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I know that it's all to play for, but the shoving from slimy Martin and the posse of the damned look like they have finally removed another of Irish politics legacy office holders. I was told by an FG insider that their "sources" are saying that Cowen will resign tomorrow and an election be called for mid-next month.
Cowen to stay...
Events moved quickly since I posted this. Maybe I was a day early - in that he'll go tomorrow. Great listening to the TD's lining up to support Cowen, now John Curran is on board. Martin blundered, he's lost the top job now - unless he transfers to FG :-)
Always felt that the first to move would not win the leadership- hence they were all too scared to actually make a real move. Looks like Cowen has outflanked them and will most likely hold on.
What we need now is for him to win the vote, then for yet more stuff to come out about his cosy relationship with the Golden Circle :)
The Waterford Witterer is on PK now, 2 people you'd never tire of slapping.
Agree with you on the fear factor, I see this as being FF's mandarins making sure they get back into power with another snake in charge.
Cowen is supposed to have said to a local Radio Station that Michael Martin's offer to resign as Minister is staying on the table until after the Fianna Fail parliamentary party meeting tomorrow.
Tomorrow will be very interesting. Are the "Conspiritors" uniting behind Martin or are the likes of Hanafin and Lenihan looking to takeover too?
Since he rejected it yesterday, does that mean he doesn't actually believe himself at this stage?Quote:
Originally Posted by juan
I don't think Lenihan has the balls, and if he does go for it, I hope he gets shafted.Quote:
Tomorrow will be very interesting. Are the "Conspiritors" uniting behind Martin or are the likes of Hanafin and Lenihan looking to takeover too?
Aye, echo that.Quote:
Originally Posted by dahamsta
All three current pretenders are in serious danger of not being elected in the General Election - would the leaders bounce offset the reduced local profile? I hope not...
I can't see how Martin will be re-elected after this, surely the voters will see it's a set up. Cowen badly needs to get Mary O'Rourke off the scene as she's going to angle for one of her boys to go for top spot. I'd take them all out the back of the Dail and do a Ceaucescu on them.
If anything they'll see it as one of their own being shafted by them hoors up in Dublin. That's Irish politics.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spudulika
Thanks Mr. A, I keep forgetting that it'll be looked at like that. Look at the heads who have been disgraced but re-elected.
Cowen’s phone calls suggested he has the numbers to win, so he’s called the conspirators’ bluff. The problem for them is that the first to move is the first to be gunned down. In the blink-off, Martin panicked first.
He has the most to lose – he’s been tipped as a leader for almost a decade, and his reputation has been smeared by references to indecisiveness. If he didn’t act now (and I don’t think he wanted to – hence Hamlet on the Leeside), he would have confirmed his dithering nature, and probably wouldn’t get another chance. But, remember, this is a man who threatened to offer his resignation and who has campaigned half-heartedly at best.
Spudulika, I think you momentarily underestimated the Cork propensity for victimhood and martyrology: a good shafting would set Tricky Micky up to top the poll. Disgruntled FF voters could safely vote for him as a protest against the party and Dublin/Offaly langers. Warped logic, but this is FF. And, more pertinently, FF in Cork – whose dissident TDs some texter to Pat Kenny’s show today called the Four Corkmen of the Apocalypse....
Meanwhile, Lenihan’s been very quiet. Don’t rule out a succession deal between Cowen and him. I suspect Schoolmarm Hanafin, who doesn’t drink with the boys in the Dáil bar, might have to satisfy her ambitions by supporting another candidate for the leadership, with her as deputy.
No matter who gets it, I wish them a spectacularly long career as the first FF leader never to be Taoiseach!
Pat Rabbitte made a point on TV during the week that with so few FF TD's safe in their seats, the prospect of facing into an election soon after challenging but failing to depose Cowen as leader is possibly stopping challengers from emerging.
EG, bang on the money.
