Steve Finnan joins Espanyol

[gspain]

Either a tear or strain hopefully just a strain. Scan today.

[irishfan86]

I'm happy to have Finnan back, and if the only way he'll play for us is if he gets to play at right back, that's fine.

But why is it okay to play left back for Espanyol and not okay to play left back for Ireland?

[third policeman]

I'm happy to have Finnan back, and if the only way he'll play for us is if he gets to play at right back, that's fine.

But why is it okay to play left back for Espanyol and not okay to play left back for Ireland?

Did he actually say he was not prepared to play left back for us?

[Dodge]

But why is it okay to play left back for Espanyol and not okay to play left back for Ireland?

Because if he refuses them, he's out of a job

[geysir]

Did he actually say he was not prepared to play left back for us?

No he did not say that. And Dodge should know he did not say that.

In reference to
'Kerr having a preference for Stephen Carr at right-back, opting either to use Finnan out of position or not at all'.
Finnan responded
: "That was a frustrating time for me. I am a right-back, full stop. But I never really played in my position under Brian. I didn't feel I got a fair crack of the whip."

If Finnan was playing for a club who treated his football ability in the same way for year after year, he would have asked to move to a club that would play him at RB, or at least express that it was frustrating time.

[Dodge]

No he did not say that. And Dodge should know he did not say that

When did I say he did or didn't?

I only pointed out that players are more likely to be flexible with their clubs as their livelihoods depend on it. Far too many simply don't care enouigh about the national sides

[geysir]

This is a thread about Steve Finnan and the question was asked about Finnan.
The merest glance over Steve Finnan's club history will tell you that the position he was chosen to play was RB.
The merest glance over his Irish caps tells you he was flexible. In fact for 5 years he was flexible in almost every game that he was selected for and flexible when he was dropped.

In general, players at international level are flexible. They have a favoured position but play in other positions when asked. In general I'd say that a player at club level is regularly chosen to play in his favoured position.

[third policeman]

I know that Kilbane is now a candidate for cannonisation, but i still worry about his defensive capabilities against the likes of Italy and Bulgaria. We have good cover at right back (not Kelly) in the shape of Foley and Joey O'Brien, so maybe finnan is needed more at left back? Posted onto the Chris McCann thread earlier about how many of our better "younger" players (McCann, Foley, Garvan, O'Toole, McCarthy, Walters and St Ledger etc) are not being brought on when we have so many substandard players (Kelly, McShane, Bruce, Miller, Whelan, Long, Murphy) holding down places simply because they were hanging around at the right time or Brady knew who they were.

I dont doubt Trap's ability to get the best out of players, but I am sure he could get more out of better, younger players who are on the way up. I've just caught on how far off the thread I've digressed so i'll shut up and sign off.

[tetsujin1979]

Why not Kelly? He's a decent right back. Joey O'Brien hasn't played in defence (never mind right full) in over a year. He's been in midfield for Bolton under Megson.

[NeilMcD]

I know that Kilbane is now a candidate for cannonisation, but i still worry about his defensive capabilities against the likes of Italy and Bulgaria. We have good cover at right back (not Kelly) in the shape of Foley and Joey O'Brien, so maybe finnan is needed more at left back? Posted onto the Chris McCann thread earlier about how many of our better "younger" players (McCann, Foley, Garvan, O'Toole, McCarthy, Walters and St Ledger etc) are not being brought on when we have so many substandard players (Kelly, McShane, Bruce, Miller, Whelan, Long, Murphy) holding down places simply because they were hanging around at the right time or Brady knew who they were.

I dont doubt Trap's ability to get the best out of players, but I am sure he could get more out of better, younger players who are on the way up. I've just caught on how far off the thread I've digressed so i'll shut up and sign off.

What makes Foley better than Kelly then.

Whelan has been man of the match for 2 intertnational games but he should be dropped for players with potential. It seems you have picked names that are not in the squad and are some way to have a dig at the manager. I see very little evidence for mose of the ones that are not in the squad over the ones that are. Although I agree that Miller should not be in the squad.

Is that a sly dig at Kilbane in the first part of your post as it would say it all if you did not like Kilbane but you are a big fan of Stephen Ireland.

[third policeman]

What makes Foley better than Kelly then.

Whelan has been man of the match for 2 intertnational games but he should be dropped for players with potential. It seems you have picked names that are not in the squad and are some way to have a dig at the manager. I see very little evidence for mose of the ones that are not in the squad over the ones that are. Although I agree that Miller should not be in the squad.

Is that a sly dig at Kilbane in the first part of your post as it would say it all if you did not like Kilbane but you are a big fan of Stephen Ireland.

No I love and totally respect Kilbane. It's just that he has very little experience at left back. Contrary to an assertion on a different thread he did not play that many games there for Wigan last season and is not playiong there now either.. I suppose the reference to "cannonisation" did have a link to Stephen Ireland. Kilbane has been slated on this site for years, but he is now being acclaimed not so much for his performances but for always turning up (even when sporting a broken cheek bone).

