guardian eL article

found this at footballunlimited.com - it comes from the guardian

Irish football needs to sex up and wise up

Mistakes, ****-ups, snags, hitches; Robert Clougher argues that, ultimately, only improved organisation can move Irish football forward

Thursday August 25, 2005


There are some things you rarely see in print. The hen's teeth of the football pages include statements such as, "Manager praises referee", or "Forward admits to diving". Until recently, you were just as unlikely to read news of an Irish football team performing well in a European competition. Now suddenly, teams from the Emerald Isle have started to shine. Sort of.
Cork City go into tonight's Uefa Cup clash with Djugarden after drawing the first leg in Sweden 1-1. In 2004, Dublin-based Shelbourne were one match away from qualification to the Champions League group stage. These results didn't just happen by accident. They came about following two fundamental changes: clubs started employing players full-time, while the decision taken three years ago to switch to summer football means that Irish players are at their peak while most of their continental counterparts are still puffing through pre-season training.

But if Irish football is to make the move from moral to meaningful victories, it must first make the move from haphazard to professional organisation.
The schedule switch - the season now runs from March to November - has not increased attendances as much as league officials had hoped. Wholesale postponements are now a distant memory, but crowds remain as drearily low as before. In the Premier Division, the top teams average gates of a couple of thousand per match. And although there have been some impressive exceptions (last week's Cork v Shelbourne match attracted 7,000), a more vigorous campaign to promote domestic football is certainly needed.

As things stand, matches are promoted as if clubs are aiming to fill the function room of a local pub. A couple of posters here, a radio ad there. It doesn't work. The lack of traffic around various grounds on matchdays is testament to the league's tendency to whisper about itself when the situation demands it grab a bullhorn. There was hardly a better time to launch a publicity campaign than when the British leagues were on holidays, but instead of fanfare and fireworks, there was a pitiful silence. Irish football can't become relevant and meaningful to a public that is largely oblivious to its existence.

In addition to flaunting itself more brazenly, Irish football will only ever be more attractive if it sorts itself out organisationally.

While the quality of football among top teams has improved, the league is too often a parody of a serious tournament. Regrets? There are too many to ignore. Shamrock Rovers, Ireland's most successful club, were recently deducted eight points after their 2005 club licence was found to have been awarded on the basis of flawed financial and accounting information. This isn't an isolated embarrassment.

During the 2001-02 league season, St Patrick's Athletic completed an unenviable double: on two occasions they were found to have failed to register a player. In the first case, St Pat's successfully appealed a nine-point deduction, explaining that Paul Marnrey's registration forms had been lost in the post. In the second case, the Dublin club weren't so lucky; they were docked 15 points for failing to register Charles Mbabazi Livingstone, a penalty which ultimately cost them the league title.

Mistakes, ****-ups, snags, hitches; call them what you like. They all have the same effect: they divert precious media attention away from what's happening on the pitch. And what sponsor wants to be associated with such farces? Despite their Champions League campaign last season, Shelbourne couldn't attract a major backer before the start of the following domestic season. That's what happens when you pal around with known undesirables. :D

The performances of Cork and Shelbourne have shown that Irish football has moved on from the days when European clubs used to go to Ireland and run up a rugby score. At the moment, neither the league nor the clubs are taking the necessary steps to ensure the game never returns to those times.

the link is:

http://football.guardian.co.uk/comme...555380,00.html

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Originally Posted by ColinR

The performances of Cork and Shelbourne have shown that Irish football has moved on from the days when European clubs used to go to Ireland and run up a rugby score.

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Is anyone here old enough to remember those days? :confused: :rolleyes:

very good article thou

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Originally Posted by Peadar

Is anyone here old enough to remember those days? :confused: :rolleyes:

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pats v zimbru - its not that long ago

It's like Bohs beating Aberdeen, Kaiserslautern, Levadia and BATE never happened.

good article though. The league needs to be properly administered and advertised properly.

