Saddam executed

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29/12/2006, 6:20 PM
jebus

Saddam executed

Chances are by the time most of the people interested in this subject click on this thread Saddam will have been hung. His lawyer reckons it will be at noon tomorrow, but it could possibly be tonight.

This is obviously going to set off the violence in the current Civil War in Iraq again, and possibly push it to new heights, but all in all Saddam needed to be brought to justice for what he did to the Kurds, amongst others, so I'm not going to champion him just because he is an enemy of my enemy. I don't believe in executions as a form of justice, but who am I to tell Iraq how to run their country? If only America would have realised this and not gone head first into the district we might have had a better situation in Iraq than at present.
29/12/2006, 11:23 PM
pineapple stu

Jayz, they certainly didn't hang (sorry... :o) about there, did they?
30/12/2006, 12:38 AM
GavinZac

Quote:

Originally Posted by jebus

I don't believe in executions as a form of justice, but who am I to tell Iraq how to run their country?

there isnt a 'they'. iraq is in anarchy at the moment with people pledging allegiance to various leaders and causes. that the american puppet government and the farce of a court (3 judges fired, one for apparently not hating saddam enough) should choose to hang him does not make it a representative choice of the people or any less barbaric.
30/12/2006, 1:19 AM
sligoman

He's been hung this morning at 3am Irish time[about 40mins time] afaik.
30/12/2006, 1:19 AM
dfx-

Will it make any difference?
30/12/2006, 2:07 AM
sligoman

Various news channels are saying he was executed in the last 10 minutes or so. Others saying it'll take place in a few minutes.
30/12/2006, 2:42 AM
sligoman

Saddam Hussein, his half brother and some other guy[can't remember who] have all been hung. All confirmed now. Only one TV channel[Government run, Iraqiya TV] was allowed in to film it.
30/12/2006, 2:51 AM
holidaysong

Capital "punishment"... What a joke.
30/12/2006, 2:53 AM
sligoman

Shall we say R.I.P. or do people agree with what's happened?
30/12/2006, 3:11 AM
holidaysong

I don't agree with capital punishment but I don't think that RIP is fitting. I just think it is sad for humanity that this is one of the ways we deal with our problems. This is a better punishment than life in a prison? I don't think so...
30/12/2006, 3:27 AM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by sligoman

Shall we say R.I.P. or do people agree with what's happened?

Yes I agree he's now dead.
30/12/2006, 3:33 AM
dfx-

It's not that I agree or disagree with it. I do agree with the death sentence, but in this case...I don't see what benefit it gives (to say nothing about the conducting of the trial itself)

There is still going to be sectarian violence, there is still going to be car bombs, it is still going to be one of the most dangerous places on the planet, still a breeding ground for radical-ism..

What, if any, influence is it going to have?:confused:
30/12/2006, 6:14 AM
mypost

It's not going to make any difference to present-day Iraq, but it's not meant to. It's about bringing a violent, repressive, bloodthirsty animal to justice, for inhumane crimes committed on his own and other peoples for decades.

Personally, I find it distasteful that the punishment is being regurgitated (blow-by-blow) by the media in the run-up to it being carried out. I also find it revolting that it was filmed, and released to the media after the event. Why?? :mad:
30/12/2006, 7:43 AM
osarusan

Quote:

Originally Posted by sligoman

Saddam Hussein, his half brother and some other guy[can't remember who] have all been hung. All confirmed now. Only one TV channel[Government run, Iraqiya TV] was allowed in to film it.

Actually only Saddam was executed. The others will be executed at a later date. Apparently the authorities wanted to keep this date linked with Saddam only.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypost

Personally, I find it distasteful that the punishment is being regurgitated (blow-by-blow) by the media in the run-up to it being carried out. I also find it revolting that it was filmed, and released to the media after the event. Why?? :mad:

According to CNN, it is being filmed so that images can be broadcast and prove without doubt that he is dead, and can never rule again. This may help to quell some of the violence.
30/12/2006, 1:52 PM
jebus

Quote:

Originally Posted by osarusan

According to CNN, it is being filmed so that images can be broadcast and prove without doubt that he is dead, and can never rule again. This may help to quell some of the violence.

Another great idea by the Americans :rolleyes:
30/12/2006, 3:54 PM
mypost

Quote:

Originally Posted by osarusan

According to CNN, it is being filmed so that images can be broadcast and prove without doubt that he is dead, and can never rule again. This may help to quell some of the violence.

People/criminals regularly face the death penalty in Iraq. Are these filmed? Will we see what happened to his co-accused when they face the same treatment? No. It doesn't make good tv. Did we see images of Al-Zarqawi when he was killed? (after all he was a bigger threat to the Iraqi people than Saddam) No.

