next season

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11/01/2005, 5:48 PM
optimus

next season

is any body else worried that next season the season we are supposed to win the title our biggest rivals have signed arguably the 3 best players in the league and we have signed no one........
now i know we put together a fantastic run in the end of the season . but the cold hard facts are that last season with the same squad we finished 2nd.
and ive been listening to people saying that its great that a cork team finished second but am i the only one with the attitude that you never win silver you lose gold.
maybe im a little impatient for success.
but after years as a sleeping giant in the eircom league isnt it time we demand success.
weve been listening to all this talk about training facilities needing to be upgraded and they do . but the club seem more interested in building a new stand to replace the shed and have corporate boxes
corporate boxes me hole .
what we need is somewhere pat can bring his players and train harder and better than every other team in the league . somewhere he can bring overseas players he wants to attract and say " this is the set up we have isnt it great " because what he has to say at the moment is "this is the ground that we are renting and these are the training facilities we have to beg and scrounge from amateur clubs "
11/01/2005, 10:04 PM
Risteard

Is optimus actually pessimus?

a lot of decent points though i support Dolan 100%.
1. I'm comfortable in Pats cheque-book lying low at the moment. Its wise not to rush in to it. I actually think we're not far behind anyone squad-wise.
In fact with the relative youthfulness of the squad i'd much prefer to have Kearney and Doyle than to be signing the likes of Hawkins, decent as he is. Having said this, i'm confident that Dolan will find (just) one or two quality players that will strengthen the first team.
2. Scrounging from amateur clubs? Don't city scrounge from schools?
3.Corporate boxes are never gonna bring immediate joy to a decent supporter but they provide the club with a reliable money-maker for continued future investment.
4. You're dead right about the facilities i reckon. Its hard for anyone to judge but from the sound of things it seems like this is his immediate priority.
As i said above the talent is there, but it must be maximised. This is exactly where we have to show the hunger to win and be the best, not compete. These are talented professionals. Nurture them. (suppose a few coaches would be handy.)
11/01/2005, 10:36 PM
Fair_play_boy

Optimus, are you sure that you picked the correct nickname for this forum? With a post like that, the name Pessimus might be more fitting!
Maybe I am being too harsh here, but I think you might have missed the point about the corporate boxes. AFAIK, they are a handy source of income to the club which is badly needed to develop and maintain the proper training facilities that the club so badly needs.
Regarding the absence of any new signings, there are some weeks left still, but TBH I am not that worried about it. Shels have a relatively ageing squad, whereas several of the CCFC squad are not long out of their teens, and will probably improve and strengthen physically across the next 2 or 3 years. That, plus the wealth of talent coming through the underage section, makes it possible for Dolan and Lennox to keep their cheque books closed for the next couple of seasons, IMO.
And as for renting a ground, and borrowing other clubs' facilities, what is wrong with that? Many of the top clubs on the continent rent their grounds from the local city councils.
[P.S. Edit: Posted this before I saw Risteard's post. Do great minds think alike or what! :D ]
11/01/2005, 10:40 PM
optimus

who gets the money from the corporate boxes though ...
we dont own the cross we only rent it....
i know bishopstown was a disaster but at least it was our disaster.
and tis optimus not optimist.....
12/01/2005, 1:21 AM
�anna

I'm not sure of the ins and outs of it, but presumably we get a certain cut of the gate money for our home games and a certain amount goes to the MFA- dunno do they get a set amount, or is it a percentage. Either way, the boxes would increase that, and thus our share. Thats what I imagine the case is anyway
12/01/2005, 1:26 AM
Risteard

To add some presumption of my own

I'm sure this certain cut of gate receipts/ corporate box receipts will be the exact same as the proportion we invest in developments at the cross.
Ye with me?
For example if City are getting 60% of the gate, they are most likely paying 60% of the payments for the new stand.
12/01/2005, 1:30 AM
�anna

Quote:

Originally Posted by Risteard

I'm sure this certain cut of gate receipts/ corporate box receipts will be the exact same as the proportion we invest in developments at the cross.
Ye with me?
For example if City are getting 60% of the gate, they are most likely paying 60% of the payments for the new stand.

a good percentage of the money going into ground development comes from the government in the form of grants- maybe the remaining amount is split like you say, I dunno
12/01/2005, 8:43 AM
pete

I doubt city are spending too much of their own money on the new stand.

