Ireland 1 Bulgaria 1

I might be ****ed off because I lost £20 on this game.


Given - Played well

Finnan - good going forward, easily turned though

O'Shea - Steady game

Cunningham - Steady game

Doherty - Not international class


Andy Reid - Man of the match

Keane - A evening stroll

Miller - Neat & tidy

Kilbane - Very poor - did nothing

Morrisson - Just ok, wouldn't socre in a whore house

Duff - Very poor - expected a lot more

Subs

Carr - One good run, should play in the qualifiers


Gary Breen - Keep this man as far away from the Ireland team as is possible
why is it always for both club and country when he tries to head a ball
it usually drops a couplce of feet away, and usually the opposition scores.

Kavanagh - Whay is an average 1st div footballer hacker comming back to pick the ball up
from the defenders when he has only the vision to pass two yards.

not exactly a great performance by ireland. Reading on Sporting Life, Kerr's excuse is that everyone is a bit rusty. Well to a certain extent thats true, Duff for one, and were missing Robbie. Maybe its just because the season has started back up but the bulgarians were giving us a lot of respect and I was expecting a better performance all round.

Codex, take off your biased glasses and start over. You obviously don't rate Doc, Breen, and Kavanagh so you didn't give them a proper rating. What are you taking about Kavanagh and 2 yard passes? He played the holding role when Roy went off and did well IMO (if you want to see 2 yard passes have a look at Neil Lennon and he is rated very highly by the top coaches in the game). He also gave a great long ball to Macken from about 30 yards.

I admit a bias against 1st division players as most of them are not up to premiership level football or international football, that is why they they play most of their careers at this level.

I rate Doc(on his way), Breen, and Kavanagh as 1st division players.

Andy Ried is 1st division player but not for much longer as he
has been looked at by premiership scouts/managers and considered good enough to contribute at that level.

Whether you rate first division players or not, Kavanagh didn't have a bad half hour and doesn't deserved to be criticised. Keane hardly made a long ball pass all through the game yet you slate Kav for making simple passes. Kavanagh isn't even a holding midfielder so I wouldn't even judge him on that half hour (not that I would anyway). I've only seen a lot of Kavanagh over the last year or so but he could be a late developer. I've no reason to be biased but I've seen Liam Miller about 20 times and Kavanagh is a better central midfielder. I've no doubt Miller will most likely turn out to be twice the player but if they were both 21 year old's Kavanagh would be rated better by almost everyone.

Thought Kavanagh did okay, though no better. Certainly not as bad as is being suggested, but not as good as against Brazil. Macken showed some good movement off the ball. O'Shea was appalling and hardly put a foot right. Cunningham was iffy at times - some wayward passes. Duff was disappointing. But the game was played at the usual friendly walking pace, so can't take much from it again. Cyprus will be the big game.

I wonder will people still persist with the rubbish notion that Duff is a striker? Seing as the last 20 or so inept preformances up there did nothing to stop it they probably will. Andy Reid is one class act though. Kavanagh was average, no worse, but someone claiming he's better than Miller? That's rubbish.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Slash/ED

I wonder will people still persist with the rubbish notion that Duff is a striker? Seing as the last 20 or so inept preformances up there did nothing to stop it they probably will. Andy Reid is one class act though. Kavanagh was average, no worse, but someone claiming he's better than Miller? That's rubbish.

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I wouldn't get your hopes up, I'm sure people will argue that Duff does indeed have a "mental competitive block" after all. As for the Kavanagh he is a water carrier and nothing more, I don't even think you could "compare" him to Miller, maybe "contrast" yes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by davros

Get ready for the rest of his supposed international comeback....... :rolleyes:

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can i just say, i don't know if this could be seen on tv, but when keane came off, they just walked through midfield....he just sat and cut out passes and did all the work, but yet very little...i like kavanagh nice player, but not in keanes league even at his age...all did ok for me apart from breen, disaster overall...

ok shows how good morission is when heskey is signed by birmingham....... :rolleyes:

I didnt see the match unfortunately, as it clashed with an England
game and so not much chance of a pub showing it in England, also
due to the weather I couldn't even hear it on the radio.

