Bulgaria v Ireland 1977

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08/06/2005, 1:50 PM
stojkovic

Bulgaria v Ireland 1977

Just been reading the FAI's website.
It says that in the above game, Steve Heighway had a goal dissallowed when it was 1-1. We subsequently lost 2-1 and missed out on Argentina'78.

If my memory serves me right, it was Giles who scored the goal after Heighway weaved abit of magic of the left and crossed it in. It was headed down by someone and Giles smashed it home. The linesman deemed Heighway to be standing in an offside position way out on the touchline as Giles shot.

The game bacame a shambles and a mass brawl ensued with four sent off including Mick Martin and Noel Campbell (?).

Can anyone else remember this and is the FAI site wrong.
08/06/2005, 3:06 PM
Sunnyside Up

My memory is of Giles scoring too. Think it was knocked down by the goalie and Giles stabbed it in. Thought it was wrongly disallowed for a supposed infringment of the goalie. But memory is fading.
08/06/2005, 3:36 PM
stojkovic

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunnyside Up

My memory is of Giles scoring too. Think it was knocked down by the goalie and Giles stabbed it in. Thought it was wrongly disallowed for a supposed infringment of the goalie. But memory is fading.

Maybe the keeper did knock it down, but defo it was Gilesy.

The other one was Kevin Moran heading (ref said hand) it down for Michael Robinson to score (dissallowed) in Paris in 80/81.
08/06/2005, 3:57 PM
OwlsFan

It was on TV not long ago and I taped it. Definitely Giles and I replayed the offside decision about 15 times - absolutely scandalous. I reckon that linesman was on the take because no one was even close to offside.

That opens old wounds for me like a Stapleton goal in Paris in 1978 ??
08/06/2005, 9:18 PM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by stojkovic

Just been reading the FAI's website.
It says that in the above game, Steve Heighway had a goal dissallowed when it was 1-1. We subsequently lost 2-1 and missed out on Argentina'78.

If my memory serves me right, it was Giles who scored the goal after Heighway weaved abit of magic of the left and crossed it in. It was headed down by someone and Giles smashed it home. The linesman deemed Heighway to be standing in an offside position way out on the touchline as Giles shot.

The game bacame a shambles and a mass brawl ensued with four sent off including Mick Martin and Noel Campbell (?).

Can anyone else remember this and is the FAI site wrong.

What I remember about that "goal" was Highway turned his marker (no doubling up in those days) inside out, outside in, around again another two times so much so that the defender fell down dizzyly, Highway then had a clear space to cross the ball. AFAIR Highway didn't play any furthur part in that move.
09/06/2005, 2:10 AM
gypsydownunder

God I remember that "goal". Heighway crossed. Giles scored. In the second before Jimmy Magee mentioned the offside, I remember thinking what a brilliant end of Giles' career it would be - to score the goal that would finally send us through to the World Cup.

Retrospectively, had that goal stood, I think it would have changed Irish football forever. It would have been more important that Gary Mackay's goal nearly a decade later, as, arguably the players that followed in the 80s (Brady, Stapleton, O'Leary, Daly) were better than those in the 90s. (Yet, obviously the 90s team was more successful).

Oh if only the "break through" had come in Sofia. **** it did! Better rephrase that... if only the break through had happend in '77 rather than '87.
09/06/2005, 8:31 AM
dynamo kerry

what a sad tale. I've not seen the goal though.
09/06/2005, 8:43 AM
monutdfc

Quote:

Originally Posted by OwlsFan

It was on TV not long ago and I taped it. Definitely Giles and I replayed the offside decision about 15 times - absolutely scandalous.

That must have been great, having Gilesy round to watch the football with you ;) Bet he'd a few tales to tell.
09/06/2005, 9:35 AM
stojkovic

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conor74

Wasn't there something about the ref cavorting with Bulgarian women the night before the match, or am I confusing crooked refs?

The French manager, Hidalgo, was at the match.
The night before the game he was awoken in his hotel room in the middle of the night as someone burst in. It was a middle aged man with TWO stunning women (hookers). They said - sorry wrong room.

Next day at the match Hidalgo saw the man again - it was the referee.

