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Thread: Comparison of Irish clubs in Europe versus Scottish clubs in Europe

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    Now with extra sauce! Dodge's Avatar
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    Comparison of Irish clubs in Europe versus Scottish clubs in Europe

    Ireland
    Played 16
    Won 8
    Drew 4
    Lost 4

    Scotland
    Played 13
    Won 0
    Drew 3
    Lost 10

    Every Scottish team exited at the earliest possible stage. Scotland still has one game to play. Their draws have been at home to English, Danish and Lithuanian opposition. In the knockout competitions, they've lost out to Swedish, French, Norwegian and Lithuanian opposition.
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    Like the Fonz. Only a dog. Mr A's Avatar
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    Skewed by the fact that they enter competitions at later and more difficult stages though..

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    Now with extra sauce! Dodge's Avatar
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    Not completely skewed though. Rangers exited competition at same stage as Drogheda. Hibs exited one round earlier than bohs. Queen of the South went out a round before Pats. Motherwell the same round. And Elfsborg, who pats drew with away and beat at home, beat Hibs home and away.

    The stats, of course, are meaningless. I just posted them as I saw them elsewhere and thought they were interesting enough.

    Wonder does anyone have stats for the non Old Firm Scottish clubs in europe in the last 5/6 years
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    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    They're easily gotten on something like bert kassies' site, but they're not dissimilar. Outside the Old Firm (and Aberdeen last year), I think most Scottish sides have struggled to get beyond the First Round. That'd include Gretna being hammered by Derry.

    Edit - damn, no-one's biting to Dodge's workload, and I've nothing better to do during lunch.

    Exclusing the InterToto, which isn't on the Bert Kassies site -

    2007/08
    P-W-D-L
    Derry - 2-0-1-1
    Drogheda - 4-1-2-1
    St Pat's - 2-0-1-1

    Dunfermline - 2-0-1-1 (lost to a second division Swedish side)
    Aberdeen got through the UEFA Cup groups and got knocked out by Bayers.

    2006/07
    Cork City - 4-1-1-2
    Drogheda - 4-2-1-1
    Derry - 6-3-2-1

    Gretna - 2-0-1-1 (lost to Derry)
    Hearts - 6-1-2-3 (beat a Bosnian side before losing to AEK and Sparta Prague in the CL and UEFA Cup respectively)

    2005/06
    Shels - 4-2-1-1
    Longford - 2-1-0-1
    Cork - 6-1-2-3

    Dundee United - 2-0-2-0 (lost on away goals to MyPa of Finland)
    Hibs - 2-0-1-1 (hammered away by Dnipro of Ukraine)

    2004/05
    Shels - 8-1-4-3
    Bohs - 2-0-1-1
    Longford - 2-0-0-2

    Dunfermline - 2-0-1-1 (lost to an Icelandic side)
    Hearts - 6-2-1-3 (made it into but not out of the UEFA Cup group)
    Last edited by pineapple stu; 26/11/2008 at 12:27 PM.

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    Just done a quick totalling using data on the Kassies site.

    Since 2000:

    Scottish Clubs (minus the Old Firm) - Played 70

    Won 19
    Drawn 21
    Lost 30

    The clubs involved:
    Aberdeen
    Dundee FC
    Dundee Utd
    Dunfermline
    Gretna
    Hearts
    Hibs
    Kilmarnock
    Livingston
    Motherwell
    Queen of the South
    St Johnstone
    Kom Igen, FCK...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodge View Post
    Rangers exited competition at same stage as Drogheda. Hibs exited one round earlier than bohs. Queen of the South went out a round before Pats. Motherwell the same round. And Elfsborg, who pats drew with away and beat at home, beat Hibs home and away.
    When i read this i was delighted. This shows that we do really have a great standard of player over here. Hopefully clubs in scotland and england realise this so we can start to demand a higher fee for are players being sold on the cheap
    We'll never die, we'll never die

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    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    Problem is, most of the players in the league are either out of contract, not being paid or both.