It's sickening that voyeuristic images like the "proof" of the penalty being carried out, are on open display on news bulletins and print media. :mad: The "proof" required is an excuse to show them, and won't make any difference to the sectarian civil war cycle currently in Iraq.
30/12/2006, 4:32 PM
mypost

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rorymon

If it wasn't filmed than conspiracy theorists would be allowed to make up more bullsh!t theorys involving this peice of sh!t

Which won't make any difference. The wall-to-wall tv coverage is enough proof.

Quote:

though it won't help matters in Iraq it may at least bring a little joy or feeling of justice to those who had to suffer under the son of a b!tch

Iraq has far greater problems at the moment to be concerned about than this.
30/12/2006, 4:55 PM
anto1208

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rorymon

it may at least bring a little joy or feeling of justice to those who had to suffer under the son of a b!tch

very true watching an interview with an guy today who had 7 members of his family arrested given a unfair trial and executed by sadam its hard to not think What goes around comes around ...finally .

will this end his grief ? probibly not, will it end his feeling of being utterly helpless ? , you bet your arse it will !

still think death is too easy on him but if he was in prison every attack that would follow would have the message "we ll keep this up untill he is released"
30/12/2006, 5:08 PM
galwayhoop

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rorymon

I know theres more to be worried about, but I'd assume someone whose father, mother, brother, sister etc. that was murdered by Sadam would take a little comfort from seeing him hung.

I believe it was an Iraqi channel that filmed it aswell, so its their desicion to film it anyways, so who gives a damn

people in iraq have lost, and continue to lose, loved ones daily. killing sadaam will bring little relief to the people of that country. the thought that it may is an american propaganda message. watch the news (not CNN, SKY or the BBC though!).

nothing in iraq is currently democratic - government, media or employment. hopefully it will be some day but not for years to come.

BTW many islamic people do not believe that democracy is the best form of running a state and would rather have a state goiverned more in line with their religious beliefs however the west feels that everywhere should be run like 'free' countries like ourselves. are our western countries any better or safer than these countries? i'm not totally convinced
30/12/2006, 5:22 PM
sligoman

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypost

People/criminals regularly face the death penalty in Iraq. Are these filmed? Will we see what happened to his co-accused when they face the same treatment? No. It doesn't make good tv. Did we see images of Al-Zarqawi when he was killed? (after all he was a bigger threat to the Iraqi people than Saddam) No.

It's necessary that it was filmed as Saddam had many impersonators(sp?) and I'm sure people will want to see it was definitely him who was killed and not a lookalike.
30/12/2006, 5:34 PM
galwayhoop

Quote:

Originally Posted by sligoman

It's necessary that it was filmed as Saddam had many impersonators(sp?) and I'm sure people will want to see it was definitely him who was killed and not a lookalike.

we've all heard the stories of his lookalikes but how can we know for sure that it was really him and not one if his lookalikes :D

there is footage of the moon landing but some people will still tell you that it was filmed on a hollywood sound stage. ;)

in reality what is proof for one person is never enough for another. BTW i personally don't think that it was shown on TV for proof but moreso as a piece of triumphism (sp?) by the US and their new State of Iraq!
30/12/2006, 5:37 PM
galwayhoop

a bit like Bush on the ship about 4 years ago telling the world that the war was won!!!!
30/12/2006, 5:44 PM
sligoman

Quote:

Originally Posted by galwayhoop

how can we know for sure that it was really him and not one if his lookalikes :D

I've just seen footage of Saddam walking to the gallows and the noose been put around his neck. I now have enough evidence to know it was him, that is all I need!:p
30/12/2006, 5:54 PM
galwayhoop

in fairness it would have to be a fairly bad lookalike if he didn't actually look like him ....
31/12/2006, 12:07 AM
sligoman

I've just seen the whole video, freaky ****:o.
31/12/2006, 3:31 AM
gustavo

me too sligoman very disturbing no matter what you think of the individual :(
31/12/2006, 6:55 AM
mypost

Quote:

Originally Posted by sligoman

I'm sure people will want to see it was definitely him who was killed and not a lookalike.

As everyone outside Iraq is 100% certain it was the real deal, couldn't this have been restricted for Iraqis only? If the rest of the world wants to see them, then they can watch it on youtube or something. The footage that broadcasters all over the world were salivating for yesterday, is not suitable for general viewing.
31/12/2006, 12:51 PM
BohsPartisan

I'll shed no tears for Sadam but justice this is not. One bunch of killers offing another bunch of killers is no better than whats going on in Dublin of late with the gangs. This is just on a bigger scale. When Bush joins him, then it'll be justice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Fisk

Robert Fisk: He takes his secrets to the grave. Our complicity dies with him
How the West armed Saddam, fed him intelligence on his 'enemies', equipped him for atrocities - and then made sure he wouldn't squeal
Published: 31 December 2006

We've shut him up. The moment Saddam's hooded executioner pulled the lever of the trapdoor in Baghdad yesterday morning, Washington's secrets were safe. The shameless, outrageous, covert military support which the United States - and Britain - gave to Saddam for more than a decade remains the one terrible story which our presidents and prime ministers do not want the world to remember. And now Saddam, who knew the full extent of that Western support - given to him while he was perpetrating some of the worst atrocities since the Second World War - is dead.

