Banter or racist abuse?

**Dalymountrower** · 22/03/2009, 9:39 PM

A black player playing in the LOI had a chant directed at him at recent game by opposing fans to the effect that "his father washes elephants and his mothers a ho`"
Good humoured banter a la the Black and White Minstrels show (uncut) or behaviour that should attract an automatic fine for the club in question?

**superfrank** · 22/03/2009, 9:43 PM

Has anyone asked how Joey Ndo himself feels about it?

**Dodge** · 22/03/2009, 9:43 PM

Wasn't recent but some Pats fans sang that song when Ndo played for rovers last year

Is saying someone washes elephants rascist?

**gufc2000** · 22/03/2009, 9:47 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Wasn't recent but some Pats fans sang that song when Ndo played for rovers last year

Is saying someone washes elephants rascist?

Yes, i think it is. Definite fine imo, and fans that made the remarks should be barred from LoI grounds

**Dalymountrower** · 22/03/2009, 9:49 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Wasn't recent but some Pats fans sang that song when Ndo played for rovers last year

Is saying someone washes elephants rascist?

So you`re in the "its good natured banter" column ? Maybe you should have a look at the definition in the Equality Act and re-consider?

**Dodge** · 22/03/2009, 9:52 PM

Where did I say that? I don't like the song and wouldn't sing it. It's in poor taste certainly

Still not sure it's rascist

Prsume some other club sang it recently?

**RonnieB** · 22/03/2009, 9:52 PM

I wash elephants

**John83** · 22/03/2009, 9:54 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Is saying someone washes elephants rascist?

Yeah, I'd say it is. At least, I can't imagine anyone singing it at Greg O'Halloran. I mean, I presume it was his mum who washed the elephant.

Whether the club in question can do anything about it... I think fines for that kind of thing are a little harsh. It's not like I've ever seen stewards successfully hush a crowd. (Well, except at Ireland games, where they're skilled at it) They can't really pick out the culprits and ban them either. I mean, it's one thing to coller some **** who threw a bottle or a punch, but a block of people (mostly) singing?

About the only argument for it is that people won't want to bring down fines on their own club, but I don't know how effective that is.

**jebus** · 22/03/2009, 10:26 PM

Can't stop people making remarks like that in any walk of life, let alone in a football match.

I wouldn't do them myself but good luck trying to pick each and every culprit out of a crowd, especially as most clubs fans don't seem bothered when it's their own crowd doing it , and really it's a club's SC that should be sorting the scum out from their crowd

**LeixlipRed** · 22/03/2009, 10:34 PM

It's a racial stereotype, albeit a slightly obscure one. Therefore, it should definitely not be allowed. But it's fairly obvious it's in poor taste anyway

**irishultra** · 22/03/2009, 10:42 PM

banter but its racist...don't believe there is much malice in it, so tbh i don't think its so bad, if they were telling ndo to 'go back to his own country', then there is malice in it.

although a very ****e chant it has to be said.

**A face** · 22/03/2009, 10:45 PM

Wasn't some guy jailed for two months for racial abuse a while back? I hate the fact that its a LOI game involved here but you have to throw the book at them and the club for this. Whether you call it making an example or what ever but zero tolerance is the way to go. Its not on and causes far too many problems for it to be brushed off as 'it was only banter'

**Dodge** · 22/03/2009, 10:49 PM

So with the original post, I assume that one of Dundalk, Derry or Rovers chanted it this year?

**irishultra** · 22/03/2009, 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by A face

Wasn't some guy jailed for two months for racial abuse a while back? I hate the fact that its a LOI game involved here but you have to throw the book at them and the club for this. Whether you call it making an example or what ever but zero tolerance is the way to go. Its not on and causes far too many problems for it to be brushed off as 'it was only banter'

yeah was towards thiam at a drogheda game. i don't agree with punishing the clubs at all. as the saying goes, countries aren't racist, people are, well same applies for loi clubs, and none of them as institutions condone or support any sort of discrimination in anyway(well except for wexford youths) so punishment would be insane imo.

**Dodge** · 22/03/2009, 11:19 PM

Found out it was Rovers fans. No idea of the amount. Definitely only a handful of pats fans attempted it last year (skanger kids mostly)

**osarusan** · 22/03/2009, 11:22 PM

Originally Posted by A face

you have to throw the book at them and the club for this.

I suppose the argument is that clubs will try harder to eradicate things like this if they will be directly punished for it rather than just having a fan banned or whatever, but the idea that the club can be held responsible and punished for something they can never completely control is flawed. A club could do everything in its power to stop comments like this and would still find itself in trouble because of a tiny number of fans.

**LeixlipRed** · 22/03/2009, 11:36 PM

A zero tolerance policy is the only way forward. I'd have no problem seeing people arrested for this sort of behaviour never mind just expelled and banned from grounds.

**Hairy Bowsie** · 23/03/2009, 12:51 AM

Ah for christs sake, it a stupid chant but i doubt even any of the people chanting it knew it was racist. Much like the Pats crowd Dodge mentioned and lets be honest N'do is a lazy, money grabbing, **** and he shouldn't forget it

**Dalymountrower** · 23/03/2009, 7:30 AM

Originally Posted by Hairy Bowsie

Ah for christs sake, it a stupid chant but i doubt even any of the people chanting it knew it was racist. Much like the Pats crowd Dodge mentioned and lets be honest N'do is a lazy, money grabbing, **** and he shouldn't forget it

Tough times for taxi drivers alright if you have time to post at 1.20 a.m..

**Dalymountrower** · 23/03/2009, 8:51 AM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Found out it was Rovers fans. No idea of the amount. Definitely only a handful of pats fans attempted it last year (skanger kids mostly)

In fairness to a lot of Rovers fans they have identified it as unacceptable racial abuse. I was simply trying to gauge the reaction without identifying the club or player.