Gangland Crime

3 weeks ago, Paul Williams was able to write a front page story about a major league criminal from Finglas called John Daly. In this article, Williams said that Daly, recently released after a 9 year sentence, was a target for a hit, that a contract had been taken out on him and he even knew who the contract was given to. He also said that this would all take place within the next month.

Daly was blasted to death last night in a car in Finglas.

I know by and large that the Gardai are doing a good job with this whole gangland situation, but if Williams is privvy to these details, then you could be sure the Gardai were. I'm sure they're not at all upset that a scrote like this Daly is dead, but surely they could have had surveillance in place to catch the perpretatrors.

It is now reckoned that an all out gang war will occur, on a nationwide scale, as Daly had very strong ties to the Keane crime faction in Limerick. Williams reckoned that it was the McCarthy Dundon faction (the main adversary to the Keanes in Limerick) that were going to do the job because of Dalys association with Christy Keane, leader of the gang as it were.

Lately we've started to see innocent bystanders become victims because of their being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Hopefully we won't see too much more of it.

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

I know by and large that the Gardai are doing a good job with this whole gangland situation, but if Williams is privvy to these details, then you could be sure the Gardai were. I'm sure they're not at all upset that a scrote like this Daly is dead, but surely they could have had surveillance in place to catch the perpretatrors.

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They can't watch him 24/7 (nor should they). You can sure the Gardai know exactly who's responsible but as ever its very hard to prove anything when nobody will admit to seeing/knowing anything.

Its easy for Williams to use "unnamed sources" and print rumours, its way way harder to get actual facts about any of the cases.

Would've thought most of Williams sources would be cops anyway?

I don't think anything will happen, as the general population don't make the connection between gangsters killing gangsters and innocent party goers or plumbers getting caught in the cross fire. I'm sure there's threads in this very forum containing lines such as "who cares about one scumbag taking out another".

btw, it must have been some feckin wasp that the Government were talking about.

I see this is the chap the called Joe Duffy from his cell on his cell. I am sure that he did not do himself any favours by partaking in that little stunt.

With regard to gang on gang violence it is understandable when people say "so what" but as is rightly pointed out here it has a much wider knock on effect.

Is Williams the Irish Don? Maybe he knows too much...? :p

Conviction rates for murder in this country are very low (maybe someone knows the percentage) & I doubt it is any higher for gangland hits.

I am sure it is the same everywhere - no one really cares until innocent bystanders get killed & then public call for action.

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Originally Posted by pete

Is Williams the Irish Don? Maybe he knows too much...? :p

Conviction rates for murder in this country are very low (maybe someone knows the percentage) & I doubt it is any higher for gangland hits.

I am sure it is the same everywhere - no one really cares until innocent bystanders get killed & then public call for action.

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Think it's running at somewhere in and around 1 in 6 sees a conviction. I like those odds.

I will look for the stats, am sure it cant be as low in 1 in 6 especially for non gang land murders. My perception is that the clean up rate is high due in the main to help from the public.

Never understood why we don't allow the government to carry out contract killings over a short space of time on all gangland bosses/gang members, say if they were to send the army out for Ireland very own Night of the Long Knives (but with deserving people this time) and the general public just turns a blind eye to it.

Sure it could be construed as a minor act of genocide, as undoubtably a lot of people would die, and sure it could lead to a government that carries out contract killings on their rivals if the wrong people were in charge at the time, but, well I've always wanted to live in a Orwell novel so let's do this thing!!! :)

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Originally Posted by jebus

Never understood why we don't allow the government to carry out contract killings over a short space of time on all gangland bosses/gang members, say if they were to send the army out for Ireland very own Night of the Long Knives (but with deserving people this time) and the general public just turns a blind eye to it.