Read the rest
01/01/2007, 5:14 PM
pete

Everyone seems to think that Iraq is better off without Saddam but I don't think can draw that conclusion so easily.

How many people have been killed in invasion & the current civil war? 50,000? 100,000? Surely that war isn't even at the half way stage?

Was Saddam really that bad? Sure he killed some Kurds but in the scheme of things nothing to compare with the civil war? I can't trust any court that tries someone for "crimes against humanity". What is that anyway? I believe the killings he was convicted of were in revenge for alleged assassination attempt...

:confused:
01/01/2007, 5:23 PM
pineapple stu

I think Iraq is definitely better off without him (behind bars or in the ground); just they now have the Yanks in there, who are a good replacement.

And yes, he was that bad. Comparing him to the current scenario doesn't take away from his crimes. The video footage where he ordered people out of the room to be shot on trumped up conspiracy charges would almost convict him of itself. Of course, for consistency's sake, some Yanks should hang as well - Bush for the current situation, Bush eile (or whoever it was) for supporting Hussein when he was playing ball, etc.
02/01/2007, 7:56 AM
Macy

Don't believe in the death sentence anyway, however, he should've been charged with all his atrocities not just one. Probably wasn't because in most of them the US/UK would most likely be revealed as co conspirators in many of them. Hence the quick carrying out of the hanging.
03/01/2007, 10:23 AM
BohsPartisan

Article from Indymedia on the subject of the trial and execution:

Quote:

Justin Morahan notes the following points in his article on the trial of Saddam Hussein:

• Four defence lawyers were assassinated during the trial (two by alleged US/Iraqi collaboration)
• Four of the 5 original judges have either resigned or been killed
• The US spent hundreds of millions of dollars in support of the prosecution
• No confidential visits were allowed by defence lawyers to their clients and none at all until after the start of the first trial
• The Defence team was allowed only minutes to begin presenting its defence after the charges were made known on May 15th 2006
• Defence had to end its case within weeks but the Prosecution were allowed months
• Evidence was withheld from defence counsel.
• Defence lawyers were denied access to investigative hearings, denied prior notice of witnesses and denied permission to visit the scene of the alleged crime.
• Trial sessions were announced oftentimes without advance notice or consultation with the result that even the most experienced lawyers missed the hearings.
• Four of the five judges who started in the case were removed by publicly acknowledged US interference
• During the trial, George Bush declared that Saddam Hussein "will be" executed
• Transcripts of the proceedings were refused to defence lawyers.

and more....

The rest
03/01/2007, 10:31 AM
pete

I wouldn't feel sorry ofr Saddam as its the way former tyrants usually leave the stage... However to claim its part of a democratic process is laughable.

Anyone dictator that relies on the US for support should not realise that they will be abandoned eventually, just a matter of time...
03/01/2007, 12:45 PM
jebus

Can't believe that the US/Iraqi government would be so downright stupid to video Saddam's hanging and constantly replay it to an already irate country. It whips Saddams followers and detractors into a frenzy every time it is played and is bound to cause the loss of plenty more lives
03/01/2007, 12:50 PM
pineapple stu

Presumably now the US will extend the duration of the occupation because Iraq needs them and in the meantime, the Yanks can continue siphoning all the oil and natural resources. It's like in 1984 the way the ruling authorities had to create a continual war in order to keep full control over the people.
03/01/2007, 12:54 PM
BohsPartisan

Quote:

Originally Posted by jebus

Can't believe that the US/Iraqi government would be so downright stupid to video Saddam's hanging and constantly replay it to an already irate country.

Next they'll be advertising "HANGING SADDAM FOR YOUR MOBILE" on TV3 :D
03/01/2007, 1:01 PM
jebus

Quote:

Originally Posted by BohsPartisan

Next they'll be advertising "HANGING SADDAM FOR YOUR MOBILE" on TV3

Why do I feel that smile will be wiped off our faces in the coming weeks :D :o :(
03/01/2007, 2:00 PM
pete

What are the US forces doing in Iraq now anyway? It seems they only protecting a limited section of the country (more accurately Baghdad) so woud they be better off leaving now as would reduce the military targets...

Ireland depends on cheapish oil so to look at selfishly whats good for them is good for us.

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