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Originally Posted by ColinR

pats v zimbru - its not that long ago

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What was that score line again ??

Something like 10 nil wasn't it !?!?! :eek:

Seriously though .... cant argue with any of it !!

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Originally Posted by A face

What was that score line again ??

Something like 10 nil wasn't it !?!?! :eek:

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we got spooned :(

and not in the good way :D

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Originally Posted by ColinR

pats v zimbru - its not that long ago

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.....and Bohs v Rosenburg was yonks ago
or Steau v Shels?????


both hammered

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Originally Posted by wws

.....and Bohs v Rosenburg was yonks ago
or Steau v Shels?????


both hammered

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Pats were beaten 10-0 by nobodies. Bohs lost 5-0 on aggregate, a thrashing of course (nowhere near as comprehensive as 10-0) to a team with real European pedigree. Steau of course are also a team of real pedigree.

needless to say i disagree

bohs basically lost 4-0 - and 1-0 at home - they were crap - as anyone who saw the games can testify

ditto shels who embarressed themselves with schoolboy errors against steau - who showed their 'pedigree' by being knocked out by a team five points off the bottom of the league in norway. A team taht some experts here reckoned gave shels a chance to qualify for teh group stages :rolleyes:

quite frankly if that is "progress" ..... well your happy to live in dreamworld

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Originally Posted by The Guardian

The performances of Cork and Shelbourne have shown that Irish football has moved on from the days when European clubs used to go to Ireland and run up a rugby score.

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At least they weren't cricket scores! :o

A good article. Most important I think is to create a bit of hype about the games and take advantage of the English and Scottish off-season, but I suppose that'll have to wait for another season.

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Originally Posted by wws

needless to say i disagree

bohs basically lost 4-0 - and 1-0 at home - they were crap - as anyone who saw the games can testify

ditto shels who embarressed themselves with schoolboy errors against steau - who showed their 'pedigree' by being knocked out by a team five points off the bottom of the league in norway. A team taht some experts here reckoned gave shels a chance to qualify for teh group stages :rolleyes:

quite frankly if that is "progress" ..... well your happy to live in dreamworld

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That Steua team also knocked Valencia out the UEFA Cup last year, and Shels were still in the tie up until the last 25mins.

I agree with pretty much all of the article, but also noted that the journalist didn't really offer any suggestions as to how things could be changed.

Sex the league up?

How?

Goal Dancers! :D Similar to pole dancers, except they swing from the posts and crossbars. Topless. Ha! ::)

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Originally Posted by EnDai

Goal Dancers! :D Similar to pole dancers, except they swing from the posts and crossbars. Topless. Ha! ::)

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Great idea! I might even go to a Dublin City game if they had them!

I know I've had this debate with someone here before but one way of sexing up the league is by having players names on jerseys.

Then they can advertise their "top" player better. I mean look at what happended to Real Madrid when they bought Beckham? Even birds who don't like football bought a jersey cause his name was on it. I know its not going to be as big as that the effect here, but the idea is there.

Its not really up to the journo on suggesting how the league should improve. Maybe the League should decide that for themselves.

I wonder would they ever have the idea of asking fans on what our thoughts on how to jazz up the league would be? They would get some surprising answers I'd imagine :eek:

Interesting timing for the article, as currently the big talk in England is about bringing the game back to it's roots with clubs like AFC Wimbledon, FC United, AFC Telford etc. Sexed down football if you like...

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Originally Posted by Drogman.

one way of sexing up the league is by having players names on jerseys.

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We do!
So do other clubs.

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Originally Posted by ThatGuy

Pats were beaten 10-0 by nobodies.

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Bit harsh on Zimbru. Admittedly, they weren't global megastars like Levadia Tallinn or Carmarthen Town, that's for sure.

Worst Irish result in Europe in recent seasons? Shelbourne going out to the counterfeit Hibs of Malta - FACT! (Even though it's not possible to lose 3-2 on aggregate in rugby...)

