? You said their use of "the country" wound you up and jarred with you - if you were joking, fair enough - but, a few posts later, you contrasted them (along with Pilkington now too) from players born in Ireland who you said you'd never heard using "the country".

    What was the reason for continuing the "joke" via making such a comparison if it wasn't to make a serious point and imply that there was something negative to be read from Arter, Pilkington and O'Dowda's use of the phrase? And if it was truly just a joke, why are you still arguing the point in respect of McClean?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks View Post
    - I know it's not a black and white issue. I always articulated my reasons for stating why I believed Grealish would declare for England over Ireland with logic, reason and facts. Several dozen times. And I never insulted you or Danny when doing so, while you two resorted to namecalling several times. Never the sign of someone winning a debate is it? It's completely asinine that you are ignoring this, but typical.
    If you're going to accuse myself and DeLorean of "namecalling several times", I'd appreciate it if you provided some evidence or else retracted the accusation.

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    Capped Player SkStu's Avatar
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    Guess who's back
    Back again
    Danny's back
    Tell a friend

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  21. #2218
    Banned TheOneWhoKnocks's Avatar
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    - McGoldrick had an Irish link through adoptive parents. He only found out he had a blood link through his maternal grandmother as an adult.

    McGoldrick's research found that he also had a blood tie to Ireland as well as through his adoptive parents. "I got in contact with my birth mum a few years ago. She mentioned that her dad was Irish. She died a couple of weeks ago which is sad, but I'd gotten this interest in playing for Ireland."
    http://www.goal.com/en-ie/news/3942/...reland-call-up

    I'm not going to retract the accusation over you and Delorean resorting to insulting me. Ye both insulted me several times and ye know fully well ye did! If I'm forced to find the insults (which have probably been edited in any case) I will do so, but I'm not going to spend hours sifting through comments now. I'll do it when I have the time.

    Did I jokingly complain about Bamford saying "the country"?

    No, I didn't. So stick to the topic at hand and stop dredging stuff up from several months ago just to wind someone up.

  22. #2219
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    Quote Originally Posted by tetsujin1979 View Post
    Gentlemen, we have a rule about attacking the post. You would do well to remember it.
    Gentlemen, you can't fight in here. This is the War Room.

  23. #2220
    Seasoned Pro CraftyToePoke's Avatar
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    Cat meet pigeons

    Ryan Manning calls us 'they' and speaks of his ambition to play 'international football' - https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2017...mpressing-qpr/

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