Sweden Squad announced

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21/02/2006, 8:46 PM
eirebhoy

Sweden Squad announced

Goalkeepers: Eddie Gustafsson (Ham-Kam), Andreas Isaksson (Stade Rennes)

Defenders: Christoffer Andersson (Lillestrom), Mikael Dorsin (Rosenborg Trondheim), Erik Edman (Stade Rennes), Petter Hansson (Heerenveen), Teddy Lucic (BK Hacken), Olof Mellberg (Aston Villa), Alexander Ostlund (Southampton)

Midfielders: Daniel Andersson (Malmo), Niclas Alexandersson (IFK Gothenburg), Kim Kallstrom (Stade Rennes), Tobias Linderoth (FC Copenhagen), Christian Wilhelmsson (Anderlecht), Anders Svensson (Elfsborg), Fredrik Ljungberg (Arsenal)

Forwards: Marcus Allback (FC Copenhagen), Johan Elmander (Brondby), Zlatan Ibrahimovic (Juventus), Mattias Jonson (Djurgarden), Henrik Larsson (Barcelona), Markus Rosenberg (Ajax Amsterdam).

Decent squad. It will be more a test for our defenders than anything with the likes of Larsson, Ibrahimovic, Wilhelmsson and Ljunberg in there.
21/02/2006, 10:30 PM
tetsujin1979

It's Kim Kallstrom I want to see, one for the Champ Manager fans there!
22/02/2006, 7:14 AM
Stuttgart88

Quote:

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Decent squad. It will be more a test for our defenders than anything with the likes of Larsson, Ibrahimovic, Wilhelmsson and Ljunberg in there.

Decent squad alright, but with the exception of the names you mentioned & one or two others it's a squad that's full of half-decent players playing for half-decent clubs but with a peppering of genuine quality added. Sound familiar?

And they consistently qualify for tournaments, consistently win tough away games & consistently perform well at major tournaments. A lesson there somewhere?

Also, notice how many players play domestically or in Norway.
22/02/2006, 8:34 AM
ifk101

Sweden has a good, stable side. Individually defense and midfield is weak but they have a nack of coming together and playing well in competitive matches. They play quite defensively in competitive matches, relying on the counter to score goals - which is all well and good because they're playing to their strengths and maximising it.

Their play is usually open in friendly matches, which results in them losing a lot in these matches.

Of those players playing in Scandinavia, none of them - bar Elmander - are worth getting excited about.
22/02/2006, 9:23 AM
Galwayutdcelt

Henrik Larsson next wednesday

Hope he playes, greatest ever striker i have seen in my life time, he is still doing the job, 6 in last 8 goals for Barca, hope he stuffs Chelsea tonight.
22/02/2006, 9:41 AM
NeilMcD

Yeah good point Suttgart, there was a time when Ireland played above themselves and in many ways we were an influence on teams like Sweden and Norway in a style of football etc. In the last campaign I think we played below ourselves which was annoying and lets hope that Staunton can get that back into the Ireland team.
22/02/2006, 9:47 AM
wws

Very dissapointed that Alex Bruce didnt get a call up - he qualifies through his great great great great granny who was raped by a viking on lambay island
22/02/2006, 10:53 AM
Stuttgart88

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galwayutdcelt

Hope he playes, greatest ever striker i have seen in my life time, he is still doing the job, 6 in last 8 goals for Barca, hope he stuffs Chelsea tonight.

I was thinking recently that Kevin Doyle is like him in many ways both physically & in style. Both score a good proportion of goals in the air despite neither being tall. Larsson's timing in the jump was / is extraordinary. I think Doyle's is good too. Both finish well and are good all round contributors. Maybe it's just fanciful thinking though!
22/02/2006, 11:05 AM
Donal81

Quote:

Originally Posted by wws

Very dissapointed that Alex Bruce didnt get a call up - he qualifies through his great great great great granny who was raped by a viking on lambay island

Eh, he's in the U21s!
22/02/2006, 11:06 AM
wws

the swedish u-21s?
22/02/2006, 11:08 AM
Donal81

Quote:

Originally Posted by wws

the swedish u-21s?