We don't.

Bohs semi-do. Depends on the player I guess, some have one some don't! :D

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Originally Posted by ColinR

pats v zimbru - its not that long ago

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yes, a season long of enduring the "10-0 to the refugees" chant. They scored the first one while Ian Gilzean was off getting treatment, think that was what breached the hull .. before we sank :p

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Originally Posted by EnDai

We don't.

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Didn't you and Pats used to have them but then reverted back to not having them?
Derry have them, don't they?

Pat's humilliated by Zimbru
Bohs thrashed by Rosenborg
Shels clobbered by Steau


Whats the common denominator...

Colin Hawkins


FACT.

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Originally Posted by Jerry The Saint

Worst Irish result in Europe in recent seasons? Shelbourne going out to the counterfeit Hibs of Malta - FACT! (Even though it's not possible to lose 3-2 on aggregate in rugby...)

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The guy who scored the winner in that game must definitely hold the record for the fattest player ever to score in any stage of the Champions League :p

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Originally Posted by wws

quite frankly if that is "progress" ..... well your happy to live in dreamworld

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Go and check out how much co-efficent we have got this season and last season and compare it to 3 years ago you muppet :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by TheOwl

Great idea! I might even go to a Dublin City game if they had them!

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Steady now.....

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Originally Posted by Vitruvian Man

Pat's humilliated by Zimbru
Bohs thrashed by Rosenborg
Shels clobbered by Steau


Whats the common denominator...

Colin Hawkins


FACT.

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Yep, I'd noticed that - he's dangerous at the back!

What the hell, I'm off work tomorrow and up all night so here goes (again):
I think the bottom line here is that the clubs need to become professional OFF the pitch before what happens on the pitch can be taken seriously by the great unwashed, who will always take the easier option of watching a well-produced, glossy TV version of football above the match-going experience. It's like trying to sell bowls of locally-produced wheat germ to people who devour Coco Pops, or a plate of salad and beans to a die-hard Burger Monster. It's a hard sell. Let's face it: people watch Big Brother and ignore their neighbours!
While the advent of full-time football offers a veneer of professionalism to the game here, the simple fact is that most clubs are run very badly. Players' contracts are a legal and tax-compliant minefield, budgets are largely works of fiction, while the vast majority of clubs operate on a season-by-season, survival-at-best path and far too much optimism rather than savvy. There's no future in that; just Groundhog Day every season. We need to begin development at a grassroots and fundamental level.
First off, get kids in and coach them properly: if you can produce your own talent you're not relying on over-paid cynics rejected by English or more far-flung clubs at an early age.
Then, work to realistic budgets and achieveable 5-to-10-year development plans. Spend whatever can be afforded on improving facilities and developing marketing ploys above anything else that costs money, including players but not excluding the development of young players. Make your games events. Develop strategies.
If anything, all that's not sexy; it's hard work. But going to football isn't sexy (even the Almighty Premiership is full of crap teams and fat-******* fans in replica shirts paying ridiculous money to watch what's almost always mundane football), it's the TV image of football that looks sexy, and that image is purely for a massive TV audience that's there to be sucked in to buy cans of Coke, rubbish beer, belly-busting pizzas, the latest mobile phones and Playstation consoles.
I've been to football in many countries, and the way clubs thrive or survive is by encouraging locals to identify with them, giving them a club that they feel is worth supporting, with a hardcore fanbase that provides a focus for the (more sedate) rest of the crowd.
Our clubs need to study how football works in similar-sized countries rather than hopelesly trying to compete with Real Madrid, Man U, Milan, etc. It's the cornershop against the multi-national and there can only be one winner in that kind of battle.
Research, analyse, develop. And stop whinging. Nobody outside the committed care so we need to get our thinking caps on and throw away our blinkers. We know going to EL is a great experience but it needs to improve on all levels in order to attract outside interest.
Oh, and BTW: Pat's were a better side than Zimbru - but Zimbru were smarter. I was at the first leg and it was an astonishing result that hinged on the injury to Gilzean and the by-passing of midfield to release two nippy strikers against a hesitant and unsure back three that did include Colin Hawkins.
But it proved the bottom line that we aren't making the most of our players because the coaching is rubbish. That has to change. And from an early age, when learning is fun rather than hard work and adaptibility is interesting rather than fearful.