Season a long way off yet & might be that won't see signings until the middle of the season when that transfer window opens for english based players.
12/01/2005, 10:01 AM
Colm

Quote:

Originally Posted by optimus

next season the season we are supposed to win the title

I hate it when people say stuff like that. Why are we supposed to win the title?? Obviously we all hope we do and we do have a good chance but to say we are "supposed to win the title" is ridiculous. It only puts unneccessary pressure on Dolan and the players and gives our more reactionary and fickle fans a reason to start givning out if we lose a game or two at any point.
12/01/2005, 10:12 AM
drinkfeckarse

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colm

I hate it when people say stuff like that. Why are we supposed to win the title?? Obviously we all hope we do and we do have a good chance but to say we are "supposed to win the title" is ridiculous. It only puts unneccessary pressure on Dolan and the players and gives our more reactionary and fickle fans a reason to start givning out if we lose a game or two at any point.

Did Dolan not say he had a 3 year plan to deliver the league?? If so then this is the year.

Strikes me that he's only putting pressure on himself by coming out with comments like that in the first place.
12/01/2005, 10:32 AM
Colm

Quote:

Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse

Did Dolan not say he had a 3 year plan to deliver the league?? If so then this is the year.

Strikes me that he's only putting pressure on himself by coming out with comments like that in the first place.

I know everyone is always going on about this 3 year plan but did Dolan or Lennox actually ever mention a 3 year plan and if so was it for winning the league within 3 years or for developing the club and team over 3 years?
In a recent interview Dolan was quoted as saying "there never was a three year plan".

I'd be interested if someone could find a quote from when Dolan took over about a 3 year plan because I have a feeling it's just a myth that developed and we all started going on about.
The club and the team have progressed so much over the last two years and hopefully we'll progress even more next year but nobody should assume or expect that we are going to win the league.
12/01/2005, 10:36 AM
pete

I'd like to see more consistency next season. Much as the highs & lows are exciting it would show a good progression if we could elimante those big slumps we traditionally have.

If Pat could do more managing & less yapping to the press that would be a bonus too.

Things to look forward to:
- Setanta Cup home & away.
- UEFA Cup full house at the cross.
- European away trip(s).
- Irish player exiled in uk to return & surprise everyone (we seem to get at least 1 a season)...
12/01/2005, 10:40 AM
drinkfeckarse

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colm

I know everyone is always going on about this 3 year plan but did Dolan or Lennox actually ever mention a 3 year plan and if so was it for winning the league within 3 years or for developing the club and team over 3 years?
In a recent interview Dolan was quoted as saying "there never was a three year plan".

I'd be interested if someone could find a quote from when Dolan took over about a 3 year plan because I have a feeling it's just a myth that developed and we all started going on about.
The club and the team have progressed so much over the last two years and hopefully we'll progress even more next year but nobody should assume or expect that we are going to win the league.

Good point, don't know myself if he said anything like that. I'm just going off what I've picked up from City fans on this board.
12/01/2005, 10:42 AM
patsh

I think Brian Lennox has remarked on a few occassions about a 3 year plan. Never heard Dolan actaully mention it.
12/01/2005, 10:48 AM
razor

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colm

but nobody should assume or expect that we are going to win the league.

What clap trap.
I do. It is one of my expectations at the beginning of every season.
To win the league. the bread and butter.
Is it wrong to expect your team to win the league every year?
I mean in a lot of cases its not realistic but it is in our case.
I expect success from the club because I know we are capable of it.
Its what being a supporter is all about, every supporter of every team has some level of expectancy.
12/01/2005, 11:02 AM
Colm

Quote:

Originally Posted by razor

What clap trap.
I do. It is one of my expectations at the beginning of every season.
To win the league. the bread and butter.
Is it wrong to expect your team to win the league every year?
I mean in a lot of cases its not realistic but it is in our case.
I expect success from the club because I know we are capable of it.
Its what being a supporter is all about, every supporter of every team has some level of expectancy.

Surely you hope to win the league more than expect it Razor? And you are right in saying that it is very realistic but it is just as realistic for Shels. As long as we push Shels all the way and I know we've done as much as we can I'll be satisfied. I think that if referees and the timing of fixtures are a bit kinder to us this year that we will win the league but I still would not say that I expect it or that we are supposed to as that's just silly talk.