It didn't sound like we did great, but we were 1-0 up untill some
of the more 'first choice' players were taken off.

Somehow I though we would struggle against a 'lesser' side, they
drew with England in a qualifier (at home) a few years back (5)
and have lost their last 4 games.

I would have played Reid up front and Duff on the wing though.

Looked a bit like a result from the last qualifying campaign didn't it?

I don't think Duff was fully fit (at least not according to his club manager).

Good that Reid got MOM though as he need a move up to the Prem
and Forest need the money!
(there is a big thread on it on the Forest site (119 posts!!) which will
keep you busy if you want to read it)
http://forum.nffc.co.uk/showthread.php?t=58228
Hope that works. (Its a very busy forum).

Anyways hope things go better for the Cyprus match, I am sure
they will.

very flat performance by both teams in a stadium that had a vacum atmosphere.i think once for the full 90 mins did the "irish crowd"chant as one and indeed were constantly outsung by the bulgarians :eek: .

andy reid did well but still looks to be carrying some extra timber.

roy keane did well defensively but his passing was very wayward as he kept leaving his passes short.

o shea looked very out of sorts and i think breens confidence is at an all time low as he could'nt even complete a pass during his 2nd half performance.

very tame affair even allowing for it being a friendly.

Agree with whats been said so far, only good thing to come out of last night was Andy reid, who I thought was head any shoulders above anyone else. Morrison is one of the worst strikers I've seen in a green jersey unreal, O'shea was crap. I think maybe as it's August they can all be excused, real tets to come in September..

after all its only a meaningless friendly. However the likes of Clinton and O Shea I wonder about. Lots of hype about O Shea but to be brutally honest i dont rate him. Its just the fact that he plays for united.(cue flames). Clinton tries hard, but just doesnt have that final touch.

Great game by Andy Ried. He probably played so well as it was a chance for him to get the fúck out of division 1. I hope some priemership club buys him, he needs to work on his fitness but looks very good. On a side note, doesnt mc geady play on the same position? How will Kerr fit those two players in, in a years time.

Roy Keane is a seasoned pro, I thought he was strolling around at times, but obviously reads the game better than anyone else on the park and so doesnt have to run around all the time. Its going to be a big problem with he retires!

Half of our defence werent in the wide awake club and made some serious errors on the park last night, do that again in 2 weeks and we arent going to Germany.


Kerr played some players that I defintely wouldnt have let on the pitch. Namely doc, Kilbane and Breen.

so far I think the line up should be the following, ? means i dont know

________________Given
Carr______ Cunningham________ ?_____ ?
Reid ______ Miller _____ Keane _________Duff
_________ Keane_______ Clint

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Slash/ED

I wonder will people still persist with the rubbish notion that Duff is a striker?

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Duff has booked his place up front for the next game, no doubt.
He obviously needs to get his sharpness back but he did very well last night.
Reid was Man of the Match for me.
How could you keep him out of the team!?
O'Shea was as ineffective as ever.
Made about 2 runs in the entire game.
He was completely lost for the goal.
Didn't know where he was supposed to be or who he was supposed to be picking up.
Carr did more in his first 10 minutes on the pitch than O'Shea did in the entire game. I always thought he wasn't trying but I'm satisfied now however, that O'Shea just isn't good enough. Where was all that great passing people were talking about.
Kavanagh wasn't anything to write home about and Macken looked very out of place. Quinn looked like he'd cope with the likes of Cyprus and lesser teams but may lack the experience for a bigger game.
Miller did well and will find a lot more space down that flank in games away to France and Switzerland.
Kilbane is great going forward but is a bit suspect covering back in the centre.
Clint just doesn't have a good first touch and his decision making is poor.
Anyone I haven't mentioned, just did enough.

Starting XI in the next game, providing everyone is fit.