I am serious.
09/06/2005, 9:41 AM
Kingdom

Thats right there was a massive article in the Sunday indo at the start of the season if I remember correctly.
09/06/2005, 10:52 AM
stojkovic

Quote:

Originally Posted by OwlsFan

That opens old wounds for me like a Stapleton goal in Paris in 1978 ??

Are you thinking of Robinsons 'goal' in Paris in 81 ?
Stapleton got the one in Belgium that was dissallowed then the ref gave them a dodgy free kick in the last minute when Eric Gerets dived about 25 feet (anyone remember that - its on the fai dvd) and they scored from it with Ceulemans fouling McDonagh.

Robbing b@stard referees.

We missed out on goal difference when we should have won the group containing France (WC82 semis), Belgium (Euro80 finalists) and Holland.
09/06/2005, 12:53 PM
Old Timer

:( Stop will ya.... im in bit's here, i watched every one of those games and we were robbed, on more then on occasion. And people wondered why the country went nut's in '88 when we did make it to a major final?
09/06/2005, 1:42 PM
Tipp Townie

Quote:

Originally Posted by stojkovic

Stapleton got the one in Belgium that was dissallowed then the ref gave them a dodgy free kick in the last minute when Eric Gerets dived about 25 feet (anyone remember that - its on the fai dvd) and they scored from it with Ceulemans fouling McDonagh.
Robbing b@stard referees.
We missed out on goal difference when we should have won the group containing France (WC82 semis), Belgium (Euro80 finalists) and Holland.

Yeah, a tough qualifying group that ended with a blanket finish between 4 teams... sounds familiar

Whats that Fai DVD you mention though? I was too young for the '78 and '82 qualifiers, despite the 'robbed' aspect i'd love to see some of the footage from back then.
09/06/2005, 1:58 PM
stojkovic

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tipp Townie

Yeah, a tough qualifying group that ended with a blanket finish between 4 teams... sounds familiar

Whats that Fai DVD you mention though? I was too young for the '78 and '82 qualifiers, despite the 'robbed' aspect i'd love to see some of the footage from back then.

Theres one called 'Greatest Irish Victories' but obviously only includes wins. Some dodgy ones against the likes of Albania. Maybe it should have included a few 'moral' ones like the great draws we got down the years. I think the Belgium incident is on it as its mentioned in passing and shows a clip of it while talking to Eoin Hand. Not sure though.
09/06/2005, 2:03 PM
Tipp Townie

Quote:

Originally Posted by stojkovic

Theres one called 'Greatest Irish Victories' but obviously only includes wins. Some dodgy ones against the likes of Albania. Maybe it should have included a few 'moral' ones like the great draws we got down the years. I think the Belgium incident is on it as its mentioned in passing and shows a clip of it while talking to Eoin Hand. Not sure though.

I've got the Greatest Victories one, some quality old(ish) footage on there, but too many recent games that are relatively meaningless (Georgia, Albania, Romania?!?!).

I guess i'm just a bit of an anorak, and would love to see some more of the old footage and not just the victories- ie. some late '70's, early '80's stuff. When you mentioned a dvd i got a bit over-excited!! :p
09/06/2005, 2:05 PM
OwlsFan

Quote:

Originally Posted by stojkovic

Are you thinking of Robinsons 'goal' in Paris in 81 ?
Stapleton got the one in Belgium that was dissallowed then the ref gave them a dodgy free kick in the last minute when Eric Gerets dived about 25 feet (anyone remember that - its on the fai dvd) and they scored from it with Ceulemans fouling McDonagh.

No, it was France not 1978 but 1976 but qualification game for the 1978 WC. I was there - first time following Ireland away. We had a perfectly good goal ruled out. Liam Brady got down the line, pulled the ball back and Frank Stapleton scored with a great header. The linesman's flag went up and it was disallowed, I don't know why.

