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Looking at the ROy Carroll saga got me thinking - Has Ireland ever been robbed by a refereeing decision that could have been overturned by a video referee.
The only one that springs to mind for myself was for linekers goal against us in WC90. We should have had a throw 10 seconds proir to the ball being played in for Salt n Lineker....
Any more?
When Holland scored their winner against us in Euro '88 there was a player in an offside position. Back then the interpretation of "interfering with play" was different and many officials would not have allowed the goal. (However, it did go straight in and it would have been a very unfair decision to rule it out.)
HERE HERE !!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Conor74
I remember that Dutch goal in '88 alright. Horrible. And John Aldridge's goal away to Spain when he was NEVER offside would have won us the match instead of 0-0
AFAIK away to belgium in 81
euro 88 against holland definate offside
italia 90 should have been ireland throw.
WCQ v spain in seville??? john aldridge scored ruled offside but was onside.
anybody who is offside in the 6 yard box should be ruled offside. (he was pretty close top the 6 yard box. thats in the line of sight of the keeper.)Quote:
Originally Posted by monutdfc
Belgium in 97 just before they scored they're 2nd goal, i think it was a throw we should have had and it was given to them and they scored as a result.
if I remember correctly, the refereeing performance in that game was abysmalQuote:
Originally Posted by razor
We really should hate Belgium.Quote:
Originally Posted by razor
Thank olivera ******, hated him, big poxy ear ring, not good enough to play for Brazil so I'll declare for Belgium.
Loads of them. Belgium the worst by far. Holland 88 perhaps forgivable (Van Basten was trying to get on-side) but Seville in 92 also bad, although did not cost us a place nor the game as in 82. Paris six months before Belgium 81 was also memorable (Robinson goal), Bulgaria in 1977 (apparently the ref was spotted coming out of his hotel room the night before the game being held up by two scantily clad, and very drunk, 'chambermaids'). Also - for a special mention - US Cup 92 and 96 against Italy and Mexico, refereed by an Italian-American and Cuban-American respectively.
Aldo in Spain was a sickner alright. Defo onside.
Was that out of play? Never thought so, just remember Sheedy (?) stopping playing for a split second with his hand raised. Stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by blobbyblob
Not a match we cared about, but the game against Mexico in the '96 US Cup deserves a mention - ref a Spanish-speaking American (or Puerto Rican or something) chatting to all the Mexican players before the game, awarding an apparently dodgy penalty and sending Liam Daish off for "time-wasting" and sending Mick McCarthy off for throwing the ball away...
Can't beat that Belgian game though - there was an article posted here a while back which had an interview with the ref about the game, and he was quite clearly trying to weasel out of admitting that he was bribed and threw the game.
On the plus side, though - anyone remember the second goal against Hungary in 1989 in Lansdowne? Houghton clearly pushing the defender in the back and looking around in shock when no free was given before crossing for Cascarino to score. Swings and roundabouts! :p (Bar the bribery, of course... :mad: )
....or Alan Mcloughlin being offside for our equaliser against England in Italy.
Or the Turkey game in 1990. 5-0. The ref was, I think, Swedish. Apparently he was seen coming out of his hotel bedroom being propped up by two very drunk 'chambermaids'. Oh, I've already done that one. Anyway, he get's my vote for the bloke I'd like to ref every Ireland game.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
I think these all fall into three broad categories.
1. The blatent ones (with a strong hint of corruption)
- Belgium 81
- Bulgaria 77
2. The obviously mistaken decisions - eg
- Aldo's goal in Spain
3. The debatable decisions - eg
- throw-in v England 90
- offside v Holland 88
The blatent ones stand out - especially Belgium. There was a strong whiff about this one and its since been proven that Anderlecht were bribing refs during this period. There was a spooky interview in the Sunday Trib a couple of years back with the Portugese ref - a Mr Nazere(?) which only hightened suspicions that something very dodgy took place.
Was it Anderlecht who were (allegedly!) guilty of bribing a referee when they played Nottingham Forest in the European Cup in Cloughie's heyday? It was a blatant case of daylight robbery and I think Clough got in hot water for pointing it out. Anyone know the details?Quote:
Originally Posted by fergalr
Just go to google and type in:Quote:
Originally Posted by monutdfc
anderlecht bribery nottingham forest
During a conversation I had with two accomplices in a cafe in downtown Sofia, I mentioned the name Gary Mackay...Quote:
Originally Posted by Conor74
went down really well I tell ya. :D
What about the two penalties awarded against Ireland when we played Macadonia. Two cases of ball to hand if I remember, one against Terry Phelan, not sure who the other one was against.
The penalty awarded against Lee Carsley in the playoff game against Turkey is another one. Handball has to be deliberate and that one was never deliberate.