Top post above and the gaurdian article was also spot on. Clubs in this country have to be a lot smarter. You have to plan ahead and not just spend whatever money you have willy nilly. I think you'll find that that's the reason Pat Dolan got the boot from CCFC at the start of the season. Success just can't be bought unless you have a bottomless pit of money like Chelsea do. Football is a business and smart people run busness', people that are severly lacking in the EL. Dumb a$$es running a lot of clubs. :ball:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vitruvian Man

Pat's humilliated by Zimbru
Bohs thrashed by Rosenborg
Shels clobbered by Steau


Whats the common denominator...

Colin Hawkins


FACT.

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Thanks Vitruvian Man! I've been carrying around the pain of that Zimbru result for years but it all makes sense now. I can finally let go now that I know a big-nosed Galwegian freak was to blame. He's like the Stonecutters - everytime anything bad happens in Irish football he's always lurking around pulling the strings. Has anyone else noticed that Doncaster Rovers had a terrible European record while he was there! :eek:

On a related point, can anyone confirm Trevor Molloy's involvement in this sinister conspiracy, seeing as he was involved in both Pats-Zimbru and Shels-Hibernians games...?

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Originally Posted by Jerry The Saint

On a related point, can anyone confirm Trevor Molloy's involvement in this sinister conspiracy, seeing as he was involved in both Pats-Zimbru and Shels-Hibernians games...?

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He was also involved when Bohs were beaten by Halmstad. :eek: :D

[QUOTE=Billy Lord]Oh, and BTW: Pat's were a better side than Zimbru - but Zimbru were smarter. I was at the first leg and it was an astonishing result that hinged on the injury to Gilzean and the by-passing of midfield to release two nippy strikers against a hesitant and unsure back three that did include Colin Hawkins.[/QUOTE)

Pats were indeed the better side for the first twenty minutes of that game, even hit the post. Once the first goal went in however we just caved. What really let us down was the preparation for that game. I think the players had only been back training for something like a week, and Paul Osam admitted after the game that he was injured to such an extent that he shouldn't have started. That was amatuerish in the extreme and of course we were found out. Liam Buckley, and to a lesser extent Pat Dolan must carry the can for that. The previous year when we played Celtic and did quite well seemed to have lulled people into a false sense of security, and they thought we just had to turn up to win. Actually I think that defeat acted as a wakeup call to clubs here. Whatever people say there has been a steady improvement in results that can be traced back to that result (with some notable exceptions of course) It's no surprise that teams going full time and switching seasons has meant our teams are in better shape to take on these games. The Cork performance the other night was probably the best I've ever seen by an Irish team at this level. This was no plucky backs to the wall effort a la Pats at Parkhead. Cork were much the better side, against the Swedish league leaders, and the only thing lacking was the goals to prove it. I'd love to see them make the group stages.

I'm drunk, but must reply: Pat's played five across the middle in a game where Zimbru by-passed midfield by playing long diagonal balls to their front two, who zipped all over the final third and split Pat's back three. Pat's failed to cope with that and, as a result, looked like conceding every time Zimbru had the ball.
The fact that Bucko played a six-man midfield in the away leg (with Molloy on his own up front) only opened up a congested Pat's even more and showed the naivety of Irish football. That's how a better side loses 10-0 to inferior opposition. Fitness is one thing, but organisation is they key to development and genuine progress. We have to learn to play football.
It's much easier to defend against superior opposition that to successfully attack inferior sides.