Still reckon that Foley is different class to the Birmingham reserve, Kelly. Lets see where they both are in two years time and which one of them is playing in the premiership and for Ireland? McCann, O'Toole, Garvan and McCarthy are players who are being watched regularly by premiership clubs and I reckon at least thee of them will be playing there in the not too ditant future. Whelan was let go by one Premiership club and is now on the bench at another which is not exactly blessed with midfield talent. He did a job for us in two games against mediocre teams. Let's see how he copes against better class opposition.

[Baker]

Doesnt look too good for the Cyprus game....

From http://jp.goal.com/en/Articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=881318

A slight tear in his left thigh muscle means that he could be out for as long as three weeks and will certainly miss out on the glamorous visit of Barcelona to the Estadi Olímpic on Saturday.

[youngirish]

No I love and totally respect Kilbane. It's just that he has very little experience at left back. Contrary to an assertion on a different thread he did not play that many games there for Wigan last season and is not playiong there now either.. I suppose the reference to "cannonisation" did have a link to Stephen Ireland. Kilbane has been slated on this site for years, but he is now being acclaimed not so much for his performances but for always turning up (even when sporting a broken cheek bone).

Still reckon that Foley is different class to the Birmingham reserve, Kelly. Lets see where they both are in two years time and which one of them is playing in the premiership and for Ireland? McCann, O'Toole, Garvan and McCarthy are players who are being watched regularly by premiership clubs and I reckon at least thee of them will be playing there in the not too ditant future. Whelan was let go by one Premiership club and is now on the bench at another which is not exactly blessed with midfield talent. He did a job for us in two games against mediocre teams. Let's see how he copes against better class opposition.

I agree 100% about Whelan. All these posters on here who are singing his praises are the same people who were claiming Darren Potter was the next Roy Keane after a couple of good games against similarly poor opposition in the states a couple of seasons ago. Ireland will struggle against better teams with players of the quality of Whelan in the first team who is as I've stated countless times before a good Championship player but not Premiership standard and definitely not International standard. Hopefully he's just a stop gap until one of the players mentioned above gets a move to the Premiership which could be as soon as January (I can see Garvan or at a stretch McCann more confortably filling Whelan's position in an Ireland shirt than the others mentioned).

Foley is also a far better player than Kelly who has now found his level in the Championship IMO.

[Stuttgart88]

Whelan was let go by one Premiership club and is now on the bench at another which is not exactly blessed with midfield talent. He did a job for us in two games against mediocre teams. Let's see how he copes against better class opposition.

My own take on that is that Stoke are trying to get results through muscle not guile. We don't have the resources to do that in the Irish set up. Whelan & Reid have looked like the most functional CM pairing we've had since Keane & Kinsella. I'm not saying Whelan is the real deal but knocking his club status is a bit petty I think. He scored a winner and made a crucial goal saving tackle in the two competive games we've played so far and generally has kept the ball moving, has shown the moral courage to show to Dunne & O'Shea (as Dunne has exlicitly commended). I'm glad he's ahead of Miller, I think he uses the ball miles better than Carsley and is a very different type of player to some of the younger options coming through. He's also better equipped to play the role he plays than Andy Reid who has far more talent. Trapp has identified a role for him and he fills it well. Of the young tyros coming through they're all exciting prospects and I'd have some in the squad but none is that similar in style to Whelan - this is where I disagree with YI. Most are more like Steven Reid in my opinion.

Also, he wasn't let go by City though he obviously wasn't getting a look in for the first team at the time either.

[NeilMcD]

No I love and totally respect Kilbane. It's just that he has very little experience at left back. Contrary to an assertion on a different thread he did not play that many games there for Wigan last season and is not playiong there now either.. I suppose the reference to "cannonisation" did have a link to Stephen Ireland. Kilbane has been slated on this site for years, but he is now being acclaimed not so much for his performances but for always turning up (even when sporting a broken cheek bone).

Still reckon that Foley is different class to the Birmingham reserve, Kelly. Lets see where they both are in two years time and which one of them is playing in the premiership and for Ireland? McCann, O'Toole, Garvan and McCarthy are players who are being watched regularly by premiership clubs and I reckon at least thee of them will be playing there in the not too ditant future. Whelan was let go by one Premiership club and is now on the bench at another which is not exactly blessed with midfield talent. He did a job for us in two games against mediocre teams. Let's see how he copes against better class opposition.

First thing, How do you know these people who were slating Kilbane as you are saying, are now the same people who are praising him. There is not one opinion on this site but a collection of opinon and there is no consensus. You seem to be wanting to debate with a perceived consensus but its just a mix of opinions.

Also what Kilbane was slated for was his lack of ability to play centre mid and his lack of awareness for that role. His dedication to the cause was never questioned as far as I know. Now he is being praised for his further dedication due to injury etc and also the fact that people see the left back spot as a place that he can play and it is a role that suits him better than centre mid.