Was at the play off game in Bursa v Turkey in 99, so never got to see the incident again on tv, but the foul by Turkey's goalie Rustu outside the box on Connolly which should have seen him get a red card in the first ten minutes.
[QUOTE=lopez]Loads of them. Belgium the worst by far. Holland 88 perhaps forgivable (Van Basten was trying to get on-side) but Seville in 92 also bad, although did not cost us a place nor the game as in 82. Paris six months before Belgium 81 was also memorable (Robinson goal), Bulgaria in 1977 (apparently the ref was spotted coming out of his hotel room the night before the game.
Was that the game were I think it was Jimmy Holmes broke his leg and the team spent the rest of the night after the game running around Sofia looking to see were they took him due to nobody knowing from the Bulgarian FA where and what hospital they were taking him to.
It was the one in 1977 which cost us any chance of going to Argentina. There was an article by a journo in an Irish paper in the eighties (perhaps around the time of the game or us qualifying) by someone. TB read it out at an RISSC meeting. It was like: 'As I watched the game, the face of the referee became vaguely familiar. Where had I seen him before? I suddenly remembered! Falling out of his bedroom at our hotel the night before with two scantily clad ladies of the night helping him try to walk.' Could you imagine Colina in that state? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by sylvo
Belgium in '81 was by far the worst for me.
Gelsenkirchen in '88 was a sickener too, but just as much for the waxy nature of the goal. I never saw the Bulgaria game, only heard it on the radio.
Belgium in '87 was awarded as our throw but because play was delayed due to an injury play resumed with a Belgium throw which led to the goal.
With regard to the England game in Cagliari, just before Sheedy scored Kevin Moran fouled Chris Waddle for what I thought was a slam-dunk penalty which wasn't given. Everyone around me thought it was a penno. When it wasn't given we all shouted "Cheat, Cheat" at Waddle. Quite funny.
Belgium
Bulgaria
Were disgraceful decisions and we suffered because we were such a minor nation then. I don't think it would happen now, as we have a higher profile and possibly a bit more clout.
I always felt sorry for Eoin Hand in particular, because he is such a decent guy, does so many good things for soccer in this country and he had the glory and honour of leading Ireland to their first major finals snatched from him by disgusting and corrupt little cnuts....:mad:
Uncomfortably close to home, eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by Aldini98
Christ, some of this stuff is reminiscent of the English reaction to their elimination from Euro 2004. The sheer effrontery of national team fans complaining about the officiating of ITA-IRL in 1990 beggars belief. Schilacci actually scored a hat-trick in that game; his second goal was erroneously disallowed for offside, his third came from a free-kick which clearly bounced behind the line after striking the crossbar (despite the proximity of the Irish wall, which was almost closer to the ball than Schilacci himself as the free was taken.)
As for Belgium in 1997, I recall it being said at the time that only Irish national team fans could see their team draw 0-0 at home to Iceland and Lithuania, get outplayed by a superior (if still pretty hopeless) team in both legs of the play-off, and bitch about being knocked out of the World Cup by a throw-in. :rolleyes:
I agree that was a dodgy decision but I still hold David Connolly fully responsible for us loosing that game. Every time I see him in an Ireland squad I'm disgusted.Quote:
Originally Posted by razor
Another one springing to mind - remember hearing Jack Charlton talking in one of those reminiscing shows about a blatant penalty against the USSR in Euro '88 - Tony Galvin "decapitated" by Dassayev, as he put it. Don't remember much about the game now to be honest, but think I remember something like that - anyone remember better? The win would have put us through to the semis too...
That throw against Belgium was shocking - though didn't absolve us of defending, obviously - but the lad standing beside me in Paris was muttering about it every time a decision (especially Pires!) went against us..."F***ing linesmen/referees...robbed us in Belgium and they'll rob us now!" :p
Damn it! The last post and I was waitin to put that digusting chalenge by the Russian keeper in 1988 on Tony Galvin in....I have the tape at home he was clean through and was lifted out of it. Knocked head over heels. It was obviously a peno. We we're 1 up and probably would have crusied into the semi's. Stapleton also missed a sitter in that game. We deserved to win. Having said that it swings in roundabouts I thought Given's challenge on Van Nistelrooy in 2001 was a sure penalty......
Yet another urban legend. I don't remember the incident, but I can tell you categorically that it didn't cost Ireland a place in the semis. A victory over the USSR would have made no difference to the final group placings in the light of Ireland's defeat to the Netherlands.Quote:
Originally Posted by onenilgameover
It wasn't, actually. They still should have hammered you that day, mind.Quote:
Having said that it swings in roundabouts I thought Given's challenge on Van Nistelrooy in 2001 was a sure penalty......
Regularly away from home from about 1924 up to 1987.
As regards Bulgaria under the Communists. They did not lose at home in a competitive game for years until Gary Mackay scored for Scotland in that never to be forgotten 1-0 win which meant we went to Germany for Euro '88.