One thing I will add though, Lenny's gonna keep schism simply because:
1. He knew he would be at a Euro meeting today so no need to say anything at all over the weekend.
2. The ballot is secret so he can just say after tomorrow that he supported x knowing that no one will know.
3. It's In his interests for Cowen to lead into the next GE as he will take a lot of flak for Lenny.
4. Mammy and Kebab can do any dirty work for him and he can deflect it.
5. Whoever leads FF into the next election is going to lose and therefore will not stay on. in theory. Lenny can take up the mantle then.
Will Lenihan's health hold up? I thought he only worked 4 day weeks?
I think his success in the election would be more an issue at this stage tbh, I think (hope) people are seeing him for what he is, finally. Has his health really been the issue it's been made out to be?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
Who?Quote:
Originally Posted by Spudulika
The word from the Lenihan camp (with their regular helpful leaks and comments from auntie and little bro) is that his cancer has stabilised and he's fully able to continue working (and would love to lead FF).Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
I'm ecstatic that Cowen is staying on. Fianna Fail will be annihilated with him as leader. I always gave them credit for being shrewd electoral tacticians, but how stupid are they to face the country with one of the chief architects of the bust in charge? They're asking the electorate to consider Cowen's record and put him back into government for another five years. I can see the posters now: his fat head with the slogan "A lot of damage done. More to do".
As has been said, he obviously knows he has the numbers to win the confidence motion having spoken to TDs over the weekend, otherwise he wouldn't have called for the vote. Lenihan was clearly keeping quiet, waiting in the long grass for a heave. Often the person who starts the coup loses out. Didn't Heseltine stick the knife in Thatcher, but the loyal Major got the job? This must be what O Cuiv (did I mention who my grandfather was?) is hoping for, but he has zero chance. If FF had a new leader they might con a few of the more gullible voters into believing they'd changed, but Cowen may as well have Seanie Fitz and Mikey Fingers canvassing for him. If Cowen leads them into the election, I'm revising my estimate from 45 FF seats to 35. Fingers crossed.
I had to double check who you were referring to. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by BonnieShels
:bigsmile:Quote:
Originally Posted by BonnieShels
Cowen's opponents need 36 votes to oust him, and begin a leadership contest between themselves. So far, they have 7 declared votes. FF heaves are notoriously dirty, so there'll be plenty of backstabbers around before the vote is taken. We've already seen some of it from both sides in the media.
All this talk of for and against, what does it matter? It's a secret ballot, the actual tallies probably won't be announced so there will probably be plenty of talking from both sides of the mouth being done.
;)Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fly
I was worried that someone may confuse EG with EG. Thankfully it's very obvious I meant EG and not EG as there was no comment about John Delaney, the FAI's love of Ulster's children or the fact that clearly Norn Iron R d shizz!
Hey! Guys! I know my posts can be longwinded, but puh-leeeze...Quote:
Originally Posted by BonnieShels
(Alright, time to 'fess up: I had to do a double-take myself - I'm not used to seeing my eminent appellation in the abridged sense!)
Well Cowen survives for another day. Surprising in some sense but it appears that Cowen had done his maths and was happy last weekend that he had enough votes to survive. Would like to see MM challenge for the leadership post the election when it is almost certain Cowen will have stepped down. Lenihan has come quite poorly out of the whole scenario, appears to be shown upon as deceitful, canvassing for a support to oust Cowen in recent months but declaring this support for Cowen in the last 24 hours.
I for one want to see FF punished in the next election for the ruination of the country in recent years. I think the vote of confidence in Cowen strengths the chances of this in the election, whereas a new leader would have allowed FF to advertise themselves as a fresh start etc in the election. 8% rating for the leader of the largest party in the polls, says it all really.
Like Martin I jumped the gun, but god I had to laugh at FF yesterday. How can anyone, and I mean, anyone, vote for them. They're a wreck. I wondered watching the news and Primetime whether this wasn't all an elaborate charade to bring Lenihan out into the open and destroy him. Martin too. Lenihan used Mammy and Conor to knife Biffo, Martin couldn't control his ego. Last night Martin looked like he was about to cry, he'll be re-elected by the morons who told Morning Ireland yesterday - "sure isn't he one of ours". This is the same rhetoric that these "citizens" rounded on the Catholic Church for using in relation to pervert priests and employees.
Cowen takes the Foreign Affairs portfolio.
