QuoteWatch much LOI? I think the point he was making was that the team didn't try and the LOI lads would have. I'm fairly certain he wasn't claiming they were better playersOriginally Posted by Fergie's Son
You're right, would have been 8-0.
Please stop with the LOI stuff. Most LOI players are not good enough for the Irish team. John O'Shea may be poor but he's a lot better than most LOI players.
There is no such thing as a miracle cure, a free lunch or a humble opinion.
Watch much LOI? I think the point he was making was that the team didn't try and the LOI lads would have. I'm fairly certain he wasn't claiming they were better players
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I disagree. The team did try they just weren't good enough.
They were outclassed by a better team and all the huffing and puffing in the world would not have changed that.
There is no such thing as a miracle cure, a free lunch or a humble opinion.
First off, thank god this was just a friendly. Player-wise, I don't think that there was much more Staunton could have done considering all the absentees. Our BEST 4 players were out FFS. And do we really think a Paddy McCarthy would have made much of a difference? I am not saying he should not have been called up for this as I think he and McShane should have been, but I don't think they would have made much of a difference.
The bottom line is that we simply are not that good. Maybe when we have everyone available, we might be able to hold out for a draw in Germany. I think Staunton made a big mistake at the end of last season by not playing an extra 3-4 friendlies against World Cup bound teams to give the likes of McGeady, McCarthy, McShane, Ireland etc more time to gel with the team and deal with problem areas such as centre-back and midfield.
"Jacques Santini...will be greeted in every dugout of the country by "one-nil, one-nil" - Clive Tyldsley, 89th minute of France-England June 13, 2004.
"Ooooohhhh Nooooooo" Bobby Robson 91st minute.
Well Ireland is injured and may not even get his game for Man. City.
A few positives from tonight:
McGeady, in the first half with two Dutch players on him, doing a Zidane move to spin away from them. It's been a looooong time since I've seen an Irish player with this much skill.
Paddy Kenny isn't that bad.
Doyle looks good.
Other than that...the Germans are a team that runs and runs so that will play to our strength.....
Can't believe the $$ I am spending to get to Stuttgart...oh well, hope lives eternal!
There is no such thing as a miracle cure, a free lunch or a humble opinion.
You pick a game when we had 8 squad withdrawals in order to prove your point, I see.It was a clueless, passionless performance, and a sad way to mark the last friendly at Lansdowne.
But it's also a one-off, the game in Germany will see a different, fitter, hungrier Irish side, with most if not all the big names back. I wouldn't panic because of the Holland result. Just one of those nights.
Last edited by mypost; 17/08/2006 at 3:28 AM.
Lets face it. We have zero chance of qualifying from the group. With that in mind lets concentrate on the next world cup.
Get rid of Kilbane and Clinton. Complete liabilities.
Get rid of Staunton. Players don't respect him. They think he's a mate. Duff, Keane et al need someone who frightens the ****e out of them. Good footballers but lazy buggers.
4-0, 8-0, whats the difference? At least with some eL players in the side you are going to improve the level here rather than just picking players because they work over the water. When we were down to 16 players the chance was there to call in 3 or 4 eL players.
eircom league players as squad members?Sure.they would put a bit of pride in their jersey anyway.bryne looked ok v chile.if they were in the squad i would say it would add a bit more meanin to the training matches!
was dissappointed with kav tonight.i thought that he did well against chile.i expected him to impose himself more.the midfield role was there for him to take and make his own.that was the biggest downer for me tonight with the players.and morrison was as useless as he normally is.
so does this mean drubbing mean ye'd take nolan?
hehe....
Depending on the result in germany - I would seriously consider hanging youngsters in the squad for the next games against czechs and cyprus. I think the fight for 2nd place will be a real dog fight - I would fear the welsh and the slovaks more than the czechs to be honest.
McGeady, Alan O'Brien, Joey O'Brien, Ireland - mccarthy and mcshane shoudl be brought into the squad - I know people will they totally lack experience but to be honest I would prefer these players to get experience.