:)

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Not a bad idea but think of all the calls to Liveline as a result:p

i could never understand why Paul Williams hasnt been killed yet?!:confused:

i remember that liveline with that Daly fella and Paul was there talling the country about what he has done etc.... surprised even that particular fella didnt go after him

i know i would if i was one of those fellas and he was sniffing around like that....


but then to think of ALL the gangsters he's annoyed, really surprised he's still here.....

would it be that hard to find out where he lives?... is he bulletproof?!:confused:

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

i could never understand why Paul Williams hasnt been killed yet?!:confused:

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Maybe not everyone is as obsessed with him as he is with himself?

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Originally Posted by Dodge

Maybe not everyone is as obsessed with him as he is with himself?

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i know but you have to admit he's a bigger threat to these fellas then the cops are...he's putting there faces and names into public. just dont see why they havent even come together to sort him out!.

he's a brave man though, id live in another country if i was doing his work!! :D

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Originally Posted by pete

Is Williams the Irish Don? Maybe he knows too much...? :p

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Maybe Williams killed him.

Think about it.........you're a crime journo, you make write a piece about how some guy will be killed, then hey presto!! Another piece of brilliance from Williams. It would be a great way to get rid of people you don't like, and make yourself famous into the bargain. Just blame it on the gangs.

Wait until he starts writing about bank robberies, and then they happen. Next thing you know, Williams is a millionaire.

(This post contains no smilies, to keep Dodge happy)






(:cool:)

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Originally Posted by osarusan

(This post contains no smilies, to keep Dodge happy)

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Everything in that post made me happy

I have only very rarely read articles from "crime journos" but I found the quality of writing to be of exceptionally poor standard.

I presume the criminals take some sort of perverse pride in being profiled in the media as it possibly increases their notoriety. I would guess Williams gets a lot of his information from other criminals.

Investigative journalism as a whole barely exists in Ireland. Journalism as a whole barely exists in Ireland ffs. 90%+ of Irish journalists are press release recyclers, nothing more.

adam

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

i could never understand why Paul Williams hasnt been killed yet?

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So in your book, he deserves to be killed because he exposes what lowlifes do for a living? Nice.:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

i remember that liveline with that Daly fella and Paul was there talling the country about what he has done etc.... surprised even that particular fella didnt go after him

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You make it sound like Daly had a right to make that call, and that he had a right to kill Williams because Williams told the public what he was about? Even nicer.:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

i know i would if i was one of those fellas and he was sniffing around like that....

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Sounds like you have a lot of sympathy there for the lowlife degenerate, sadistic brutal murderous drug dealing bas tards like John Daly.

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

but then to think of ALL the gangsters he's annoyed, really surprised he's still here.....

would it be that hard to find out where he lives?... is he bulletproof?!:confused:

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It's common knowledge where he lives. Attempts have been made to get him. He has a 24 hour armed watch (funded by his employers).

I have not much time for Paul Williams. I believe him to be sensationalist, melodramatic and self-serving. But to say he deserves to die for what he does for a living is crass and ignorant.

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

So in your book, he deserves to be killed because he exposes what lowlifes do for a living? Nice.:rolleyes:

You make it sound like Daly had a right to make that call, and that he had a right to kill Williams because Williams told the public what he was about? Even nicer.:rolleyes:

Sounds like you have a lot of sympathy there for the lowlife degenerate, sadistic brutal murderous drug dealing bas tards like John Daly.


It's common knowledge where he lives. Attempts have been made to get him. He has a 24 hour armed watch (funded by his employers).

I have not much time for Paul Williams. I believe him to be sensationalist, melodramatic and self-serving. But to say he deserves to die for what he does for a living is crass and ignorant.

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Did I miss something? When I read his post i didnt think he was at all trying to insinuate he that Williams deserved to be shot.

The way I took it was that he was just surprised that the people he writes about who are scum would have qualms about killing him.

I took the 'if i were them line' to be If i was a a gangland criminal who tended to kill people then Id kill him....

NOt understanding it doesnt mean he agrees with it.

Correct me if Im wrong Gilberto Eire and you actually do think he deserves to die

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Originally Posted by micls

Did I miss something? When I read his post i didnt think he was at all trying to insinuate he that Williams deserved to be shot.