Wednesday, November 17th 1976
World Cup qualifier
Parc des Princes, Paris
France 2 (Platini, Bathenay)
Republic of Ireland 0
Ireland: Mick Kearns (Walsall), Paddy Mulligan (West Bromwich), David O'Leary (Arsenal), Mick Martin (West Bromwich), Jimmy Holmes (Coventry City), Gerry Daly (Derby County), Johnny Giles (West Bromwich) capt, Liam Brady (Arsenal), Steve Heighway (Liverpool), Don Givens (QPR), Frank Stapleton (Arsenal)
Subs: Mickey Walsh (Blackpool) for Stapleton 63 mins
Manager: Johnny Giles
France: Baratelli, Janvion, Lopez, Tresor, Bossis, Bathenay, Platini, Keruzore, Rochetau, Lacombe, Six
Subs: Rouyer for Lacombe 73 mins
Referee: Maksimovic (Yugoslavia)

And as this thread had stated, the same happened in the same qualifying group in Bulgaria:

BULGARIA 2-1 IRELAND
The 1978 World Cup qualifiers had put Ireland up against France and Bulgaria for a place in the finals. Ireland had started badly with a defeat in France but had revived hopes with a win over the French in Dublin. Their final two games were against Bulgaria who were out of the running for first place. Despite this Ireland found themselves playing against a fired up Bulgaria and hostile crowd for the game in Sofia.
The home side took the lead early on but two minutes into the second-half Ireland got an equalizer when Don Givens headed home from Johnny Giles corner. After the goal the Irish grew in confidence and put the ball in the net a second time when Steve Heighway and Gerry Daly combined to set up Giles to volley it past the Bulgarian keeper. The goal was controversially ruled out though after the referee consulted with his linesman. After that the two sides began to lose their discipline. Frank Stapleton was badly fouled by Tvetkov and a mass brawl ensued before the referee finally restored order by sending two men from each side off. Before the end of the incident packed match the Bulgarians scored another to virtually end Ireland's hopes of qualification. After the match the French manager, Michel Hidalgo, admitted that "it was impossible to Bulgaria with that kind of referee, Ireland were robbed and I saw nothing wrong with Giles' goal."
09/06/2005, 4:05 PM
Noelys Guitar

Watched the game on RTE. When coverage started at the beginning of the second half all the Ireland players seemed to be around Givens. We had just equalized and RTE had missed it! Not long after Giles scored what should and would have been the winner. The ref was 100 times worse that the one we had on Saturday. It wasn't just disallowing the Giles goal. He refused to give any offsides for Ireland. I mean not ONE! So the Bulgarians had 2 players constantly beyond our back four. Then he sent off Noel "Gussy" Campbell who had been on the pitch less than a minute! It was Brady who threw the first Irish punch and poor Gussy got 2 black eyes and didn't throw any punches. All this happened on the running track around the pitch ( I bumped into Gussy at the bus-stop across form then Gaffneys garage on the Kimmage road a few days later). About 800 Ireland fans went out and you could hear them singing "you'll Never Walk Alone" on the box. They were showered with coins and a lot of the Bulgarians started burning torches near the end of the game. My neighbour went out and I still have a programme from the game.
09/06/2005, 4:39 PM
Noelys Guitar

Campbell played for if my memory is isn't playing tricks in the German 2nd division for Fortuna Cologne in 1977. I can remember the Stapleton goal been disallowed (watched on RTe). Was in Paris in 79 when a perfectly good Moran goal was disallowed. And then again in Belgium 81 for the next daylight robbery (Stapleton again robbed of a perfectly good goal). This was the time when every Irish fan would first look at the ref and linesmen when we scored a goal to see if would still stand!
09/06/2005, 5:03 PM
Donal81

1 Attachment(s)

Speaking of rubbish referees, how about the daddy of them all?
10/06/2005, 12:51 AM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by OwlsFan

Snipped: After the match the French manager, Michel Hidalgo, admitted that "it was impossible to Bulgaria with that kind of referee, Ireland were robbed and I saw nothing wrong with Giles' goal."

The last game of that group was a 0-0 draw against Bulgaria at home, had that game any significance? my memory is gone on that one.
Whatever green was being rubbed in those day was in the hands of the referee.
The effect that all those campaigns had on me was that when it came to Bulgaria and Scotland in 1987 there was not even one tiny percent of me holding out for a Scottish victory. I knew the game was happening. I blanked all hope.
It was absolutely the last thing on my mind when I turned on the BBC WS for the evening sports prog. and heard the headline news. It wasn�t just that we had qualified or that it was probably the first time that a ref. wasn�t bribed in Bulgaria, but that it was the first time that we ever had a stroke of good fortune in foreign fields and the justice of it all when it happened in Sofia.