If everyone is fit my team for Germany is
Given
Finnan
Dunne
O'Brien
Harte
McGeady
Reid
Reid
Duff
Keane
Doyle
That team is not too bad at all and is capable of getting a result if they play their hearts out - I include Harte because of his skill at free kicks....and our other options for left back aren't an awful lot better than him and dont have the free kicks skills
The players tried but were comprehensivly outplayed in every area.
The guys on the rte radio panel (names? heavy dub accents, sound all the same to me) were spot on with their comments. There was no pressure on the Dutch playing the ball out from the back. Our front 3 couldn't close down for shíte. If Kilbane did move forward then Van de Saar finds Huntelaar in space. All reminiscent of the home game against France. Or else the Dutch play it around toying until a space appears.
As soon as our back 4 have the ball the dutch are closing us down effectively, ball is pumped for safety or possesion lost
It was all so natural for the Dutch.
Staunton was right about Alan O'Brien, what a prospect.
Worst moment was Reid getting injured early. More feckin' injuries to key players.
Last edited by geysir; 17/08/2006 at 7:26 AM.
Gents i once created a popular thread about ireland goin the way of scotland and northern ireland (actually they r better than us )..........
Devastation and a massacre awaits in germany and for the 1st time in my 26 years i will not even watch the game.
I am a dundalk man and was drinking in a bar staunton sometimes drinks in......everybody discussed how much a joke it is him getting the job (that was even before the kick off)
I know we are short of players but come on drop these donkeys like
Kilbane (how the hell is this guy in every irish team)
Kavanagh (no comment)
O' SHEA (mother of god please)
Morrison
It was embarrassing to watch. It was a stroll for the Dutch, I'm bloody relieved I didn't fork out on coming home for the game, I nearly did but the Stuttgart trip wiped me. My thoughts on a player by player basis?
Paddy Kenny - no saves to make but what is the point of kicking the ball long every time? It went straight to the Dutch who attacked us all over again. Look how Van Der Sar varies his distribution - short, long, throws it out etc. Never gives the ball away.
Carr - looked like he wanted to be back in Newcastle. Should have stayed retired if that is the attitude.
Finnan - in limbo on the left, had to go onto his right foot every time. One of the best RB in the PL was wasted.
O'Brien and O'Shea - Didn't pick up their markers at set pieces. Didn't close down and lack pace - to sum it up they are both ****.
MacGeady - only bright spark in the team that was in the first 11. Lots of promise and exciting to watch. Will improve as well.
Kavanagh - useless. Gave the ball away by playing it long EVERY feckin time.
S Reid - got injured and ineffective.
Kilbane - no comment.
Elliot - Kept his head up after making that God awful but Doyle is a better player IMO and the Reading man offers something.
Clinton - ran round like a headless chicken but had nothing to work on.
Subs -
O'Brien, Doyle and Douglas made an impact and looked hungry. Miller made a promising start, took some good corners but was careless on a good few occasions.
Ireland were terrible, The Dutch had to do very little to get 4 goals and it could have been much much more.
Staunton was and is a terrible appointment, no amount of FAI bull$h!t is going to cover that up.
It's all very well to say drop players like Kilbane, Kav, Morrisson, O'Shea but you need to replace them with players capable of performing at this level.
We either go cap in hand to the likes of Kevin Nolan and use the granny rule to get players into the fold or we accept that the rebuilding process takes time.
From my limited knowldge of EL football there would be some players capable of making the step up, the evidence is alrready pretty strong. Kevin Doyle went from the EL to among the top scorers in the Championship within 10 months and then the Ireland side. As someone else pointed out Murphy hardly set Waterfors alight but he's scoring in the Championship now and in the Ireland squad.
Why do we have to wait for verification from some English club manager before giving these guys a chance?
Reading this board for sometime I have come to the conclusion that Irish Supporters have a false sense of our level of talent, where expectation exceeds actual talent, As a nation our talent pool peaked in 88 / 90, the conditions in the English League allowed for this, less foreign players and money meant English coaches nurtured Irish talent instead of discarding it for quick solutions from Eastern Europe, Africa, Asia and beyond.. the result was such fine players as Ronnie Whelan, Paul McGrath, Liam Brady etc.. Throw in an old school no nonsense coach and the result was Euro 88, Italia 90 and a spin-off in 94 before the premiership took hold and less Irish players developed.