Yeah, he declared last night. No disrespect to us or the Swedes, "it's purely because Sweden are a better team." ;)
22/02/2006, 2:42 PM
pete

Quote:

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Midfielders: Daniel Andersson (Malmo)
Forwards: Mattias Jonson (Djurgarden),

Interesting that those players (on losing side at club level to eL side in last 2 years) make squad for country off to this years World Cup. On the other hand no eL players in irish squad that failed to qualify for the World Cup. However the starting Ireland team will probably have player (Kevin Doyle) who played against & beaten those swedish teams in recent years...

:confused:
22/02/2006, 2:50 PM
wws

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

Interesting that those players (on losing side at club level to eL side in last 2 years) make squad for country off to this years World Cup. On the other hand no eL players in irish squad that failed to qualify for the World Cup. However the starting Ireland team will probably have player (Kevin Doyle) who played against & beaten those swedish teams in recent years...

:confused:

I think its a fair point. The football culture (or lack of it) in Ireland is not geared to accepting this or grasping the potential on our own doorsteps.
22/02/2006, 2:56 PM
Stuttgart88

Quote:

Originally Posted by wws

The football culture (or lack of it) in Ireland is not geared to accepting this or grasping the potential on our own doorsteps.

True, but at least the Genesis eL report recognises the medium term potential of the eL, even if you might not agree with the route they suggest is taken. I personally think that factors like Rovers getting a proper stadium, Dalyer being improved (and shared) etc. are positive factors. When I lived in Ireland I was happy to put up with sub-par spectator facilities but I know hundreds of others who weren't. I think the eL will get there in time. Small things like Staunton re-allowing the U21s to train with the seniors will give him a good flavour of what players like O'Donovan & Ward are like.
22/02/2006, 3:01 PM
pete

And while i'm at it the elevation in less than 9 months of Doyle from unknown player (outside eL circles) to not just in the Ireland squad but to have 99% of people calling for him to start also highlights the ignornace of eL football.
22/02/2006, 3:06 PM
NeilMcD

Pete you are right that a lot of people are ingorant of players in our own league however I dont agree with your theory about.

If I am working in a job and I get a promotion and as a result of this promotion I get to show my talens off to a the wider public and I am been headed hunted by various companies does this mean that these companies did not have a clue before hand.

Sometimes getting a promotion and doing well is proof that you can make it at the top. For some people scoring goals at EL level is not enough proof that the person can make it at international level.

I dont think anyone would disagree that The Championship is of a higher level than the Eircom League, however I am sure the European Football that Kevin Doyle played in helped him big time.
22/02/2006, 3:13 PM
Stuttgart88

I'd be interested in hearing Doyle's own slant on it. Has playing for a bigger professional club, with better facilities, training daily with better team mates (as I'm sure you'll admit), playing under a high quality coach, playing in a tougher league made him a better player? Was he surprised himself how well he has done? Would Doyle himself have said he should be in our squad 9 months ago or was he still "work-in-progress"?

About 6 months ago, maybe more, I posted that a good manager should be able to identify if a domestic player is good enough. Staunton's decision will only make it easier to identify this.
22/02/2006, 4:35 PM
wws

Doyle's qualities are as much innate as to do with any external factors - ie who he plays with. He played for my club a few years ago - got a couple of appearances and even then it was clear he had talents (not saying he warranted a cap just making the point that good players are good players). The Swedes are unencumbered by notions that innately good players must play in a certain league for their qualities to be considered good enough at international level. I read Four Four Two this week and Sven was bemoaning Englands inability to beat Sweden - with various theories put forward about Swedens better organisation and technique - I have to say I laughed out loud- their club football is in the doldrums but they're still open to bolstering their squad with good enough home based players.

The mind set has to change and perceptions have to be opened up. Its pointless sitting on potential Kevin Doyles here just because Steve Coppell hasnt come over for a two day break and a few pints o the black stuff! Maybe Staunton will grasp the nettle on this.
22/02/2006, 6:08 PM
pete

Obviously its not as clear as a few eL players must be in the irish squad. However in the 9 months i mention Doyle is not expected to start in the first eleven for Ireland - that is some step up from just making up the numbers in a squad. Remember he made the irish squad only a few months after joinging Reading so no chance he improved so much.

If international squads were just about picking players from the highest level Staunton would just have to start with Chelsea & work his way through the division to select his squad - its not as simple as that.

