Driver Penalty Points

345,000 motorists get penalty points in four years

More than 345,000 motorists have reportedly been issued with penalty points in the four years since the system was introduced.

However, reports this morning say more than 70,000 of these drivers have not had the points added to their licence because gardaí were unable to identify their licence number.

Most of these are believed to be either foreign visitors, people from the North or Irish citizens driving under a licence granted in another country.

This morning's reports say 35 drivers have already reached the disqualification total of 12 points.

Eleven of these motorists are based in Cork, while the next highest figure is in Dublin, where six drivers have been disqualified.

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Have penalty points been a success? I don't think have made much if any difference.

Seems the lesson to learn is to get a UK driving licence & gardai can't give you any points. :rolleyes:

Nearly twice as many Corkies as Dubs? One of them has to be dahamsta...

where is the zero option on the poll? :)

Still zero thankfully, few narrow escapes with speed traps (don't speed to badly but they were in the usual soft target spots).

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Originally Posted by dublinharp

Still zero thankfully, few narrow escapes with speed traps (don't speed to badly but they were in the usual soft target spots).

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Same here,we'll see what happens when they implement the new danger zone speed traps.

stopped 3 times in the free state this summer,

twice in donegal and once in monaghan, not once asked for any ID or details. Northern reg car and waived on after a brief chat.

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Originally Posted by Strabane_Harp

stopped 3 times in the free state this summer,

twice in donegal and once in monaghan, not once asked for any ID or details. Northern reg car and waived on after a brief chat.

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:mad: Something for the it really bugs me thread!

Just saw the poll results, I am / was obviously the bad boy of foot.ie. Six at the moment, but two of them are gone from next month, seeing as I learned my lesson.

I have six too Nightdub, although thank god the first two will be gone before the next in-sewer-ants renewal. I've definitely slowed down, although I stick unreservedly to my belief that the problem with road deaths in Ireland is caused primarily by bad driving; which is in turn caused by bad driver training; which is in turn caused by bad driver testing.

adam

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Originally Posted by pete

Seems the lesson to learn is to get a UK driving licence & gardai can't give you any points. :rolleyes:

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Cheaper car insurance too, pre the penalty point discounts. Obviously now you miss out on the discounts, so effectively paying the same as if you had 4 penalty points.

I have a UK licence, and keep it mainly because it has such a long renewal period and it gives me more vehicle classes. Not been stopped anyway, touch wood.

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Originally Posted by the 12 th man

we'll see what happens when they implement the new danger zone speed traps.

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If that list that was in the paper was accurate, it's a farce before it's started. Roads that are now bypassed (eg N8 Fermoy), roads that now have speed bumps, roads that have median crossings now removed (eg N4 Lucan), roads that have had one serious incident involving a joyrider that account for half the figures (eg N11 Belfield)

Still on zero points, although 2 really close calls. When the weekend crackdown on speeding was on a few months ago I drove to Limerick and kept under the speed limit the whole way for the first time, and still made it in roughly the same amount of time. Been keeping to it pretty much since then.

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Originally Posted by the 12 th man

Same here,we'll see what happens when they implement the new danger zone speed traps.

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I thought it was hilarious as well as being sad that the governemnt & gardai announced this with such fanfare. The current government been in power for 9 consequtive years & they only now decided that having speed cameras & gardai at the actually danger areas a good idea.

:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by BohsPartisan

:mad: Something for the it really bugs me thread!

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Cant blame me for the Gardai not doin there job. 2 times in the one day was for a broken tail light but still no questions asked despite tax disc bein absent.

Same goes for free state drivers in the north though, ye's have some reputation for inability to negiotiate roundabouts and traffic lights

Just on speeding I've come to the conclusion that the Garda Traffic Corps no longer work for the minister for justice they have been working for the minister for finance and the revenue commisioneers for years

2 - caught by a speed camera coming back from Longford after losing 0-1 - great day all over

Zero too. Although I've only been on the road about a month:D.

The real question is do people think the system is working. They don't seem to be stopping the carnage on the roadswhich is a real blight on our society. What action do people think would work?

Gods, ye love bandying that "carnage on our roads" line around, don't ye? Although I haven't seen mention of "lethal weapons" yet...

You want to stop the idiotic driving that happens on our roads? Cancel all the driving licences and force everyone to take a test again. A proper test. Impractical, yes, but it'll get the idiots that are causing all these crashes - and in the grand scale of things, as compared to other countries, it's not actually "carnage", fyi - off the roads. Call it an emergency measure, call it what you like, it's the only thing that will actually work. All the rest of the ideas that have been thrown around in the last few days - and the time before that there was a crash, and the time before that, and... - are just as stupid as the stupid drivers, and, more importantly, none of them will solve the problem properly.

Speed doesn't kill, bad driving kills.

adam

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Originally Posted by dahamsta

Gods, ye love bandying that "carnage on our roads" line around, don't ye? Although I haven't seen mention of "lethal weapons" yet...

