Difference is that Dean Kiely want's to play for his country but is not picked where as Stephen Ireland would be picked for his country but does not want to play.Originally Posted by backtowalsall
it galls me that you have even had to point that difference out.
to Crosby - look at our other options for the final goalkeeping spot - hardly inspires confidence if Given and Westwood were absent. Anyway, i think Kiely was still always going to be second choice as long as he was around. His exit has simply quickened Westwoods promotion.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
I have no intention of starting another Roy Keane or Steven Ireland debate here as it has been done to death on other threads. Im just making the point that those 2 in particular have been vilified and been called traitors to the country for deciding not to play for their country and yet the reaction is totally different for Kiely when he quits the national team not once but twice, it just strikes me a bit of double standards is all.
I actually dont see how he can have any complaints about not getting picked either,you say that he has a right to be upset that a guy with one championship season under his belt is ahead of him... then surely that would mean that Liam Miller would have a right to walk out if McCann,O Toole,Fahey etc were picked ahead of him.Neither Miller or Kiely have been playing enough first team football to justify a place in the squad let alone in the team and if there are players playing week in week out picked ahead of them they can have no complaints. Kiely has only been in the squad because we dont have enough other good keepers and if he was serious about trying to fight for a starting place he should have left West Brom in search of first team football
Its really not that complicated!!!
I reckon the guy is seething with his club situation. Carson has been hugesly disappointing for WBA and he has been left on bench until he eventually got in for last 3 games. He probably thought he was going to get at least a half a game for Ireland tonight and then told he won't feature and he reacted accordingly. Straw that broke the camel's back. I don't condone it but I can understand where he is coming from. Hope Doyle gets a move this seaso as I think he will be an outstanding keeper.
Always look on the bright side of life
Well considering that Given was an injury doubt all week and that this is "just" a friendly game, it's not beyond the realms of possibility that somebody suggested to Kiely that he would be getting his game.
There's no comparison and therefore no double standard so I won't restart one either.
As I said in previous post -it's not a straight comparison with the outfield players. The guy was asked to come out of retirement was he not. Now he gets a strong hint that he was asked to do so to carry bollards, cut oranges and help the other two with their stretches. As someone else said, his leaving isn't to be condoned -but I can easily empathise.
Debateable ...but fair comment. He is nonetheless the senior keeper in there with a wealth of experience while Westwood (nothing at all against Westwood btw) has probably 12-14 years of football left in him and a lot to learn.
My thoughts exactly. Incidently I don't think it's especially healthy for Ireland or Given that the guy knows he'd have to break a limb to be dropped.
" I wish to God that someone would be able to block out the voices in my head for five minutes, the voices that scream, over and over again: "Why do they come to me to die?"
You mean Kiely didn't think it was healthy with some thoughts racing around his head picturing Shay breaking a leg and thought he'd better split the scene before he put a jinx on Given
Can't really complain about Given's insatiable desire for all the caps.
I think Kiely recognises 100% that he was second fiddle to Given, but there is an amount of natural sympathy for his cause that there is a time and place for a deputy to take his place.
Stephen Ireland left because he doesn't want to play for Ireland, Dean Kiely left because does and is clearly ****ed off about sitting on the bench and not getting a run, when by right, he should. They are hardly similar situations.
Kiely is not having a huff about not being picked ahead of Given, he's having a huff about not being picked ahead of some GK half of us have never heard of.
Great shame its come to this and I hope Trapp doesn't come to regret this especially if Shay misses any of our WC games.
I recall another thread about players who should have or deserved to win more caps. Dean is surely one of the strongest of these in recent memory.
10 caps is a poor return for a player of his quality.
Bear in mind that in the meantime we've given 9 caps to Colgan, 7 to Kenny, 6 to Henderson, one each to Murphy and Doyle, quite a few to Kelly and a zillion to Shay. And, I'm sure I'm forgetting someone.
Together with all our hearts.
Its a pet hate of mine to see people giving out that given wants the appeareance record for ireland. So bloody what, we should be delighted that one of our players want to. We have a certain talented **** in England that won't get off his arse to play for us so its refreshing to have people with Givens attitude.
I agree with almost everything Roy keane said in his career but was ****ed off when he gave out about given wanting to play in every game. yes, personally i wouldn't play him tonigh, as it is an unnessary risk, but if given feels u to it then so be.
BTW Coventry fans have been singing the praises of westwood all season
Kiely has a history of being treated badly by managements. An unattached Alan Kelly was preferred to him for a friendly iirc so he could go in the shop window.
This is bad management Westwood is an unknown quantity, Kiely is a good 2nd choice.
"No regrets, none at all. My only regret is that we went out on penalties. That's my only regret. But no, no regrets." -Mick McCarthy
well the only way of seeing if he is up to it is to see him play so its a good choice playing him in my opinion
Its really not that complicated!!!
The match didn't realistically show us anything about Westwood and we lost Kiely over it. Seems a little silly to me.
"No regrets, none at all. My only regret is that we went out on penalties. That's my only regret. But no, no regrets." -Mick McCarthy
I thought Westwood did fine. Himself and Kiely should've had a half each. Given, who nearly got his achilles hacked off in an over-elaborated clearance, shouldn't have played.
" I wish to God that someone would be able to block out the voices in my head for five minutes, the voices that scream, over and over again: "Why do they come to me to die?"
Westwood is the most likely candidate to replace Given as our long term number one. He's playing regularly and is being linked with a Premiership move. He should be ahead of Kiely in the pecking order imo.
While I definitely understand this opinion, there is something to be said for experience.
If Given's hip injury acts up, I think given the importance of this coming game, in addition to the probable hostility of the crowd in an away fixture, I'd lean towards picking Kiely.
Even though I'm really excited about Westwood's future with us, I think it would be a big ask for him to come in for his second cap in that kind of environment, under that kind of pressure.
Dean if you read this I believe most Irish supporters want you to come back.
Dean Kiely is a vey good goalkeeper and is an asset to the Irish squad.
Indo this morning is saying Westwood is out for Sofia. Not because he's injured but because he's getting married!
Now, I doubt this was a spur of the moment thing - unless it's to one of the Nigerian WAGs at the game on Friday - so this makes Kiely's ommission more bizarre.
Still, Westwood is ours now. I think that's a good thing as England may have nipped in ahead of us.
Trap said he had known about this for the last month, no wonder Kiely was aggrieved.
San Marino are going to be a handful as the group goes on." - Steve Staunton reacts to performance against San Marino.
I think he's blundered by not starting Kiely. Trap surely didn't expect Dean to throw a wobbly but, since he knew for a month Westwood would be unavailable against Bulgaria, it made sense to placate your 2nd choice keeper. Now it's Doyle, Murphy, Henderson or Kenny to get called up as replacement and many fingers crossed that Shay doesn't get injured.
Ou-est le Centre George Pompidou?
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