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I'm not a mind reader but comments like

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

i could never understand why Paul Williams hasnt been killed yet?!:confused:

i remember that liveline with that Daly fella and Paul was there talling the country about what he has done etc.... surprised even that particular fella didnt go after him
i know i would if i was one of those fellas and he was sniffing around like that....

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all make me think that Gilberto would not condemn any violent action taken against Williams. Perhaps if he made the point clearer, or used smilies appropriately.

Joe, I think Gilberto was saying that he's surprised he hasn't been killed as he seems to know a lot about crime and criminals, maybe too much for some criminals to feel comfortable.

I don't think he was saying Williams deserves to be shot.

Edit: You've already replied to original posts.

Points taken, and Gilberto, no offence meant. I'm having one of those f=days where I'd pick a row with the Pope....just ignore me...I'll go away.

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

Points taken, and Gilberto, no offence meant. I'm having one of those f=days where I'd pick a row with the Pope....just ignore me...I'll go away.

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So you're feeling like Ian Paisley today? how strange...

why in Gods name would i think he should be shot... i was putting myself in a gangsters position, and find it hard to comprehend how he's still doing his job after all this time!.

he's the biggest threat to the underworld since veronica guerin and we all know what happened there. not sure how many she investigated but i know Williams has gone through quite a few scumbags dirty laundry over the years.

and its even been highlighted in this thread how low the conviction rate is!!.

so there has to be something else to it?!:confused:

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Originally Posted by jebus

Never understood why we don't allow the government to carry out contract killings over a short space of time on all gangland bosses/gang members, say if they were to send the army out for Ireland very own Night of the Long Knives (but with deserving people this time) and the general public just turns a blind eye to it.

Sure it could be construed as a minor act of genocide, as undoubtably a lot of people would die, and sure it could lead to a government that carries out contract killings on their rivals if the wrong people were in charge at the time, but, well I've always wanted to live in a Orwell novel so let's do this thing!!! :)

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Originally Posted by Dwight K. Schrute

Better a thousand innocent men are locked up than one guilty man roam free...

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Or shot. Whatever works best. :) :cool:

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Originally Posted by dahamsta

90%+ of Irish journalists are press release recyclers, nothing more.

adam

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You should see how we learn to approach press releases in college adam, you'd love it.

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

I have not much time for Paul Williams. I believe him to be sensationalist, melodramatic and self-serving.

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Like most journalists then.

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

Williams said that Daly, recently released after a 9 year sentence, was a target for a hit, that a contract had been taken out on him and he even knew who the contract was given to.

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If this was the case, why didn't he report it to the guards? Surely any decent human being who knows someone's going to be killed will report it, no matter how much of a low life the victim is.

I can honestly say I've never read any Paul Williams articles so I'm not exactly up-to-date with his reporting but either he's a very imaginative person who gets lucky with stories or he needs to take a long hard look at himself. He had information that someone was to be killed and he didn't inform the guards. And if he did, then that is a sickening approach by the guards. Justice is supposed to be unbiased.

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Originally Posted by superfrank

If this was the case, why didn't he report it to the guards? Surely any decent human being who knows someone's going to be killed will report it, no matter how much of a low life the victim is.

I can honestly say I've never read any Paul Williams articles so I'm not exactly up-to-date with his reporting but either he's a very imaginative person who gets lucky with stories or he needs to take a long hard look at himself. He had information that someone was to be killed and he didn't inform the guards. And if he did, then that is a sickening approach by the guards. Justice is supposed to be unbiased.

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Apparently the gardai have been aware of this for a while. Most of Williams info and leaks come from Garda Headquarters and low ranking wannabe criminals the Sunday World throws a few quid to. Its an easy, idealsitic outlook to have in saying that justice is meant to be unbiased.That never has, nor never will be the case. I firmly believe that these people(drug lords) are of absolutely no use to society and deserve to die by the sword by which they choose to live. They're not born drug dealers. They become them through greed. They live off the misfortune of poor addicts that in turn are driven to crime in order to feed their addictions. A swift bullet in the head is too good for John Daly, Marlo Hyland, Kieran Keane, Eddie Ryan and their likes. Don't get me started on what my idea of punishment for them would be....please.