Best decision he's ever made. Not giving this job to Dick Roche
Cowen taking over Foreign Affairs as well is just bizarre though.
Mary O Rourke reveals that Cowen won comprehensively:
Have I mentioned that she annoys my happiness? Would love to see her lose her seat again.Quote:
However, Longford-Westmeath TD Mary O’Rourke said on Twitter this morning the motion was carried by a margin of two to one. “So now the fuss is over - vote was 2-1 in favour of Brian Cowen... secret of course!!” she tweeted. “All very polite and would have preferred a bit of blood and thunder myself... this politeness won’t last!”
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/...breaking1.html
I’m disappointed with Lenihan on Sean O’Rourke yesterday: such arrogance to deny fomenting dissent, when he should have ignored the question. It reminded me of Brian Lenihan Snr. Apples don’t fall far from trees. It’s no surprise that an FFer might be a duplicitous snake in the grass, but there’s no need to offer proof. A lot of angry FFers, but I still suspect he and Biffo have an “understanding”.
Hanafin’s dead in the water. It’s too late today to say she voted against Biffo. She should resign as minister, but that takes integrity and courage. Might not get re-elected, but that would mean voters preferred Barry Andrews. The evil of two lessers....
Tricky Micky will romp home and, playing the martyr card, could still have a tilt at the leadership. But he’s got a lot of work to do to show that that he has guts and authority.
And O’Cuiv is still the likeliest compromise candidate.
Agree with Dodge on not giving Dick Roche (aka Cockroach – ah! Double puns!) Foreign Affairs. But it should go to someone like Peter Power, or any other TD who needs a boost. Even a month as minister could save a TD, repay a debt to, oh, Barry Andrews, say– and shaft Hanafin. Win. Win. Win.
Brian Lenihan, found to be telling mistruths, who'd have thunk it! Only when it's an internal matter do the FF backbenchers spit the dummy...Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminence Grise
Or stag hunting or something similarly earth shatteringly important.
It's not bizarre at all. He took over the Defence Ministry also when O'Dea "resigned". He had the Foreign Affairs Ministry during the Nice 1 referendum. Of all the cabinet posts, it's probably the least important, so Martin is not much loss.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr A
It was fairly obvious Cowen would have the numbers, he called the motion after all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr A
Tough choice - either its her or (god help us) Donnie Cassidy :(- as Westmeath/Longford always go with at least one FF candidate
I wouldn't consider foreign affairs unimportant in any way, shape or form. Until we get back to farming - something Fianna Fail is currently fighting tooth and nail against, see "sugar beet" in the news - two of our most important sources of income in Ireland are tourism and taxation of multinational companies. It's kind of important we have good relations with everyone else.
Which makes it even more important that we get rid of this buffoon as soon as possible. Biffo as the face of Ireland? Jesus help us all.
Who has two thumbs and doesn't give a ****?Quote:
Originally Posted by dahamsta
http://www.independent.ie/multimedia...ld_455622t.jpg
Wow! In terms of political ladder Its just below finance, level with Justice, and ahead of everythign else.Quote:
Originally Posted by mypost
Maybe mypost is North Korean?
It isn't more important than Health, Justice, Social Welfare, Education, or Defence. It would struggle to be level with Communications, Environment, or Agriculture imo. In the current climate, Joe and Jane O'Toole in Roscommon isn't that interested in the internal affairs of Tunisian politics or how much overseas aid per month Zimbabwe is getting, the kind of things that the Foreign Affairs Minister may have to find out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
It's a nice one to get, there's lots of wining, dining, and foreign trips on our expense, but there are a good few more important cabinet positions than it.
Wow indeed Dodge.
YOu think cabinet positions are handed out on the basis of what "Joe and Jane O'Toole in Roscommon" are interested in? LOL, seriously?Quote:
Originally Posted by mypost
Harney resigned and is not standing in election.
I enjoyed listening to Lenihan trying not to say what he'd been doing, but the more he tried to FAI/LOI his way out of it, the worse it looked for him and the more a fool he sounded. There will be a lot of big companies with new Board members on them - Harney for the VHI?