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    Youth Team Billy-Green's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Problem is, most of the players in the league are either out of contract, not being paid or both.
    Life just isn't fair
    We'll never die, we'll never die

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    Now with extra sauce! Dodge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    Problem is, most of the players in the league are either out of contract, not being paid or both.
    Good job Scottish football is so well run. No premier club would ever go bust there

    I knew the results were all available, I just wanted someone to compile it for me. Cheers pineapple and Reitoir
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodge View Post
    Good job Scottish football is so well run. No premier club would ever go bust there
    Except Gretna of course...
    Kom Igen, FCK...

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    Now with extra sauce! Dodge's Avatar
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    You get a pass, just, because you may still be celebrating a double but try turning on the sarcasm detector Reitoir
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    Just to be fair, I will point out that Hibs exited the Intertoto at the same stage as us. Not that it changes much.

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    International Prospect Lim till i die's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodge View Post
    Good job Scottish football is so well run. No premier club would ever go bust there
    Gretna were a freakshow and it's not fair to judge the SPL by their rise and fall.

    Realisticly it's light years ahead of the League of Ireland with regards to crowds, facilities, finances blah blah blah
    Davd, the winds blown, the winds blown, all of my dreams away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodge View Post
    You get a pass, just, because you may still be celebrating a double but try turning on the sarcasm detector Reitoir
    np - to be fair I'm still fairly locked from the celebrations on Sunday

    Trying gradually to come down...
    Kom Igen, FCK...

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    Now with extra sauce! Dodge's Avatar
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    Fair cop niall, thought it was different.

    Oh and LTID, where the grounds are vastly superior (mainly paid for by UK taxpayer) and the crowds slightly better (non Old Firm obviously), there finances are very much in the same state as ours (only on a bigger scale). Seriously, read up on the problems facing big clubs like Hibs and hearts.
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    International Prospect Lim till i die's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodge View Post
    and the crowds slightly better (non Old Firm obviously)
    Slightly better??

    Come on now Dodge.

    there finances are very much in the same state as ours (only on a bigger scale).
    Wage cuts nearly all round??

    Big clubs going to the wall on an annual basis??

    Not being flippant, just genuinely don't know.
    Davd, the winds blown, the winds blown, all of my dreams away.

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    Coach tiktok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lim till i die View Post
    Realisticly it's light years ahead of the League of Ireland with regards to crowds, facilities, finances blah blah blah
    ...but not in terms of european competition, which is the point of the thread.

    The facilities are much better obviously, which contributes IMO directly to the crowds they get, it's something we seriously need to address over here, even small improvements could help.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tiktok View Post
    ...but not in terms of european competition, which is the point of the thread.
    Using the European exploits of Irish clubs which grossly overspent to achieve said exploits as a barometer for the standard of the League of Ireland is every bit as silly as using Gretna as a barometer for the state of the SPL

    Besides, I was responding to a specific point Dodge made, not the title of the thread
    Davd, the winds blown, the winds blown, all of my dreams away.

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    International Prospect Lim till i die's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiktok View Post
    The facilities are much better obviously, which contributes IMO directly to the crowds they get,
    On the facilities thing.

    Is Pittodrie for example, really that much more comfortable for watching a match than Turners Cross is??
    Davd, the winds blown, the winds blown, all of my dreams away.

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    Coach tiktok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lim till i die View Post
    Using the European exploits of Irish clubs which grossly overspent to achieve said exploits as a barometer for the standard of the League of Ireland is every bit as silly as using Gretna as a barometer for the state of the SPL
    Cork City's results have, ironically, been brutal in Europe since we started overspending. Back when we were running a tight ship we did much better.

    Personally, I think that the SPL -v- LoI arguments are pointless, but it is worth noting that the last two times that Irish and Scottish Clubs have faced each other in direct competition in Europe, the LoI side came out on top.

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