Shane Duffy D Norwich b.1992

**DCWA** · 19/10/2020, 4:15 PM

Lennon was not prioritising the Milan game. He was without Edouard, Forrest and Christie (the latter two more important than the former) as well as a few others. He considered Ajeti and Griffiths not fit to start.

That being said it was an abysmal performance all round, not many Celtic fans will be surprised by that. Essentially every performance since the start of the new season has had major flaws (that is putting it politely) and this was coming.

Duffy was very poor, surprising as he has played in big games against much superior players than the Rangers front men and coped perfectly well so I wouldn’t be alarmed on an individual basis, it was part of an all round pathetically poor team performance which was the fault yet again of a very, very poor manager.

**Eirambler** · 20/10/2020, 10:39 AM

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.

He never rotates the team, partly because he doesn't have faith in the squad players but also because he doesn't know how to develop or improve them or fit them in to any kind of coherent game plan. Basically for him it's just a case of getting the 11 best players on the pitch week after week with the same two or three subs and hoping they can produce enough individual moments to win games and titles. He can get away with this when Celtic are unchallenged in the league, as they have been up to now, it was a similar story when he managed Hibs in the division below, they were miles better than everyone else that season so it was easy. However, with Hibs and also Bolton, he has shown that once he comes up against teams of similar abilities he cannot adapt - Bolton were relegated and he had Hibs, with the fourth biggest budget in the league that season down in eighth in the table by the time they removed him.

Basically there's no bigger picture here, he's just a crap manager.

**DCWA** · 20/10/2020, 3:26 PM

Originally Posted by Eirambler

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.

He never rotates the team, partly because he doesn't have faith in the squad players but also because he doesn't know how to develop or improve them or fit them in to any kind of coherent game plan. Basically for him it's just a case of getting the 11 best players on the pitch week after week with the same two or three subs and hoping they can produce enough individual moments to win games and titles. He can get away with this when Celtic are unchallenged in the league, as they have been up to now, it was a similar story when he managed Hibs in the division below, they were miles better than everyone else that season so it was easy. However, with Hibs and also Bolton, he has shown that once he comes up against teams of similar abilities he cannot adapt - Bolton were relegated and he had Hibs, with the fourth biggest budget in the league that season down in eighth in the table by the time they removed him.

Basically there's no bigger picture here, he's just a crap manager.

I think that is all absolutely spot on.

**Charlie Darwin** · 21/10/2020, 2:54 AM

Lennon's teams are at their best against superior teams. Rangers are not that. Wouldn't be surprised if they got a better result out of Milan than Rangers.

**seanfhear** · 21/10/2020, 6:40 AM

Originally Posted by Eirambler

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.

He never rotates the team, partly because he doesn't have faith in the squad players but also because he doesn't know how to develop or improve them or fit them in to any kind of coherent game plan. Basically for him it's just a case of getting the 11 best players on the pitch week after week with the same two or three subs and hoping they can produce enough individual moments to win games and titles. He can get away with this when Celtic are unchallenged in the league, as they have been up to now, it was a similar story when he managed Hibs in the division below, they were miles better than everyone else that season so it was easy. However, with Hibs and also Bolton, he has shown that once he comes up against teams of similar abilities he cannot adapt - Bolton were relegated and he had Hibs, with the fourth biggest budget in the league that season down in eighth in the table by the time they removed him.

Basically there's no bigger picture here, he's just a crap manager.

You’d think these managers that are not the best tacticians would always have an eye out for the best coaches. Some fellas are happy being coaches and don’t want to be manager so you’d think that Lennon would get good / great coaches around him , ones that don’t want to be managers.

**Eirambler** · 21/10/2020, 6:50 AM

There certainly have been rumours that Damien Duff was doing a lot of the heavy lifting on the coaching side and his loss has been felt at the club.

**seanfhear** · 21/10/2020, 7:26 AM

Originally Posted by Eirambler

There certainly have been rumours that Damien Duff was doing a lot of the heavy lifting on the coaching side and his loss has been felt at the club.

When you think of it after the leaving Celtic, the only offer Lennon got, was to go to a fairly bonkers Bolton Club. So its not as if many Clubs were thinking that Neil Lennon fella is a Great Manager.

Was Martin O’ Neill the same manager without John Robertson ? Results would say ~ no way. Some of these fellas need good coaches / tacticians around them and they and the clubs they are working for should bite the bullet and accept that.

Roy Keane needed good coaches and tacticians around him. Even from his punditry alone you can tell he is no tactical genius !

**paul_oshea** · 21/10/2020, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by Eirambler

There's no way he sacrifices that game for Milan, absolutely no chance. For me Lennon was showing, once again, that he has no gameplan whatsoever beyond getting as many of his better players on the pitch as often as possible. To me it looked like once he couldn't pick his best 11 or close to it he had no idea what to do - his demeanour throughout the game was of someone who had given up on it as soon as the first goal went in.
.

Sorry for hijacking this thread but I remember watching united under ferguson in Europe and trying to say the same to people and no one seeing what i was saying, but this last sentence was often the case, take for example the Barca game at wembley. He didnt change it up when it was clear things were not going well and just looked like a man who had given up before it had properly got started.

**Stuttgart88** · 21/10/2020, 11:27 AM

Lennon's body language was just dreadful on Saturday.