Qualifying for 2002 was down to the exceptional talents of one of the finest player in the World in 2000 /2001 at his peak. FACT!
Looking at the dirge served up last nite it is clear times have changed we don't have the players we had back in 89 or an exceptional player of grit like we had in 2001. No instead we have Morrison, Kavanagh, Miller, O'Shea, Carr, Kilbane Etc.. How can we ever expect to achieve again in the short to medium term?
I'd agree with that 100%.
No O'Shea, No Kilbane, No Morrison, No Kavanagh.
Those four players may as well play for the opposition for all the good they do.
Yesterdays result was embaressing. However it was necessary in recognising our weaknesses and strenghts. The fact that the forementioned players were playing with a completely different approach to the game (ie hoof and hope) to players like Finnan and Mc Geedy (short patient passing, finding a player when in possession) shows Staunton as a huge weakness in that his message for approaching the match was not made clear.
The positive is the youth. The second half showed us our potential. Mix this potential with first team players like Duff, Keane and Given and you have talent and experience. Leave in Kilbane, Kavanagh, Morrision and O'Shea and we leave ourselves exposed in each respective area of the pitch. I'd inlcude Harte too but there, as mentioned, we have little in the way of choice.
Limerick 3:7
"Marvel not that I said unto thee, ye must be born again"
The worrying aspect of this performance is that all the players who started tonight are either in our first X1 or are seriously looking to be part of it. There was no on the pitch , apart from Kenny and Carr that I haven't heard people mention as their first choice X1.
It was a shocking performance, the worst defending i have ever seen.
Positives: Kevin Doyle ( has to start in Germany). And Alan O'Briens pace. Sadly thats it.
Also disappointing was Stauntons complete lack of analysis after the game. Does he have no idea what happened out there last night??? At least if he gave proper analysis, he'd be giving people a sense that he understands the game.
Last night was an absolute shambles IMHO and proved what I've said all along. Aiden McGeady should be a starting XI player for Ireland. He was far and away the most comfortable Ireland player on the pitch.
People talk about experience but McGeady is only 20 but has CL experience and has played plenty of matches in front of a very demanding 60,000 home crowd.
Guys like Kavanagh and Elliot are nothing more than battle hardened Championship cloggers and for them to keep a young talent like McGeady out the team is a disgrace.
Aiden must start in Germany!
"Everyone, Republican or otherwise, has their own particular part to play. No part is too great or too small, no one is too old or too young to do something
-- Bobby Sands
I wonder were the Dutch Boards a bit like this after we won 2-0 in Amsterdam in a friendly with players like Alan Quinn and Graham Barrett in the side.
Seen it all before. The clamour for LOI players in the side (many of whom failed in the UK) when things go bad. 3 games into a manager's career and he has to go
I'd sooner have the **** ups here than in Germany. Looks like a Dunne/O'Brien centre partnership with O'Shea at left full back. Kilbane was caught out of position numerous times when he went back there.
Centre midfield in the real problem and I can't think of any solutions I am afraid. Kavanagh is a holding roll in front of the back 4 and S. Reid. Backs to the wall in Germany but I have been watching football long enough to know that managers go from zero to hero in the space of one game. Who knows but we must believe. Hard to on the evidence of last night but there were two positives in McGeady and Doyle.
Forget about the performance or entertainment. It's only the result that matters.
Didn't see the game at all as I had a game myself. Reading all the posts I can only imagine how bad it was.
I think it will be slightly different in Germany though. We will have a stronger squad (Please God!) and a couple of weeks more fitness under us as well as a couple of competitive games.
Germany are not as technically sound as Holland (who incidently look like they are developing one of the best young sides around in years) and although they are technically better than us, they rely on workrate like us also. This opens up different avenues and presents differents prospects towards the game.
It's important to remeber that we were down to the bare bones and only 1 of the players has played a competitive game so far so I wouldn't be pressing the panic button just yet. However, if we suffer a heavy defeat in Stuttgart then I'd be having a serious think about Stauntons position if I was Delaney and co.
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