------------Given---------------
Carr-O'Brien-Cunningham-O'Shea
-Miller----Keane-Holland----Reid-
------Duff----------------------
------------Keane--------------

How many times did O'Shea try to back heel the ball? Very fustrating!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by the 12 th man

very flat performance by both teams in a stadium that had a vacum atmosphere.i think once for the full 90 mins did the "irish crowd"chant as one and indeed were constantly outsung by the bulgarians :eek: .

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Last night was an embarassment in this respect.I was hoping the buzz from the Wednesday previous might carry over but it was f*cking dire.Ireland home games consist of a crowd of cynics and critics who have lived too long in an era of expectancy.Maybe a couple of years of underachievement might bring a sense of perspective home.

Did no-one else think Finnan wasn't up to it at all. I thought he had a sh1t game. Was over beside him in the East Terrace for the first half and he was off his man a lot and looked to lack confidence, and that probably comes from being at a club that do not want him. Carr will definitely get his place in the qualifiers.

Agree with Morrison being very poor. He has nothing, no pace no skill, just a big mouth that is constantly giving out to other players when he f*cks up, and a bad habit of being on the ground more often than standing up. Must be learning it from Heskey!

I watched the game with Pat O, Sylvo and the lovely Helen and we must have watched about fifteen minutes of the game closely. Hardly riveting stuff. There were players with points to prove last night and they didn't take the opportunity. From what I did see, however, the one bright note for me was Kevin Kilbane. I simply can't agree with Condex's assessment. He was involved in a lot of link play and put himself about in the midfield. Good for him.

:) PP

Here's what I thought:

Duff put in one of his worst performances ever in an Irish shirt, he did nothing when he was in the forward position. I can remember 1 excellent run he had in the second half, but that was from left midfield.

Don't know why people are bashing O'Shea and Finnan, they both had solid games and didn't make any mistakes.

Doherty and Breen are disasterous, if O'Brien is injured either O'Shea or Keane must fill in.

Andy Reid is a sensation, he will be one of the best Irish players of all time. His range of passing is incredible and his first touch and ability to beat a man are second to none. He must be accomidated in the team for the qualifiers, either in the centre beside Keane or on the right.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by carnstien

Duff put in one of his worst performances ever in an Irish shirt, he did nothing when he was in the forward position. I can remember 1 excellent run he had in the second half, but that was from left midfield.

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Duff was well marshalled and won some great free's and corners for us.
Pity we couldn't make them pay though.
I think people are judging Duff as a winger and think he was poor because he didn't play like one. Are they forgetting that Reid was out there, so Duff didn't need to be making those runs!?
Duff needed a better strike partner than Morrisson though.

SHAY GIVEN: Did well when (rarely) called upon in the first half, busier in the second half and could do nothing about the goal (see below)

STEVE FINNAN: Very quiet on the right in the first half, pushed forward more into the second half. With Nunez's injury at Liverpool, he may be given a chance to establish himself on the right of midfield

JOHN O'SHEA: Come back when you can tackle, pass and track back. In a green jersey, I mean.

KENNY CUNNINGHAM: Still Mr Reliable, more than made up for a slack pass in the opening minute with timely tackles and headers from Doherty's mistakes

GARY DOHERTY: Early errors seemed to unsettle him, once Cunningham was telling him what to do he calmed down and made some important tackles and interceptions. Unlucky not to score from one of the numerous set pieces

ROY KEANE: Think he missed about 2 passes in the whole game and did everything else right. Maybe not pushing forward as much as the Keane of old, but in a team with Duff, Reid and Miller he didn't need to

LIAM MILLER: Came more into the game as it passed out - says a lot about his general fitness - tried to make the perfect forward pass too often, Keane has no problems passing back to keep possession.

KEVIN KILBANE: Worked hard and could have scored with a header.

ANDY REID: Was surprised as the rest of us the free went in. I was delighted, I had him at 14-1 to score from outside the area!