**EAFC_rdfl** · 21/10/2020, 1:23 PM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

Sorry for hijacking this thread but I remember watching united under ferguson in Europe and trying to say the same to people and no one seeing what i was saying, but this last sentence was often the case, take for example the Barca game at wembley. He didnt change it up when it was clear things were not going well and just looked like a man who had given up before it had properly got started.

It must be a real pain in the ass to be head and shoulders above all of these inept football people

**paul_oshea** · 21/10/2020, 2:05 PM

Originally Posted by EAFC_rdfl

It must be a real pain in the ass to be head and shoulders above all of these inept football people

Actually never saw it like that, but you've made a valid point - for which i liked it. I thought perhaps i hadnt articulated my point well enough. :lightbulb:

**tetsujin1979** · 21/10/2020, 4:47 PM

I, for one, wake every day happy in the knowledge that I am in the presence of the one person who saw things were not going well for Manchester United in the Champions League against Barcelona at Wembley. The game where United were never in front, Barcelona took the lead in under half an hour, had 2/3 of the possession in the first half, and had more shots on target in the first half than their opponents had in the whole game.
What insight.

**seanfhear** · 21/10/2020, 5:16 PM

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

I, for one, wake every day happy in the knowledge that I am in the presence of the one person who saw things were not going well for Manchester United in the Champions League against Barcelona at Wembley. The game where United were never in front, Barcelona took the lead in under half an hour, had 2/3 of the possession in the first half, and had more shots on target in the first half than their opponents had in the whole game.
What insight.

Have you ever considered football management ?

**DCWA** · 22/10/2020, 10:38 PM

For all the talk on here about Ireland being best suited to a back 3 it is clear that Duffy, our stand in captain and essentially guaranteed starter really, really struggles with it.

He was poor throughout tonight and I believe he is absolutely knackered but he did improve massively second half when Celtic changed to a back 4.

It may put paid to the talk that our players are perfectly suited to it, this may be the case only on paper.

**DCWA** · 22/10/2020, 10:53 PM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

The main positive() for me over the 5 games consistently was how we looked defensively bar a couple of stupid mistakes here or there which I don't think are symptoms of the system.
So I want to see them against a strong top tier footballing side. I don't think it matters who we play at this stage scoring is going to be an issue for us, so let's test ourselves against a proper nation. If ireland come out without conceding against England it will be seen as a good result and a positive for Kenny.

That's forgetting about the whole base and logistical sense it makes from a non-footballing side too due to covid. I do feel Kenny probably didn't want England at this early point though.

Wrong thread perhaps?

**Stuttgart88** · 23/10/2020, 9:16 AM

Originally Posted by DCWA

For all the talk on here about Ireland being best suited to a back 3 it is clear that Duffy, our stand in captain and essentially guaranteed starter really, really struggles with it.

He was poor throughout tonight and I believe he is absolutely knackered but he did improve massively second half when Celtic changed to a back 4.

It may put paid to the talk that our players are perfectly suited to it, this may be the case only on paper.

Ditto, was thinking exactly the same last night.

I think McGregor did Duffy no favours for the second goal tbf, he clearly got in Duffy's way, but Duffy was caught unaware for the late sucker punch. But individual incidents aside, Duffy just looked more comfortable in the second half.

If I may digress to a broader Celtic duiscussion, I wonder will last night be a bit of a turning point / Eureka moment. Reverting to 4 at the back and including a creative player like Rogic in an advanced position seems to suit the team much better. Of course this may mean Duffy drops out if Julien returns. Anyway, Celtic really need to make a statement at Aberdeen this weekend.

**DCWA** · 23/10/2020, 9:46 AM

Yeah McGregor was well intentioned but got in his way prevented Duffy getting across to possibly make the block.

You would think Lennon has to see now that it must be a back 4. He only has 3 genuine centre backs anyway can’t flog them so hard over a long campaign that they play every game. Duffy could do with some rotation so I wouldn’t have concerns about Jullien returning.

**Fixer82** · 23/10/2020, 9:56 AM

A back 3/5 of O'Shea, Duffy and Egan with Stevens and Doherty as wing backs is very appealing. Requires a lot of running back from Doherty in particular though who I don't think is very used to that.

**DCWA** · 23/10/2020, 10:05 AM

I think a back 3/5 has to have Duffy dropped he looks so so uncomfortable with it that even at club level with every day training on it I can’t see it ever working for him never mind for the national team. I must say I think it looks the part on paper but that it just won’t work I also don’t think we have the midfielders to carry the system but that irrelevant to this discussion, what is clear as day is that it does not work for Shane Duffy he is like a fish out of water as part of a 3.

**BOOMSHAKALAKA** · 23/10/2020, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by DCWA

I think a back 3/5 has to have Duffy dropped he looks so so uncomfortable with it that even at club level with every day training on it I can’t see it ever working for him never mind for the national team. I must say I think it looks the part on paper but that it just won’t work I also don’t think we have the midfielders to carry the system but that irrelevant to this discussion, what is clear as day is that it does not work for Shane Duffy he is like a fish out of water as part of a 3.

Maybe he doesn't suit the centre of a back 3. Egan plays that role week in week out. Duffy may be more comfortable on the right. He didn't look too comfortable in a back 4 with Ireland against weak enough opposition in Kenny's first few games. He was exposed late on last night when Celtic had 4 at the back. It could be a case that Duffy can be a bit loose no matter what formation he's in and needs more midfield protection. I don't think we can be certain one way or the other at the moment.