Stan's passion. And the pressure he is under

I watched the game again last night and the reactions of Stan to our goals. I'll show the ****ers seems to be the most apt. (and I consider myself one of the ****ers or doubters). He still comes across as a fan managing the team. But one who earned 102 caps playing for his country so I defer to him and really hope he has learnt alot in a short space of time. I'm still not sure he can handle the red hot games we have coming up. The right subs at the right times. Picking the right starting 11 (dropping Kilbane!). The slow pace of our build up play worries me. We simply don't have the players for slowmo stuff. Start fast (and hard tacking) against the Slovaks. We have players playing at the top of their games. The Reading 3. Richard Dunne (is there a better center half out there?) Finnan. Reid. McShane (Berbatov in his pocket recently) McGeady. Ireland. Given. Carsley. Keane. Christ this is some team we have here. A real team with some real options on the bench as well. I just hope Stan gets it right. I am really starting to believe we can qualify.

I watched a whole Bollywood movie on CH4 last night, It's possible to believe anything after that.

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I watched a whole Bollywood movie on CH4 last night, It's possible to believe anything after that.

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LOL, though there are some hotties on those films, so it can keep the interest :)


You are right noely, some players are in great form, in the same positions as players back in 90 etc, we should be qualifying for these, lets just hope and pray we can overcome these 2 games with the right results.

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Originally Posted by Noelys Guitar

I watched the game again last night and the reactions of Stan to our goals. I'll show the ****ers seems to be the most apt. (and I consider myself one of the ****ers or doubters). He still comes across as a fan managing the team. But one who earned 102 caps playing for his country so I defer to him and really hope he has learnt alot in a short space of time. I'm still not sure he can handle the red hot games we have coming up. The right subs at the right times. Picking the right starting 11 (dropping Kilbane!). The slow pace of our build up play worries me. We simply don't have the players for slowmo stuff. Start fast (and hard tacking) against the Slovaks. We have players playing at the top of their games. The Reading 3. Richard Dunne (is there a better center half out there?) Finnan. Reid. McShane (Berbatov in his pocket recently) McGeady. Ireland. Given. Carsley. Keane. Christ this is some team we have here. A real team with some real options on the bench as well. I just hope Stan gets it right. I am really starting to believe we can qualify.

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amen.

would you be looking for 6 points from the next 2 games..

I think we need to cut the guy a little slck now. He seems to be better able to handle the media now and i wouldn't read to much into his lack of much reaction after each gola, it was a damn difficult week for the guy. In all the **** ups he has done in his time in the job, he somehow, almost amazingly, has a good chance of getting us to a major competition.

he may not have had experience when he started but he does now. i for one will give him the benefit of the doubt for now and get 100% behind him. maybe letting him know he has our support will help make him more confident in what he does and help him make more rational decisions. with the exception of the san marino match our results and performances since the cyprus farce (for which i hold the players more responsible than stan for)have been much improved. the emergence of long, mcshane, potter, mcgeady (finally!) etc is a real shot in the arm for us. maybe we've turned it around. september will tell a lot!

Stan seems to be improving with every game. However I'm sure many of his begrudgers (I was one of them) expected this. I'm just hoping that his inexperience when he took over doesn't cost us qualification. If he does all well and good but his appointment would still go down as a poor decision by Delaney in my book.

Well Kerr would have drawn the fixtures in croke park without a doubt so we have actualy moved forward

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Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge

Stan seems to be improving with every game. However I'm sure many of his begrudgers (I was one of them) expected this.

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Could he have disimproved?

His appointment will stand eternal testament to Delaney's incompetence.

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Could he have disimproved?

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He could have been eternally useless.

I am one of Stans biggest critics, but we seriously have a chance of qualifying for the finals...he's in the job now and won't be moved so I'll give him my backing for the rest of the campaign...the killer is that result in Cyprus, it's probably going to cost us qualification...

The killer was Koller's equaliser as O' Shea crawled back, throw Keanes sitter in there too. We should have won that game no question and be 2 clear of the Czechs right now

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Originally Posted by Soko

The killer was Koller's equaliser as O' Shea crawled back, throw Keanes sitter in there too. We should have won that game no question and be 2 clear of the Czechs right now

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Missed that goal as I was delicately balanced on my head behind the south goal while still celebrating Kilbanes unexpected opening strike....

I agree he's not manager material, but with the qualifying nearly over any change now would be detrimental to the team...

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Originally Posted by danonion

Well Kerr would have drawn the fixtures in croke park without a doubt so we have actualy moved forward

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No doubt whatsoever? Really:confused: Maybe we would have lost one of those games? Maybe we might have at least beaten Wales who were shockingly poor. You could say that the nearest direct comparison on how we "moved forward" under Staunton would be 5-2 vs. 0-1 in Cyprus.

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Originally Posted by Jerry The Saint

No doubt whatsoever? Really:confused: Maybe we would have lost one of those games? Maybe we might have at least beaten Wales who were shockingly poor. You could say that the nearest direct comparison on how we "moved forward" under Staunton would be 5-2 vs. 0-1 in Cyprus.