Apparently the Gardai had warned Daly that his life was in danger and advised him on precautions to take. It was apparently common knowledge that his phone call to Duffy, which resulted in the searches that discovered a load of mobile phones, flat scren tv's and the budgies, had ****ed of some major crims.

The most expensive phone call he ever made:rolleyes:

Maybe we should emigrate to Perth, Australia where there hasn't been a murder in 6 months.

Drug baron suspect in gangland slaying

Daly ignored warning signs and paid the ultimate price
By Tom Brady Security Editor-Irish Independent
Tuesday October 23 2007


A major drug trafficker is a prime suspect for yesterday's clinical murder of gangland "hard man" and maverick, John Daly.

But senior garda officers leading the hunt for his killers last night admitted there was no shortage of theories to be investigated.

Daly's reputation as a troublemaker and a nasty thug with a violent streak meant he had a long list of enemies.

His notorious phone call to RTE's 'Liveline' programme from a mobile phone while in his cell at Portlaoise jail last May ensured that the list would lengthen, as other gangland figures lost their phones during the subsequent crackdown by the prison authorities.

Since his release, Daly (27) had been mainly lying low around his home at Cloonlara Drive in the north Dublin suburb of Finglas.

But it was known that he was anxious to establish himself as a serious player on the crime scene and step into the vacuum created by the murder last December of gangland boss, Martin "Marlo" Hyland. Despite his notoriety, Daly was not a major criminal and detectives suspect that his efforts to carve out a drug trafficking "patch" in his own area brought him into conflict with a 31-year-old Finglas gangster, a former lieutenant of Hyland's.

After his release last August from Cork prison, where he had been moved following the searches for phones in Portlaoise, gardai became aware of several threats on his life.

Officers passed on this information to Daly and offered advice about personal security measures but he ignored the advice and was not co-operative.

On Sunday night, Daly and a group of friends had been socialising in Dublin city centre.

On their way home the group called into a number of houses in the Finglas area in search of a party. At some stage the taxi, which had collected Daly and five friends, who included three women, was tailed by a dark-coloured Toyota Land Cruiser.

When the taxi stopped near Daly's home at Cloonlara Drive at 1.45am, a man jumped out of the Land Cruiser and walked over to establish that Daly was sitting in the front passenger seat.

He fired at least five shots into Daly and ran off.

As he was dying, Daly slumped sideways across the taxi driver, who was unable to unbuckle his seatbelt to get out of the vehicle.

The driver's uncle yesterday described how his nephew was unsure whether he had been shot also because of the amount of blood on the seat.

Meanwhile, the killer and at least one accomplice sped off in the Land Cruiser, which they abandoned and set on fire at the junction of Scribblestown Road and Scribblestown Avenue.

Last night, gardai were trying to trace the origins of the badly burnt jeep, which had been fitted with false registration plates.

Detectives were also attempting to establish whether the killer had followed Daly and his group from the city centre or learned of his whereabouts as a result of the later house calls around Finglas.

One senior officer last night described Daly as a maverick, who was unpredictable, violent, with no firm allegiances and regarded in some circles as a potential psychopath.

"He would not have been part of any criminal understanding and was on his own. He moved around so much and was so erratic that none of the big crime figures associated with him for very long," he added.

While in Portlaoise jail, Daly associated with gang bosses such as John Gilligan and members of the Limerick-based Keane gang.

He was initially jailed for his part in a petrol station hold-up on the Finglas Road in 1999. He was released early but the rest of the sentence was reactivated after Daly committed a public order offence.