What about the officials not letting Aldridge on for ages during the Mexico game at USA 94? I don't remember the details to well, but I remember being ****ed off.
The disalowed Aldridge goal in Seville is the worst decision I can remember against Ireland.
Yet another urban legend. I don't remember the incident, but I can tell you categorically that it didn't cost Ireland a place in the semis. A victory over the USSR would have made no difference to the final group placings in the light of Ireland's defeat to the Netherlands.
Right some clarity needed...
If we had of beaten the Russians we would have all been on 6 points having all beaten the english and by virtue of beating the Russians and losing against the Dutch we would have gone through with the Dutch.
The Galvin incident is not a urban legend ye spoon I have it on tape and remember watchin live it looks like a scene from a horror movie.
Thats your point of view with the not given peno in 2001 for me it was a sure thing....
Wasn't it 2 points for a win back then?Quote:
If we had of beaten the Russians we would have all been on 6 points.
I was referring to the thesis that a victory over the USSR would have put Ireland through (as I noted above, I don't recall the Galvin incident.)Quote:
Originally Posted by onenilgameover
And the only spoon here is the one you're going to need to cram that humble pie in your face, boy. The system of three points for a win wasn't introduced for major international tournaments until 1994, so a victory over the USSR would have left Ireland on four points.
Factoring in the Irish defeat to the Dutch and the subsequent USSR 3-1 England result, Ireland would still have finished third by virtue of having scored fewer goals against the group's whipping boys (England.)
On detailed examination (four-five replays), there was no obstruction on Given's part. The referee, of course, had no such luxury, and I'm amazed he didn't award the penalty. His nationality (German) and that of the diver (Dutch) may have had something to with it....Quote:
Thats your point of view with the not given peno in 2001 for me it was a sure thing....
PS: You didn't play Russia until 1994.
No way was that a penalty in 2001. Given had nowhere else he could go, it was Van Niselrooys fault for jumping into him and falling over
After analysis I'd agree with the Given vs V. Nisterooy decision, but at the time I couldn't believe it.
My recollection is that a win over Russia would NOT have got us through. We'd have gone out on GD because we only beat England 1-0. We'd still have gone through if England beat Russia (by 2 goals?). My mate, a staunch republican, said that even under those circumstances he wouldn't want an England win!
Dassayev took Galvin out of it with a two-footed challenge in the box. Aldo was unlucky not to smack in a volley - it looked like he missed by miles but it was pretty close. He should have scored though. I think at the time it was Ireland's best ever performance and if Aldo had scored I think it would have been the best we'd ever scored. If, if, if...
Anyway, George Hamilton cost us the game. He kept going on and on about how we hadn't conceded a goal in 12 games.
Of those games in Sofia, is it true the Bulgarian army had their guns pointed at the Irish throughout the game, threatening to shoot fans who stood up even though it was p1ssing rain?
2 points for a win in 88 - had we got that 2nd goal and won 2-0 and assume the 1-0 defeat v the Dutch USSR would have needed to beat England 3-0 to knock us out. We would have been in a strong position.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
We were done in Sofia in 77 (Giles had a perfectly good goal disallowed that would have put us 2-1 up late in the game - lost to an even later winner) and 87 (winning penalty was at least a yard outside the area) but France were also done in the WC78 campaign in Sofia but then we also had a perfectly good goal disallowed in Paris that would have made it 1-1 in the 2nd half - 4 years later same story in Paris. We had too many moral victories in those days.
Belgium 81 was by far the worst. I have no doubt that Mr. Nazare was bribed. no referee could ever be that bad. That game still haunts me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Conor74
Was chatting to some of the lads from the supporters club here who were over at that game, the team and most of the fans were all in the same hotel and after the match when they came back to the hotel Johnny Giles went up to them and asked if they had a tour guide with them on the trip cause they couldn't find out what was going on about Jimmy Holmes and nobody could speak English, so the team, tour guide and even some of the fans joined in the all night search for him, total madness.
Also when we played them in 87 away there was something dodgy about their winner, I can't remember totally but I know they scored in the final minutes after Stapleton had made it all level, but I remember there was something about their winner that night also.
I was there in 1987 and, due to superstition, I wore these green shorts at the game (we had remained unbeaten in every game I'd worn them, including Scotland that February). Anyway the Bulgarian fans were alright, but as I was walking into the ground I felt this sharp pain and turned round to see this group of policemen laughing. The next minute more sharp pain and this time a mean looking pig is staring at me waving his huge truncheon. I notice that there is a switch on the truncheon and two metal prods at the bottom. The c*nts were juicing me as I'm walking by with a police version of a cattle prod. :mad: The shorts went in the bin after this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Sure was. Dodgy penalty where the foul was outside the area in the final minutes. Same Portuguese ref as at the Italy game in 1990.Quote:
Originally Posted by sylvo