CLINTON MORRISON: A wasted point blank header early in the 1st half summed it up - works hard, wins the ball but needs that final touch. Dropped deep to help Reid and Duff as well. I'd worry about his club form

DAMIEN DUFF: "Mental concentration block", my arse. Looked dangerous every time he got the ball, as evidenced by the doubling up on him from the Bulgarians. From where I was standing, it looked like he rotated with Reid and Clinton in a triangular formation up front, which worked well but left us short of attacking options at times. I said it before, as soon as Duff gets the ball near the by-line, get someone (anyone) on the far post, he'll hit that cross every time.

SUBSTITUTES -

GARY BREEN: Totally at fault for the goal by letting the striker win the ball in the air to lay it off, and made several passing errors. Got appalauded after making a successful pass!

STEPHEN CARR: As you were for Carr, even on this short showing, he will be right full against Cyprus and the Swiss

JOHN MACKEN: Tried hard, held up the ball well and laid on an excellent chance for Alan Quinn. Crowd reaction was better than I expected

PADDY KENNY: Another good showing from the Blades no. 1, but he'll have his work cut out for him to oust Shay Given.

GRAHAM KAVANAGH: No Roy Keane (who is??) but a more than able deputy. Although, he does need someone to play beside him.

ALAN QUINN: Showed why Sheffield United were willing to take him up a division with his work rate, and forced probably the best save of the second half

Doherty was not that bad, but he did not have much to do, but compared to Breen last night he was Maldini or Mc Grath. Breen must have played about 10 long balls into touch, I think that Munster should sign him to replace Ronan O Gara. Keane was solid last night, but he was sloppy compared to his usual self, IN a side note I met him last night and he was a total gent, he was there for ages signing for the kids. Duff had one of his worst games for Ireland but that is compared to some great games for us. Miller was neat and tidy and no more. Morrisson is not clynical enough for us but trys hard and his link up play is ok. Carr has to be our right back as he was more adventurous and more agressive than Finnan. Overall and very drab and sloppy performance and the crowd was terrible, Lets hope when it gets a bit serious we will be up for it


Finally I agree with Brian Kerr no point in predicting what the first team will be until you have all the players available. Pointless excersise really as we dont know who will turn up .

Disappointed by last night. A lot of poor performances. The Doc was shocking, Macken looked out of his depth, O'shea was poor, Clinton never looked a threat, Keane didn’t look bothered, Kilbane was very mediocre and Breen couldn't win a single header. Duff was average but is lacking games and gave glimpses of what he can do on occasions. On a positive note Andy Reid really began to show his class for the first time.
Was a little disappointed by some of Kerr's decisions too. Would have liked to have seen a bit of variation up front. It seems Duff is the man up front if Robbie's unavailable. Continued with Duff and Morrison and then Macken even though it was blatantly lacking any form of penetration in the second half.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bowsy

Keane didn’t look bothered.

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Perhaps, but look what happened the midfield when he went off.
He's still No 1 as far as I'm concerned.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Peadar

Perhaps, but look what happened the midfield when he went off.
He's still No 1 as far as I'm concerned.

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Not questioning his ability but by Keane's standards his was a very mediocre performance last night. Take your point though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bowsy

by Keane's standards his was a very mediocre performance last night.

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He has a league game on Saturday and a CLQ game on Tuesday.
Would you blame him for not breaking his back in a friendly?

Very little positives to take from that game - but it was a basically a pre season friendly kind of game - players will improve after a few games - they will be sharp. We really need Robbie Keane back for the next few games - we have serious problems without him - I know he is untried at this level but I certainly think mcgeady is deserving of a place in squad - he is playing for celtic and will get some champions league action.

Reid looks class though and I have high hope for the Irish team containing him, Duff, Miller and the 2 keanes.....I am worried bout the defence though

Quote:

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Originally Posted by concanta

...I am worried bout the defence though

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Everyone being fit, left-full is our only problem in defence.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Slash/ED

Kavanagh was average, no worse, but someone claiming he's better than Miller? That's rubbish.