Four years ago, he was charged with possession of a shotgun with intent to endanger life and assault causing serious harm to Liam McAllister, a nephew of Sinn Fein president Gerry Adams

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

Apparently the gardai have been aware of this for a while. Most of Williams info and leaks come from Garda Headquarters and low ranking wannabe criminals the Sunday World throws a few quid to. Its an easy, idealsitic outlook to have in saying that justice is meant to be unbiased.That never has, nor never will be the case. I firmly believe that these people(drug lords) are of absolutely no use to society and deserve to die by the sword by which they choose to live. They're not born drug dealers. They become them through greed. They live off the misfortune of poor addicts that in turn are driven to crime in order to feed their addictions. A swift bullet in the head is too good for John Daly, Marlo Hyland, Kieran Keane, Eddie Ryan and their likes. Don't get me started on what my idea of punishment for them would be....please.

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There is a huge market for drugs in Ireland (so called middle and upper classes the worst abusers of Cocaine) so lets stop kidding ourselves that getting rid of the current crew of nutters is going to change anything.

Quote from Pat Rabbitte in the Dail in 2006.

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“If you take the Dublin area that has been the subject of this controversy, Dublin homicides for example were up 53% last year, and yet detection rates have fallen in Dublin to 32%.

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As Bertie will tell us crime is falling & this just media hype. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

why in Gods name would i think he should be shot... i was putting myself in a gangsters position

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I'm sorry but LMFAO :D :D :D

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and find it hard to comprehend how he's still doing his job after all this time!

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Because 100s of 1000s of simple folk will buy the Sunday World if his mug is on the cover

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he's the biggest threat to the underworld since veronica guerin and we all know what happened there.

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Again LMFAO

Threat my hole.

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not sure how many she investigated but i know Williams has gone through quite a few scumbags dirty laundry over the years.

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On an aside Veronica wasn't a very nice person at all

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and its even been highlighted in this thread how low the conviction rate is!!.

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Yet you still think Paul Williams is a threat????

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so there has to be something else to it?!

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Nope

Can you do anything on this site without multi-quoting??:)

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

why in Gods name would i think he should be shot... i was putting myself in a gangsters position, and find it hard to comprehend how he's still doing his job after all this time!.

he's the biggest threat to the underworld since veronica guerin and we all know what happened there. not sure how many she investigated but i know Williams has gone through quite a few scumbags dirty laundry over the years.

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I'd say that although he has a fair bit of information about criminals, more that the police in some cases, he won't be harmed because he's a journalist.

After Veronica Guerin was killed there was outrage, the police acted quickly and efficiently (for once), CAB was set up, millions in illegal cash was frozen, a few high level criminals sent to prison. No criminal/gang needs that kind of pressure.

To put it bluntly: as long as they only kill other gang members, they'll be left alone, but killing people outside that range will see a lot of public outrage and police action.

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

Can you

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Can I what??

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do anything on this site without multi-quoting?

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Oh Right

No, no I can't :p

There was a program on the radio where a sociologist who had completed a study on the subject revealed that children whose parents ( mainly father's) are in jail mostly end up as criminals. How much more so would it happen where mother's are criminals?
Gangland crime tends to be run by families and latterly tribes as such.
The solution long term to the problem is to geld/neuter habitual criminals and prevent them from having children.
Eventually they would die out. Well we don't have the death penalty anymore so some other deterrent is required. And besides if poverty is the root of crime well then having less mouths to feed when you come out of jail will help them stay straight :D
Do the crime and lose your powers to procreate :D

P.S. As regards there being a lack of investigative journalism in this country , that is cause hacks are lazy. You only have to see the number of newspaper articles cobbled together on the basis of what is posted on foot.ie to see the proof of my point.

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Originally Posted by CollegeTillIDie

The solution long term to the problem is to geld/neuter habitual criminals and prevent them from having children.
Eventually they would die out. Well we don't have the death penalty anymore so some other deterrent is required. And besides if poverty is the root of crime well then having less mouths to feed when you come out of jail will help them stay straight :D
Do the crime and lose your powers to procreate :D
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The only downside I can see is that would be hard to sell this politically & probably have some people moaning about cicil rights or other rubbish.