Hopefully we'll win the league and/or the Setanta cup and have a good euro run. Those three should be our priority
12/01/2005, 11:15 AM
Gary

I could be wrong here, but did Dolan not say that his objective is to deliver the title in his first 3 seasons?

I also think he and Lennox both said that the aim is to win the title in 2005, at the Rebel Army Ball last year.

Personally i dont expect City to win the league this season, but I do fancy a season long slog with Shels, were no more that 4 points will decide it again. Unfortunatley, I think Shels probably have a little too much.

My hope for the season

Top 2 finish in the league with no more than 3/4 points gap
A good FAI Cup run
Final of the Setanta
Progress one round in the UEFA and hope there is a favourable draw from there.
The reserves to give a good account of themselves in the League Cup

Dont ask for much, do I?
12/01/2005, 11:37 AM
jimhacker

"More managing and less yapping"

Amen to that.

Is it a coincidence that our long unbeaten run occured during a period when our normally verbose manager was relatively (by his standards) silent?
12/01/2005, 11:53 AM
razor

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colm

Surely you hope to win the league more than expect it Razor?

Both, i'm sure if you ask Brian Lennox he'll tell you he expects to win the league next season, so why shouldn't we all.
12/01/2005, 12:09 PM
Casegrande

Quote:

Originally Posted by razor

Both, i'm sure if you ask Brian Lennox he'll tell you he expects to win the league next season

He'd want to get out the cheque book then!

We won't win the league unless we make 2/3 decent signings. We defintely won't if we let the likes of Woods go to Water-****in-ford.
12/01/2005, 12:54 PM
paudie

Quote:

Originally Posted by �anna

I'm not sure of the ins and outs of it, but presumably we get a certain cut of the gate money for our home games and a certain amount goes to the MFA- dunno do they get a set amount, or is it a percentage. Either way, the boxes would increase that, and thus our share. Thats what I imagine the case is anyway

I'd have thought the MFA would get a fixed rent for each game and City would keep the gate receipts. Not sure though.
12/01/2005, 7:44 PM
�anna

Quote:

Originally Posted by paudie

I'd have thought the MFA would get a fixed rent for each game and City would keep the gate receipts. Not sure though.

either way, it would mean more money for city if/when these boxes are put in
12/01/2005, 7:46 PM
optimus

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shed resident

dont you have anything good to say about city. everyone knows that the clubs main aim is to get the training facilities, its the mfa that are building the stand at the shed end not cork city so stop giving out out about city when you havent a clue what your on about.

trust me i have more of a clue then you my young friend so tell you what you keep goin to the cross for the slim chance you have of scoring with one of the 15 years old young wans at the back and il discuss football with the big boys.
this is whats known as a message board .
on a message board you voice your opinion on a wide range of topics .
i decided to voice my opinion about the lack of training facilities and the fact that as a cork city supporter i feel that in accordance wiith pat dolans plan that we should be winning the league this year. read my original post to get the gist of it. ive been a city fan since the day my dad took me to see a game in 1985 about 5 years before you were born.
as for saying something good about city thats all i do to people who laugh at me when i tell them i dont support celtic or man u that i support cork city.thats saying something damn good right there in the age of interactive football and sky this that and the other i spend my friday nights not in the pub , not at home but in tolka park, the stadium of light , wherever scumrock rovers are playing this week and the greatest stage of them all turners cross in the wind the rain and the sleet worshiping 11 men.
and i dont know what im talking about
i love this club as do you i suspect . but this is a rough world and a very competitive league and i want my team your team our team to do well.
its very simple you build a house from the ground up you build a foundation at the minute city dont have that foundation .
we need training facilities ten times more than we need corporate boxes or a fancy new stand. thats my point but seeing as i dont have a clue what im talking about i better be quiet and wait in the corner until its my turn to speak.
13/01/2005, 7:56 AM
razor

Quote:

Originally Posted by optimus

i better be quiet and wait in the corner until its my turn to speak.

Do you actually know the corner ? :D
13/01/2005, 4:50 PM
Fair_play_boy

Quote:

Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse

Strikes me that he's only putting pressure on himself by coming out with comments like that in the first place.

I honestly believe that this is part of Dolans overall game plan. He seems to visualise each desired outcome and then puts in place the things that have to be done to make it come about.