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OK, so you are going to judge Kavanagh on a half hour playing out of position (he's no holding midfielder)? If we were to judge players on yesterday's performance I can safely say that Miller was certainly no better than Kavanagh and if there actually was a better performance it was by the latter. Read my comments below to see why I don't think Miller was out of position.

Some people on here really are giving Kavanagh a hard time. They are all Irish and Keane was no better than Kavanagh last night. But, while Kavanagh gets cut no slack for playing out of position, Keane is playing a match on Saturday so has to take it easy. :rolleyes:

I have seen loads of Miller and loads of Kavanagh. Most people on here have seen little of Kavanagh. Why would I be biased? I am no relation to Kavanagh I just want the best for the Irish team and Kavanagh is better than Miller. Put it this way, Miller has rarely had a good performance in the middle. All his best performances for Celtic have come on the right with Petrov and Lennon in the middle. He played in the middle for Ireland against Poland and Nigeria and was nothing more than OK. He played on the right against Romania and got MOM. Kavanagh is the leader of the Cardiff team half of which are internationals and without him they struggle.

IMHO Miller is not an option for the middle yet and its between Holland, Kavanagh and Kilbane for that spot. Holland will get it if he's fit, if not Kerr will play Kilbane.

Good post,Eirebhoy you clearly know your football, and therefore your opinions shoudl be respected rather than people who mouth off without checking their facts or basing it on one or two games. I do think that Kavanagh for now is a better option in midfiled than Miller. However I do think that Holland and Kilbane are ahead of him. On the right Miller is probably in pole position, and lets be honest he has barely trained this season, and he looked unfit last night, I think maybe Duff or Reid may play the wings either. I just hope Duff does not play upfront, I think that Reid and Duff swapping wings througout a game coudl work wonders and they are both intelligent players that both go outside and come inside, and the full back would be all over the place. Keane Drops deep for ireland so I dont think him and duff upfront would work. Depite Morrisson not been very clinical upfront, i think for the balance of the team he is probably the best option at the moment. In a side note, i was well impressed with Alan Quinn for the second game running. He looks a good prospect with plenty of attitude and confidence and good passing ability. Lets hope he has a good season at Sheff utd.

Personally I would still like to see Kilbane in the middle of the park. Had a very average game there last night but still think he can do the best job and is a threat in the air. Very well put Eirebhoy on the stick given to some lads like Kav for not performing whereas Keane is just seen as legimately taking it easy. Players should be judged by the same standards.
If Robbie's fit it's himself and Morrison still for me at the moment. Would have liked to see Lee get a run out yesterday though.
Agree with you Neil that Alan Quinn didn't do too bad yesterday. Has a tendency to over run the ball and not give it quick enough IMO but that said when he did last night he still managed to get himself out of it and retain possession. Needs to be getting first team games though to be considered a real option.

Awful game, thought we should have been a few goals to the good by half time. Got a lucky goal then sat back a bit and left them back into it.

Morrisson infuriated me last night, the boy is total rubbish, he is not a team player and seems only interested in massaging his own massive ego.
He missed a sitter of a header early on and then went down in a crumbled heap, waving his arm furiously to the bench, like the Italians feigning injury in that ad. At this point my hopes were raised that he might have to go off, he limped to the line and then was grand again, not a bother. Balls.
If one of the opposition did this they'd be booed for the night.
When people say he works hard, does this mean he runs around a lot and jumps aimlessly for the odd ball that comes in the air?
He's a bluffer, a spoofer. He's not worthy.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by razor

Awful game, thought we should have been a few goals to the good by half time.

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We were lucky not to be 1-2 down boy!
What game where you watching?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Peadar

Duff has booked his place up front for the next game, no doubt.
He obviously needs to get his sharpness back but he did very well last night.

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No he didn't. as ever when played up front he got the ball with his back to goal, got the **** kicked out of him and was completley ineffective in setting up chances for the most part. The only time he looked dangerous was when he went over to the bloody wing. Why do we persist with wanting to play him out of position, it's the most frustrating decision any Irish manager can make. His goals record, and the goals record of his partners, when played up front is frankly nothing short of absolutley pathetic, I think he and Keane had something like 3 gaols tgoether in over 20 games together, maybe someone knows the exact stat but it was something along those lines.