The most blatant piece of corrupt refereeing that I remember was against Leeds in a uefa cup final in the '70s considering that it was a euro final televised live around europe.
10/06/2005, 2:24 AM
gypsydownunder

Quote:

The last game of that group was a 0-0 draw against Bulgaria at home, had that game any significance? my memory is gone on that one. Whatever green was being rubbed in those day was in the hands of the referee.

I think we had to win 4-0 to have any chance. I remember the game at Lansdowne. Very windy wednesday afternoon.
10/06/2005, 9:22 AM
OwlsFan

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

The effect that all those campaigns had on me was that when it came to Bulgaria and Scotland in 1987 there was not even one tiny percent of me holding out for a Scottish victory. I knew the game was happening. I blanked all hope.
It was absolutely the last thing on my mind when I turned on the BBC WS for the evening sports prog. and heard the headline news. It wasn�t just that we had qualified or that it was probably the first time that a ref. wasn�t bribed in Bulgaria, but that it was the first time that we ever had a stroke of good fortune in foreign fields and the justice of it all when it happened in Sofia.

Ah ye of little faith. I took the afternoon off work to watch the game at home with a TV panel consisting of Chris Morris and someone else (can't remember) and Laughing Bill. It was George Hamilton's finest hour: 3 minutes to go he says "It's time to crack open the champagne - ohhhhh, it's off the post!!". 2 minutes to go: "Let's get out our Deutsche Reise books - ohhhh, it's cleared off the line": etc etc Longest few minutes of my life made worse by George tempting fate on at least 5 occasions. I screamed at the TV: "SHut the **** Hamilton!!" AFter the gam for months afterwards I viewed the goal on the recorder at least 50 times just to believe it was real. Sad or wot ??
10/06/2005, 9:55 AM
Stuttgart88

Quote:

Originally Posted by OwlsFan

Ah ye of little faith. I took the afternoon off work to watch the game at home with a TV panel consisting of Chris Morris and someone else (can't remember) and Laughing Bill. It was George Hamilton's finest hour: 3 minutes to go he says "It's time to crack open the champagne - ohhhhh, it's off the post!!". 2 minutes to go: "Let's get out our Deutsche Reise books - ohhhh, it's cleared off the line": etc etc Longest few minutes of my life made worse by George tempting fate on at least 5 occasions. I screamed at the TV: "SHut the **** Hamilton!!" AFter the gam for months afterwards I viewed the goal on the recorder at least 50 times just to believe it was real. Sad or wot ??

LOL :)

I actually left the UCD bar with 20 mins to go. I had a date with some chick in town that night. I got home and my Dad said "you've got to see the tape - Scotland were robbed in the dying minutes". I thought " bloody typical" and watched it anyway. I couldn't believe it when it was over. How close did Bulgaria come to equalising?

My date that night was a total disaster. She went back to her mates after less than an hour becaause every 5 mins a mate would come over to me and we'd just hug, and scream "YESSSS!"
10/06/2005, 2:42 PM
Comic Book Guy

Good lord, you have dug up some very painful memories for me.
I somehow had managed to put Bulgaria in 1977 to the nether recesses of my mind like some bad childhood memory, but this name jumped out at me, Nikki Zlatanos, the name of the ref in Bulgaria (honest!!), a Greek, and a hate figure for me for many years.
WRT hookers in the ref's hotel this was confirmed by an Irish Times journalist some years later.
October 1980 in Paris is another painful one, but it pales into insignificance compared to March 81 in the Heysel stadium, Stapleton scored a perfectly good goal, the 'referee' from Portugal by the name of Fernando Nazarre actually pointed back to the centre circle to indicate a goal, then looked over at the linesman who immediately put up his flag as if this were rehearsed.
As the game wore on Belgium began to get more and more ridiculous calls until Gerets blatant dive on the edge of our box which led to their goal, Ceulemans fouling McDonagh in the process of scoring.
After the game several of the Irish players had to be restrained from getting at the ref, the Belgian players were laughing at the Irish coming off the pitch.
It was obvious back then to my young mind that something rotten had happened, no doubt in my mind that the officials took backhanders as they had in Sofia in 77 and Paris in 1980.
As if to bear out my suspicions several of the Belgian side were implicated in a match fixing scandal in their own country the following year yet were let off in time to play in the WC of 82!
As for the refs, well as you can see I have held this grudge for a long time and I would find it hard to forgive, (it's only a game I know, but these people corrupted it).
One last thing, apparently an interested spectator in Brussels that night was then Sheffield Wednesday manager Jack Charlton, who remarked that Ireland were robbed.
Well thank you for the opportunity for therapy, I hope I can put those memories to bed now!
10/06/2005, 2:59 PM
OwlsFan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noelys Guitar

This was the time when every Irish fan would first look at the ref and linesmen when we scored a goal to see if would still stand!

