Team Selection against Bray

**joeSoap** · 07/10/2003, 8:54 AM

Time to stir some controversy on this board, and I am going to be probably the first one to criticise Mike Kerley. I know I'm going to incur the wrath of many of you, but its not a major criticism...not just yet anyway.
Derek McCarthy...top scorer, nine goals...dropped for Shane O'Donoghue. No problems with Shane at all apart from the obvious...he's not a striker. I spoke to a few of the lads after the game and I asked why Keatso was dropped. They thought it might have been a rap on the knuckles for playing GAA. Fair enough...so why start Brendan Hughes.
The logic behind dropping Carthy is both baffling and a concern. He was only on the field 10 minutes and he bagged one to get us back in the game. The ethics behind dropping Keatso and playing a man guilty of the same crime are equally baffling.
We now have all the squad back in harness for the run-in, and we have a very conceiveable opportunity to make the play-off, given Kildares apparent slump, and fixture list. I just hope that its used correctly and we get what we deserve out of it.

**LFC in Exile** · 07/10/2003, 9:24 AM

First off, I wasn't at the game so these comments have to be taken in that context.

I agree with you about dropping McCarthy - if it was a case of just dropping him i.e. he wasn't carrying an injury or something. I was told O'Donoghue played well, but Derek recently broke a long spell without a goal against Sligo so I would have started him.

As regards the Keating Affair I think there maybe more to this than is apparent. The two situations (Keating and Hughes) could be different - Hughes is only returning to the squad and maybe told Mike Kerley about his other commitments and maybe Keating didn't. It would be unfair to drop one to make a point and not the other. Unless thereis a mitigating factor, and taking into account Keatings performances all season I think he would have deserved a more lenient treatment than the prodigal Brendan Hughes.

I hope we do have the squad back in harness for the season. But we have trips to Monaghan, Donegal and Dundalk before the end of the season. And some of our players don't seem to like going to away matches....

By the way, is there anyhing the supporters club or even just the supporters can do to get a bus or transport organised for just these three remaining matches to give the lads as much of a chance as possible? I appreciate that the supporters club have very little money in the kitty so I'm not suggesting that is used - but just flagging something tangible that we could try to do.

Does any one know how much a bus to these places would cost?

**JohnD** · 07/10/2003, 10:52 AM

Hi Lads:

I have asked the Club and Mike Kerley about the bus. The SC were willing to fund a bus �300 approx to the Finn Harps game. However we have been told by the Manager that they would rather drive as they would be home quicker. At the SC meeting post Bray Game we discussed this.

Fair enough I suppose so we will use the money instead to put into some sort of End of Year function for the squad.

btw Agree with everyone re Derek He is our top scorer and should start. If anyone is to be dropped it must be Stevo who looks completly disinterested these days

John

**sadloserkid** · 07/10/2003, 2:51 PM

Goals aside Derek hasn't played particularly well this season. His fitness levels haven't impressed me over much either. Perhaps Mike just wanted to give him a rest and bring him on when his freshness would be an advantage. I can't explain the Keating/Hughes debate either unless of course Mike sees Hughes and not Keating as the partner for Sweeney in the long-term?

**gael353** · 07/10/2003, 3:50 PM

Mmmm agree with most but our two strikers havent been playing at all well in the last few weeks and Shane is big (in stature now lads come on no jokes) so a target man perhaps??? Keating being dropped and lets not forget cosgrove was a good thing in my opinion as knowone and thats knowone runs out on a team, to leave us down to the bare bones. It was nice to have subs though

quality ones too it has to be said. Id start Fyffe against Kilkenny next Tuesday. I think Mike as made a great start but he did **** up against Dub city away by putting John White in the corner = 2 goals for them. Dereck to get 2 vs Cobh lads bet ye!

lims fan · 07/10/2003, 4:19 PM

as to why mccarthy didn't start - this is bad management pure and simple. Where are people getting this half witted opinion that he is not fully fit yet. For god's sake he is banging them in and chases down EVERY ball! Foley didn't get half the stick that McCarthy and O'Flynn are getting and he was the biggest muppet ever to wear a jersey in football and people who suggest o'flynn is not performing obviously didn't see his great display in kildare.
Its back to the small mindedness when the **** players get lauded and the good players get criticised and this is stupid.

**sadloserkid** · 07/10/2003, 4:46 PM

Originally posted by lims fan
Where are people getting this half witted opinion that he is not fully fit yet.

Simple. We go to the games, see him stop running long before the end and make an informed, intelligent decision. You might wanna try making some yourself some time. McCarthy is a decent striker but anybody with even the tiniest football brain can see that he's knackered long before the end of any match we play. As well as that he's missed dozens of good chances this year (gael 353 could probably provide a full list) with that appaling miss in Whitehall taking pride of place in my mind. He's worked hard enough and scored goals for us (about one third of what Alan Murphy has managed though if you really want to see a striker who's banging them in) but don't get too carried away. Foley got more stick than either McCarthy or O'Flynn ever have though and anybody who reads back over this message board can testify to that.