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How about that Kerr never beat anyone ranked higher than 86th (Georgia in 2003) in competitive game, and Stan has beaten Slovakia, at the time ranked 37th.
To put it another way, in the 3 years under Kerr, Ireland never beat anyone ranked higher than us in a competitive game. Stan has already done that in just over 1 year.

It's too early to say how far he has come from a position of below zero, the real tests are to come.

"You can turn up the heat, but I`m playing it cool
I know it`s hard to believe, but I ain`t nobody`s fool
I`m going all the way"
Stan's mission statement

Needle stuck again Tuff Paddy

i dont think anyone is comparing him to Scolari, he came into the job with no managerial experience and and it was pretty obvious that he hadnt a clue but he certainly seemsto have improved and there has been glimpses of our potential more recently,
Mick McCarthy's record at first wasnt great either but he improved and got us to the world cup and i think Stan needs time and he can do the same, just maybe not first time round

I would not sack him if we do not Qualify as he will be in a much better position at the start of the next qualifying campaign than a new manager would be as he will have gained the experience and will have a very good idea of how the team works best

we need to be more optimistic and support the guy and maybe that will give him the confidence also to move forward

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Mick McCarthy's record at first wasnt great either but he improved and got us to the world cup and i think Stan needs time and he can do the same, just maybe not first time round

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I think this is a very relevant comparasion. By the end of his tenure, Mick McCarthy was a very decent manager but in his first tcampaign we were often a shambles reminiscent of Stan's early form - the only saving grace for McCarthy was a shockingly handy group which Ireland struggled to fisnish second in (think Romania won all but 1 of their games and drew with us in Dublin). Staunton didn't have such a luxury. It wasn't a good appointment but he's there now and hopefully we can build on the last few results.

(a) McCarthy had previous managerial experience and had done reasonably well. Staunton had nothing.
(b) McCarthy suffered no defeats like 5-2 in Cyprus or 4-0 against Holland.
(c) You could at least see, even from the start, that McCarthy's teams knew what they were trying to do. Of necessity, he had to blood a load of new players, but there was always a game plan. I honestly don't think that was the case in Cyprus, in San Marino or at home against Holland.

I dont think there was a game plan to Mc Carthys early teams. We went from 3 5 2 and also playing Keane at sweeper. We swapped around a few times. Mc Carthy learned on the job and Staunton is too. I did not agree with either appointment but I did agree with the Kerr one. I could turn out to be wrong on all fronts but at the time of the appointments I believe I was right.

3-5-2, sweeper, etc, was at least a plan. We were experimenting, trying things out. In the Stan games I mentioned, I don't think the players had a notion what they were doing.

ok we played 4 4 2 against Cyrus that does not mean we had a plan. Just cause we had a formation under Mc Carthy early on does not mean we had a plan. I thought Mc Carthy went on to learn on the job and we played some good football and by the end of it we had a solid 4 4 2 formation with plenty of balance but there is no doubt that we were pretty clueless early on with Ian Harte and centre back and Roy Keane as sweeper. I think there is a good few similarities between Staunton and Mc Carthy on this. Also I think the players liked Mc Carthy and they seem to like Staunton. I am not so sure they grew to like Kerr and as a result they played like that towards the end. However Kerr was a better tactician than either of them when he got the job.

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Originally Posted by Tuff Paddy

The first thing he did as manager was declare that we were building for the WC in 2010. Hardly smacks of ambition now does it?

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Look TP , whats done is done . stans foibles have been gone into on this board on enough occasions. now is the time to look forward. from previous posts i think we need 4 poins from this trip and i do not think we can get them. ideally beating the czechs or at worst drawing 2-2 with them , we will then need to beat the germans czechs and welsh , a massive order imo. but if we come back from the east with 4 points then other results could start going our way and obviate the need to beat both germany and wales. feck it if you cant be optimistic whats the point in being a football fan at all??

But my point is that, while we had players out of position and McCarthy certainly made mistakes (from which he learnt), I don't recall any of the clueless performances like those I mentioned.

It's not to do with errors, it's to do with the way the players play when they're out on the pitch. Under McCarthy, they looked like they'd met before.

Nah Macedonia away was pretty clueless and so was Iceland away too until Keane started playing. There were a few early friendlies also that were totally clueless also. Kerr never had us clueless but he did have us playing boring football with no passion.

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Originally Posted by NeilMcD

Nah Macedonia away was pretty clueless and so was Iceland away too until Keane started playing. There were a few early friendlies also that were totally clueless also. Kerr never had us clueless but he did have us playing boring football with no passion.

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kerr lost the dressing room , stan seems to have it , for how long remains to be seen

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Originally Posted by NeilMcD

oAlso I think the players liked Mc Carthy and they seem to like Staunton. I am not so sure they grew to like Kerr and as a result they played like that towards the end. However Kerr was a better tactician than either of them when he got the job.

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Hence this quote.

we will see in the next two games whether staunton has learned anything as a manager. two good performances where we look like we know what we are doing is what is needed.