[NeilMcD]

I agree 100% about Whelan. All these posters on here who are singing his praises are the same people who were claiming Darren Potter was the next Roy Keane after a couple of good games against similarly poor opposition in the states a couple of seasons ago. Ireland will struggle against better teams with players of the quality of Whelan in the first team who is as I've stated countless times before a good Championship player but not Premiership standard and definitely not International standard. Hopefully he's just a stop gap until one of the players mentioned above gets a move to the Premiership which could be as soon as January (I can see Garvan or at a stretch McCann more confortably filling Whelan's position in an Ireland shirt than the others mentioned).

Foley is also a far better player than Kelly who has now found his level in the Championship IMO.

Name one person that said Darren Potter was the next Roy Keane. Secondly people said that Glen Wheland played well against Montenegro and Georgia,and he was voted man of the match by various people.

You have an awful habit of putting words in peoples mouths and using hyperbole to some how prove your argument. THere is a middle ground you know, for you it seems somebody is either great or they are utter pants. Usually the guy who is not being picked is the guy who is great and you want to make yourself look like some guy who scouts all over England and knows more than the average punter out there.

[NeilMcD]

My own take on that is that Stoke are trying to get results through muscle not guile. We don't have the resources to do that in the Irish set up. Whelan & Reid have looked like the most functional CM pairing we've had since Keane & Kinsella. I'm not saying Whelan is the real deal but knocking his club status is a bit petty I think. He scored a winner and made a crucial goal saving tackle in the two competive games we've played so far and generally has kept the ball moving, has shown the moral courage to show to Dunne & O'Shea (as Dunne has exlicitly commended). I'm glad he's ahead of Miller, I think he uses the ball miles better than Carsley and is a very different type of player to some of the younger options coming through. He's also better equipped to play the role he plays than Andy Reid who has far more talent. Trapp has identified a role for him and he fills it well. Of the young tyros coming through they're all exciting prospects and I'd have some in the squad but none is that similar in style to Whelan - this is where I disagree with YI. Most are more like Steven Reid in my opinion.

Also, he wasn't let go by City though he obviously wasn't getting a look in for the first team at the time either.

Well said a bit of balance and well thought out opinon on it. Fair play Stutts.

[youngirish]

Name one person that said Darren Potter was the next Roy Keane.

Plenty were singing his praises claiming he was brilliant having obviously never watched him before. I correctly stated he was sh*t having watched him in more than one game.

Secondly people said that Glen Whelan played well against Montenegro and Georgia,and he was voted man of the match by various people.

Both teams are the International equivalent of lower Championship teams possibly even League 1 in Georgia's case so I wouldn't read too much into those performances. All the goldfish on here as usual easily forget he was rubbish in the previous friendlies against better opposition.

THere is a middle ground you know, for you it seems somebody is either great or they are utter pants.

Not true I think Glen Whelan is average.

Usually the guy who is not being picked is the guy who is great and you want to make yourself look like some guy who scouts all over England and knows more than the average punter out there.

Not true I do just know more. Way more. It's a hard life being this clever though I can tell you.

[third policeman]

First thing, How do you know these people who were slating Kilbane as you are saying, are now the same people who are praising him. There is not one opinion on this site but a collection of opinon and there is no consensus. You seem to be wanting to debate with a perceived consensus but its just a mix of opinions.

Also what Kilbane was slated for was his lack of ability to play centre mid and his lack of awareness for that role. His dedication to the cause was never questioned as far as I know. Now he is being praised for his further dedication due to injury etc and also the fact that people see the left back spot as a place that he can play and it is a role that suits him better than centre mid.

Kilbane has had very very few supporters on this site whether he was playing centre mid or left mid. I have nothing agsinst him and totally admire his dedication to the cause. I dont think however that dedication ncessarily makes him our best option at left full. Finnan is a natural full back and has played in both fullback positions. O'Brien has also played many more times as a full back than Kilbane, and Foley is getting rave reviews at Wolves. I am not saying that Kilbane should never get a game, but that we should be willing to consider the possibility of playing Finnan there given our overall fullback options.

[NeilMcD]

Kilbane has had very very few supporters on this site whether he was playing centre mid or left mid. I have nothing agsinst him and totally admire his dedication to the cause. I dont think however that dedication ncessarily makes him our best option at left full. Finnan is a natural full back and has played in both fullback positions. O'Brien has also played many more times as a full back than Kilbane, and Foley is getting rave reviews at Wolves. I am not saying that Kilbane should never get a game, but that we should be willing to consider the possibility of playing Finnan there given our overall fullback options.

Again, who was saying he is our best option at left back. Kilbane had lots of people sticking up for him, both a few years ago and now also. He has also had his critics but his critics were never against him personally it was more to do with his ability to play centre mid. He is a dedicated player for Ireland who has probably found his best position for Ireland. Is he the best option, that is open to debate which is fair enough.