It's back to the close-mindedness where certain players can seemingly do no wrong and others seem only to exist to be shot at no matter how well they perform.

**Nempton** · 07/10/2003, 8:17 PM

I agree with Dar on this about Derek been dropped. Yes he's our top scorer but in recent games he's not been doing the business. From a personal point of view I'd like to see him start but been realistic about it Mike was right to drop him. Twitch played better than most other Limerick players in the first half against Bray, he competed and he put himself about, qualities which we have criticised him for not doing in the past. It also gives Derek a wake up call and reminds him that he has to perform week in week out. I think the Limerick attack is too centred on O'Flynn, who wants the ball played over the top and into the corner so he can perform a few tricks before putting a cross in. The likes of Derek and Heffo like the ball played to feet which we don't do enough of. As for Keating well I was surprised to see him dropped but the team has been playing well since he's been missing so why change a team thats doing well. Mike made the change up front 'cos he thought this to be the one thing that needed shaking up. If we are going to start scratching our heads over team selection then I feel that Cosgrave should start on the wing instead of Sugrue 'cos he played some intelligent passes. I'd guess that Derek will start against Cobh but I for one am not going to criticise Mike who I feel has done a fantastic job this season.

**sadloserkid** · 07/10/2003, 8:24 PM

Originally posted by Nempton
I for one am not going to criticise Mike who I feel has done a fantastic job this season.

Hear hear Nempton.

I also agree with you regarding Cosgrove. My starting XI right now would be

Healy (for about 2 weeks until Fyffe is ready)

O'Mahony Purcell Finucane Keating

Heffernan Hughes Sweeney Cosgrove

McCarthy O'Flynn

Subs: Fyffe (but not for long hopefully), Molan, Whyte, Sugrue, O'Donoghue

lims fan · 08/10/2003, 7:59 AM

you guys never once gave foley this kind of scrutiny. Mc carthy is averaging a goal for every FULL game he plays. What did foley average? Are you pining for a return of the foley-mannering partnership? We have our best strikeforce in 15 years and all you guys can do is slag them off even when they score.

**joeSoap** · 08/10/2003, 8:33 AM

I agree with the lads on Dereks fitness levels, but I cannot believe that he was dropped ..pure and simple. And what is particularly more confusing in my book is that he played Shane up front instead of him. Shane will be the first to tell you that he is not a striker, and I know he was as surprised as anybody to be up there on Sunday. As was pointed out, Derek does score goals, plain and simple. He is a striker of high quality with one key element....Instinct. That instinct in my opinion makes up for the hopefully temporary shortfall in fitness. Sugrue should have been dropped, and Shane on the right imo.
I don't want to make this sound as if I'm being constantly critical...I think Mike Kerley has done an amazing job to date given his ridiculous lack of resources, but the fitness levels of the players in general seems to be down on what it was, not just with Derek, but I spoke to a few of the lads recently and I got the impression that training is not quite what it should be, and maybe this is not helping. Maybe Mike should seek help in this area from a fitness expert. He is still learning the ropes, and maybe a fitness coach would bring that lacking edge out in the guys.

**joeSoap** · 08/10/2003, 8:46 AM

Originally posted by sadloserkid
My starting XI right now would be

Healy (for about 2 weeks until Fyffe is ready)

O'Mahony Purcell Finucane Keating

Heffernan Hughes Sweeney Cosgrove

McCarthy O'Flynn

Subs: Fyffe (but not for long hopefully), Molan, Whyte, Sugrue, O'Donoghue

I would have thought that Conor Molan was probably the most improved member of the squad this season?? Don't you think that dropping an in-form player who's game is largely built on confidence, for to play someone out of position is particularly strange??

**sadloserkid** · 08/10/2003, 9:11 AM

Originally posted by lims fan
Mc carthy is averaging a goal for every FULL game he plays.

That's complete and utter rubbish and typical of the drivel you resort to when you know you've put your foot in your mouth but are too proud to admit it. Nobody is castigating Derek McCarthy. You have this childish mentality where certain players can be questioned and others can't. Derek McCarthy has scored 9 goals this season despite starting (and playing the majority of) practically every game. If you can't see that he tends to run out of gas late on then you know nothing about football. It's really that simple.

And as for this tripe...

Originally posted by JoeSoap
would have thought that Conor Molan was probably the most improved member of the squad this season?? Don't you think that dropping an in-form player who's game is largely built on confidence, for to play someone out of position is particularly strange??

1. Conor Molan isn't a natural left-back. He's out of position every game he plays effectively.

2. Eoin Keating has often played left-back for us so it's hardly out of position for him using the same mysterious criteria you use for Conor.

3. The fact that Conor Molan is a 'confidence player' never bothered you when you were abusing the hell out of him last season.