Doyle has said that he hasn't improved that much but is playing with overall better players (whole squad as opposed to few players) & not much difference in standard.
22/02/2006, 9:10 PM
eirebhoy

And I'd like to just boast that I predicted Doyle being Eircom League top scorer before a ball was kicked last season when very few people thought so. ;) Most people were going with the Shels front two and a lot more were even going for the likes of Daryl Murphy than Doyle. :) He wasn't playing up front much for City the season before last though was he?
22/02/2006, 10:40 PM
Kaiser

I agree that it does seem bizarre that we regularly name a squad of players based totally on players playing in a foreign league and with not one single home based player. I can't think of another current European national side that has a similar policy of overlooking homebased players and undermining it's own domestic competition in the way that we do. Surely it makes sense to make room for at least your top league scorer or to have the squad's third choice keeper based in the EL.
22/02/2006, 11:23 PM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

I'd be interested in hearing Doyle's own slant on it. Has playing for a bigger professional club, with better facilities, training daily with better team mates (as I'm sure you'll admit), playing under a high quality coach, playing in a tougher league made him a better player? Was he surprised himself how well he has done?.

He was asked in a recent enough interview (on RTE 2FM) what did he think was the reason that he was flying and did he find much difference in standards etc. He didn't answer directly on standard of play or coaching but just said that he had plenty of confidence in his game and wasn't afraid of the challenges.
23/02/2006, 8:10 AM
bawn79

What would people think about having a guarenteed quota of home-based players in a squad. Say have a squad of 23 then the best goalie, defender, midfielder and striker from the Eircom League making a squad of 27.
23/02/2006, 9:46 AM
tetsujin1979

Quote:

Originally Posted by bawn79

What would people think about having a guarenteed quotp of home-based players in a squad. Say have a squad of 23 then the best goalie, defender, midfielder and striker from the Eircom League making a squad of 27.

Wouldn't that devalue the Eircom League? The players wouldn't be getting in because they deserve it, they're getting in because it's written in law that they have to have squad numbers.
23/02/2006, 10:11 AM
pete

No quotas, no token gestures!

If the swedes can add 4-5 local players to what will probably be close to their WC squad & swedish league has poor record against the eL then why are eL players not good enough?
23/02/2006, 10:31 AM
ifk101

Regarding home-based Swedes - all of them have played abroad and are, for the most part, coming to the end of their careers. It rare for a home-based player nowdays to come into their competitive squads if they haven't had experience from playing abroad. 90% of the high-profile players in the Swedish league are players returning home from a career abroad - for instance Henrik Larsson has signed to play with Helsingborg from this summer. Whilst most of our international players chose to continue living in England even after their careers finish, Swedish internationals are more prone to finish their careers in the Swedish league and settle in Sweden there after. Those Swedish internationals returning home have already proven they can play at international level and the fact that their now plying their trade in the Swedish league doesn't automatically make them bad internationals. I'm all for league of ireland lads coming into the international if they are good enough but a comparison with players from the Swedish league is misguided based on the above.
23/02/2006, 10:36 AM
as_i_say

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

If the swedes can add 4-5 local players to what will probably be close to their WC squad & swedish league has poor record against the eL then why are eL players not good enough?

Any stats of games between EL and swedish league teams over the last few years? isnt the swedish top flight 100% a pro league though? I.e thats what the EL needs to keep our best players at home i guess...:ball:
23/02/2006, 10:39 AM
gaf1983

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

Wouldn't that devalue the Eircom League? The players wouldn't be getting in because they deserve it, they're getting in because it's written in law that they have to have squad numbers.

I agree completely with your point tetsujin, players should be selected in the squad on merit not to meet quotas
23/02/2006, 10:40 AM
ifk101

Quote:

Originally Posted by as_i_say

Any stats of games between EL and swedish league teams over the last few years? isnt the swedish top flight 100% a pro league though? I.e thats what the EL needs to keep our best players at home i guess...:ball:

Not 100% professional but pretty much so. Some of the smaller teams have part-time professionals. I know one of the top players for Gefle last year was a farmer by day.
23/02/2006, 10:57 AM
bawn79

I really dont see whats wrong with quotas, people are complaining that home-based players are not getting a chance, simply this would give them a chance to train with better/equally good players and therefore they could show that they were up to the level without having to transfer abroad.
If they weren't good enough then they wouldn't be played. If they weren't then there is nothing to lose.
Id prefer if we didnt need a quota but at present this simply means that the current and past managements don't think the standard is good enough in the Eircom league and so don't pick any players.

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