Still do - old habits die hard. Had the lads around for the Faroes game. When Morrisson "scored" they jumped up, but I had caught a glimpse of the linesman's flag and told them the bad news.
10/06/2005, 3:05 PM
Stuttgart88

Yeah, as long as I live I'll always look at the linesman when we score.
10/06/2005, 5:21 PM
Poor Student

Along the lines of the theme of this thread in our playoff against Belgium for France 98 did they score a goal as the result of a throw in that should have been ours? Possibly Luis Olivera? This seems to be stuck in my memory.
10/06/2005, 5:48 PM
dancinpants

Great thread lads!!! :)
10/06/2005, 5:50 PM
dancinpants

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poor Student

Along the lines of the theme of this thread in our playoff against Belgium for France 98 did they score a goal as the result of a throw in that should have been ours? Possibly Luis Olivera? This seems to be stuck in my memory.

I'm not sure, my memory's a bit hazy on this, but I'm almost sure there was some dodgy decision - didn't some ref "play" for Turkey in our play-off with them too? :confused:
10/06/2005, 9:56 PM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by OwlsFan

Ah ye of little faith. I took the afternoon off work to watch the game at home with a TV panel consisting of Chris Morris and someone else (can't remember) and Laughing Bill. It was George Hamilton's finest hour: 3 minutes to go he says "It's time to crack open the champagne - ohhhhh, it's off the post!!". 2 minutes to go: "Let's get out our Deutsche Reise books - ohhhh, it's cleared off the line": etc etc Longest few minutes of my life made worse by George tempting fate on at least 5 occasions. I screamed at the TV: "SHut the **** Hamilton!!" AFter the gam for months afterwards I viewed the goal on the recorder at least 50 times just to believe it was real. Sad or wot ??

Little faith?? ah now, it took great courage to admit to myself that I was in a sad state, then the next step was to admit that I have no control over those games that Ireland were not involved in.
10/06/2005, 11:25 PM
Noelys Guitar

Was living in London at the time of the Bulgaria v Scotland game so about 20 of us gathered around a radio listening to then BBC radio 2. No Setanta! The England, Yugoslavia game was being covered. With about 6 mins to go the Beeb went back to Bulgaria for a quick report. Still 0-0. Back to the England game. Then out of the blue they went back to Bulgaria and I can still remember the words of the commentator in Bulgaria. "Jack Charton will have to buy a crate of champagne for one Gary Mackay because he has just scored for Scotland" That is exactly the way he said it without ever actually saying it was 1-0! We all went ballistic. Bottles of cheap sparking wine and six-packs then into some gruesome bar in Acton but it didn't matter anymore. We were going to Germany. Incredible feeling. Definetely not as good as being in Ireland at the time but wonderful all the same.
11/06/2005, 12:52 AM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comic Book Guy

As if to bear out my suspicions several of the Belgian side were implicated in a match fixing scandal in their own country the following year yet were let off in time to play in the WC of 82!

Wasn't there also some scandal about Anderlecht bribing their way to the Euro cup winners final ?? against Parma @Wembley??
Some speculation about Notts Forest suing them.
11/06/2005, 3:49 PM
OwlsFan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poor Student

Along the lines of the theme of this thread in our playoff against Belgium for France 98 did they score a goal as the result of a throw in that should have been ours? Possibly Luis Olivera? This seems to be stuck in my memory.

Correct. We had fought our way back into the game. Equalised and then the linesman gave a throw to Belgium that was 100% ours. They score from the throw in :eek:

Kieft's goal in Gelsenkirchen. According to the offside laws at the time it shouldn't have been allowed - just a few minutes away from the Euros Semi.