4. He was very poor against Bray.

Happy now? I know Joe Soap will be anyway, he likes this kind of conflict.

**LFC in Exile** · 08/10/2003, 9:15 AM

IMO Kerley is doing a fine job. I don't think there is a manager in the world who could pick a team that every fan would agree with. Dropping McCarthy must have been a close call. I don't know if he is fully fit, carrying an injury or whatever (only he knows that) but maybe the switch was tactical i.e. take a point off Bray or it was sending a message to McCarthy (and the team) that nobody is guaranteed their place and every one has to work to keep it. That is a particular problem given the lack of options up front.

I agree that Molan is a fine player and worth his place. I don't want to speak for SLK but Keating is such a fine player that he has to be accommodated somewhere, though Hughes brings a lot to the centre of the field.

I like Sugrue on the right. He is a good player and has a great understanding with O'Mahoney.

One issue that has caused me a lot of angst this season is the team's refusal to play a wide game. We have some of the finest wingers in the division, Sugrue, Cosgrave, Heffernan, O'Donoghue and still O'Flynn comes short or else wants it over the top. We should be taking full-backs on and getting crosses into the box for O'Flynn. McCarthy isn't the tallest but he has got quite a few headed goals this season. Whenever we play it wide we do well. Long balls from the full backs are just meat and drink to most of the centre halves in the first division.

**joeSoap** · 08/10/2003, 9:30 AM

Originally posted by sadloserkid

And as for this tripe...

1. Conor Molan isn't a natural left-back. He's out of position every game he plays effectively.

2. Eoin Keating has often played left-back for us so it's hardly out of position for him using the same mysterious criteria you use for Conor.

3. The fact that Conor Molan is a 'confidence player' never bothered you when you were abusing the hell out of him last season.

4. He was very poor against Bray.

Happy now? I know Joe Soap will be anyway, he likes this kind of conflict.

Dead right slk....I do love all of this kind of conflict...particularly when you accuse Lims fan of filling the board with tripe, when in fact it was me!!

.I posted the Molan bit....actually do think that he's quite improved since last season, and do think that he's our best option at left-full. However, please feel free to castigate others, its brightening up a miserable morning!!

**Nempton** · 08/10/2003, 1:42 PM

I spoke to a few of the lads recently and I got the impression that training is not quite what it should be,

I heard the opposite to this that training under Mike is quite enjoyable in fact. Maybe the guys your talking to don't like training. I don't think that they are unfit, their playing a match every week and training as well. It was even commented in the papers when we drew one all with Sligo how Limerick was first to the ball. Believe me these guys are fit just look at how they kept going against Bray last Sunday, they didn't tire once. As for Derek been dropped, it was a kick in the teeth for him and he was disappointed. He wasn't dropped because of concerns over fitness. He was dropped in favour of Shane. The one thing I'll say about Shane is that he has a geat shot on him but I'm all for Derek playing from the start.

you guys never once gave foley this kind of scrutiny. Mc carthy is averaging a goal for every FULL game he plays. What did foley average? Are you pining for a return of the foley-mannering partnership? We have our best strikeforce in 15 years and all you guys can do is slag them off even when they score.

Everyone here is in favour of Derek. If it came down to a choice between Ciaran and Derek we'd all pick Derek. No one has slagged Derek that I am aware of. All we have said is that he's not at playing at his best at the moment. Now if thats what you call an insult then you are either one of 2 things, 1. a moron or 2. a moron. Which one is it? Seriously don't jump the gun on everything you see here on foot.ie, actually read whats been said. Thanks.

would have thought that Conor Molan was probably the most improved member of the squad this season??

I agree with you Joe I think Conor Molan has done a fantastic job this season at left back. He didn't have a super game in the first half against Bray but look at Paddy Purcell he made a lot more mistakes and nothing has been said about that. I would find it hard to drop Conor for Eoin, despite Keating been a very good player.

the team's refusal to play a wide game

Your talking to the converted here I wish they would pass the ball a lot more, ie to feet, and link up for one-twos and just work the ball out wide but saying that I think they have played some good football this season and in this division a lot of teams play direct football and get the results. So bottom line, i don't care how they play for the remainder of the season just so long as they over take Kildare.

**LFC in Exile** · 08/10/2003, 3:30 PM

Fair enough Nempton. When it comes to the blues I am not a football fan I am a Limerick fan. If punting the ball up in the air meant we could get into the play-offs then that whats should be done.

We both agree though that this would be less effective than using the wings more, and putting centre halves under pressure by turning them towards their own goals. It would mean Stevo having to remain as an out and out striker i.e. less fancy stuff and more goal poaching.

**sadloserkid** · 09/10/2003, 10:14 AM

Originally posted by joeSoap
Dead right slk....I do love all of this kind of conflict...particularly when you accuse Lims fan of filling the board with tripe, when in fact it was me!!

Heh-heh-heh, yes I too can do stupid things at times.