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I read the mirror of my opinion on the 'carnage' in a letter to the Irish Times yesterday I think.

It was about the Irish love for the term 'carnage on the roads'.

If someone is in a car at 150 kph or 300kph or 10,000 kph who can't handle the lethal weapon that that car could become at that speed, just what exactly do they expect to happen?

The Government to legislate this, that or the other, I suppose.:rolleyes:

The people who drive dangerously are well capable of passing tests. They are on their best behaviour when there is an examiner beside them.
As for your point about speed not killing, well that depends on what road you are driving on. Doing twice the speed limit on a windey country road is bad driving as far as I'm concerned.

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Originally Posted by dahamsta

Gods, ye love bandying that "carnage on our roads" line around, don't ye?

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I think it's a very apt description. No harm in using it.

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Originally Posted by dahamsta

Speed doesn't kill, bad driving kills.

adam

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Bad driving could be something like not using an indicator changing lanes- that's a very general statement to make.

Almost all the accidents on roads are caused by speeding late at night, due to recklessness, drink driving etc. And speeding is bad driving.

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Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge

And speeding is bad driving.

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Oh dear, I hear an old debate/circular argument coming again:D

Bad drivers speeding = bad driving - much like bad drivers changing lanes at the wrong time = bad driving. The problem is that there are a hell of a lot of very bad drivers who think they can drive and at speed

It doesn't take a genius to figure out what happens as a result..

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Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge

Bad driving could be something like not using an indicator changing lanes

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Which could very easily cause "carnage". I've seen numerous accidents caused by frankly woeful lane changes.

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Almost all the accidents on roads are caused by speeding late at night

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Are they? That sounds like the kind of statement I hear on call-in shows, are there facts to back that up? I've certainly seen plenty of accidents on the road during the day.

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due to recklessness, drink driving etc. And speeding is bad driving.

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Inappropriate speeding is bad driving, yes. Speeding per se isn't. Illegal yes, bad driving maybe, depending on the driver, prevailing road conditions, etc.

Unless you think breaking the law is generally bad, and you've never broken the law ever. Which is perfectly acceptable, and something you're entitled to do. I don't have to agree with it though. ;)

I don't want to get into a discussion on me personally in this thread btw, despite BohsPartisan's attempts. If you want to debate the point, debate the point, not me personally.

adam

The points system is a massive failure no doubt.

I have never seen a speed check in an actual dangerous location. Its taken the government years to realise that dedicated cameras at black spots might be something to consider.

By & large irish people are terrible drivers, can't drive on motorways, can;t change lanes, can't indicate etc etc... Bad driving is due to crap training & almost zero enforcement of even the most basic rules of the road. Bad draiving frustrates other drivers & makes then bad drivers.

I can't argue about implementation, but I do think the points themselves are an effective detterent pete. They've certainly slowed me down, much to my annoyance.

adam

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Originally Posted by dahamsta

I can't argue about implementation, but I do think the points themselves are an effective detterent pete.

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I know what you saying but i believe introduction & implementation go hand in hand. Its easy to add laws with effective implementation & without dragging off topic does sum up the current government attitude in many ways.

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Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge

Bad driving could be something like not using an indicator changing lanes- that's a very general statement to make.

Almost all the accidents on roads are caused by speeding late at night, due to recklessness, drink driving etc. And speeding is bad driving.

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Wait until you start driving - there's nothing more annoying idiots who don't know how to signal at a roundabout; you pull out in front of them because they're clearly pointing one way when in fact they're not going that way at all.

I think 29% of all crashes are between 9pm and 3am (was in the Irish Times last week, as I recall). Which is 25% of the day. Granted, the time of the day when there ought to be least driving, but still far from "almost all"

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

I think 29% of all crashes are between 9pm and 3am (was in the Irish Times last week, as I recall). Which is 25% of the day. Granted, the time of the day when there ought to be least driving, but still far from "almost all"

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Like the hilarious statistic that 40% of absenteeism happens on Mondays and Fridays. :D

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Originally Posted by pete

I know what you saying but i believe introduction & implementation go hand in hand. Its easy to add laws with effective implementation & without dragging off topic does sum up the current government attitude in many ways.

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True pete, it should be end-to-end. As you suggest yourself, the current administration wouldn't recognise an end-to-end policy if it came up and bit them on the arse.

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Originally Posted by dahamsta

I can't argue about implementation, but I do think the points themselves are an effective detterent pete.

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They are an effective detterent - as seen by the drops in road deaths when first introduced and when the offences were extended. Unfortunately it was never followed up with the implementation. Big fan fares from Brennan and then Cullen, 2 months drop, and then death rate went back to normal when old habits came back when people still copped on to very low chance of being caught. Same happened when random breath testing was introduced and people thought there'd be cops outside every village.