I'm not basing anything on Kavanagh last night I'm basing it on years of watching him, he's average at best. He's a good division one player which is why he's spent so long down there without anyone touching him. He can do a job for us but he shouldn't be started ahead of someone who's done it in the champions league like Miller.

On a lighter note, as infuriating as he was i had to laugh at when that gobsh*te on the left wing for Bulgaria got the massive bandage on his head after barely getting touched.

Hard as nail that lad. :D

It was a pretty average game with most of our players putting in fairly average performances.

I think Carr had a great game, he made one error (when he slipped on the ball) which luckily the Bulgarians wasted. He went forward a lot and had one great run into their box but noone was there for the cut-back.

Andy Reid was also good, I think we should start with him in the team for Cyprus.

I would have liked to have seen Barret and Alan Lee given a chance as they've been in superb form for their clubs so far. I also think Lee should get more of a look-in given the injury to Robbie, Morrison's lack of form, Macken's inexperience at this level and also given Duff is wasted playing upfront.

I think the match against the Cypriots wont be as easy as it was last time, and if we dont play with an out and out striker we could end up without a goal.

Without being too negative.....This match worried me. We at times reverted back to the form shown against the Swiss and the Russians last year and if we play like that against better opppostion in Basel or in Paris we will get beaten. Mid August is not the time to be playing these matches and I don't think alot will have been gained and some momentum may have been lost.

Given: Nothing really to deal with saved well from a long distance effort and one that may have creeped inside. Was not at fault for the goal which was very well hit.

Finnan: Not a very secure performance

Doherty: Is getting better but is he really good enough to play at this level at the back or up front.

Cunningham: Very assured performance. Great tackle in the first half

O'Shea: To much meesin around he is not as good as he thinks he is. This is crunch time at United for him unlikely he will be there next season.

Miller: Was out of the game for long periods which he has a habbit of doing he needs to force himself to do more and be the player most of us believe he can be he is not doing this now but its early days.

Keane: Strollin

Reid: Best player on pitch. Crazy why he is not bein snapped up.

Morrisson: Has had to much time to prove himself which he has not he has proved however that he is not international standard.

Duff: Everything he touched turned bad today. His confidence is low and needs games, it was good though that they kept givin him the ball.

Breen: Awful but he is still a superstar.

Carr: Mistakes?

Quinn: looks good but could be shown up

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Slash/ED

I'm not basing anything on Kavanagh last night I'm basing it on years of watching him, he's average at best. He's a good division one player which is why he's spent so long down there without anyone touching him. He can do a job for us but he shouldn't be started ahead of someone who's done it in the champions league like Miller.

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Kavanagh has a good record in div1. He scored 6 goals and got 7 assists last season and only played 26 matches. Andy Reid played all 46 matches and got 13 goals and 14 assists. When you consider its Reid's job to score and assist while Kavanagh has to do a lot more work in midfield. Also Kavanagh played in the premiership with Boro but was cursed with injury, he played 50 games though.

Miller started 2 matches in the CL if i remember correctly, he played superb against Anderlecht but where was he playing? On the right of midfield. The midfield was Thompson-Petrov-Lennon-Miller. I missed the Lyon game due to work but he played on the right in that game too AFAIK. He played in the centre against Villerreal and I'm sure you'll admit he had a poor game. At this moment in time I wouldn't even consider playing Miller in the middle.

No need to worry the midfield is going to be keane plus either Holland or Kilbane depending on who is fit, that leave Duff and Reid to play the flanks, both can play either side. Alternatively Duff will play up front with Miller taking the right side of Midfield. It all depends on who Kerr wants in the team more, Miller or Morrisson, and where he will play Duff. That is the one and only choice in the team IMO. All the rest are sown up with maybe the exception of right back which may go to Finnan, but I dont think so.