for the future

just wondering why no contact has been made with the school boy level in the county from the club? for example a link for the schoolboy players to progress from.

take mohil, they have set up an academy now with full time coach, think melview are doing the same thing. melview have 160 registered schoolboys in their club and mohil have roughly the same amount, who are now recieving full time coaching and i personally think that some sort of a link needs to be firmly established between these progressive schoolboy clubs and the club.

its just my opinion and i hope that from the hundreds of kids now recieving this level of coaching around the county that the club can benifit in the long run while it would also give the kids something to work towards.

by the way i know its getting funded with the fai paying half the coaches wages and not exactly sure where the rest is coming from, more than likely the county council or the club themselves.

Over the years there's been major friction with the Longford Schoolboys League any time LTFC has tried to get involved at anything below U16 level. I'm not 100% sure but I think at the moment there's an understanding that once the best players leave the Schoolboys set up they'll head towards LTFC but they've been very reluctant to enter into any formal arrangement. I believe Longford Co. Co. was one of the very few to refuse to contribute to an FAI Regional Development Officer for the county when the scheme was set up. May have changed since but I'd be surprised.

i know this situation between the schoolboy league and the club has a lot of history but it has gone on too long and its is damaging to football in the county if it continues this way, talk to anyone involved in the underage set ups and they will tell you this also. there is not any such gentlemans agreement as such, in fact the schoolboy league a few years ago introduced an under16 league to try and keep some of the players, but it was quickly scrapped after one or two seasons. the underage coaches from the town still have to go around and look at the players from under 14,15 and try and pick out who they think should come for trials with the town. the club should be looking at something like st.josephs have with bray wanders or some other such arrangement, there is numerous examples all over the country and it just seems we are missing the boat on potential talent that is only getting proper coaching from under 16 upwards!

and plus one on the co. co. they were one of only one or two country who refused to subside half of a rdo's wagesin the country, which was an absolute disgrace at the time and not enough was made of it at the time,nothing was said against it actually.

thats why i included that im not 100% where the other half of the wahes are coming from but i know the fai are paying half!

Totally agree with you lads a link is needed for certain and the co.co should be ashamed for not giving us what we need in terms of a dev. officer theres plenty of good young players out there its just a matter of finding them and developing them.

i agree with you howsyourtouch that some link has to be made, and a concrete one at that, but as with a lot of things at the moment it comes down to money, as with most sports in this country we are reliant on volunteers to train teams, bring players to matches etc so maybe coach education for them in terms of the kick start courses could be looked at. If we had coaches that have their coaching badges, maybe they might be able to pick out the better players for trials for the town, and as you say the st josephs bray model could be followed. It something that definately needs looking at as surely the schoolboy league in the town should be aspiring to develop players to reach their potential, wherever that lies

Ok I think i am in a good position to comment on this ! As I currently work as a coach during the day in Roscommon and manage the Town under 16s this season, at the moment I am in the process of completing my UEFA youth badge and then will be going for my UEFA B licance. I will be honest that at the moment I don't have any dealings with the schoolboy/girl league in Longford but I would like to see a link been made there and I belive that it may happen in the future as it will be of great benifit to all. When it comes to Soccer in Longford, we ran an open door policy for trials for a number of weeks pre season for the 16's and a grand total of 29 players took part on and off of which I now have a good squad of players - 21 in all. When I started and was thinking of the trials I thought there would be at least 50/60 lads wanting to play but it wasn't to be and as I have been told most young lads are GAA players in Longford and don't want to commit to soccer from 16 up. What makes it even more amazing is that I have players traveling from Roscommon, Elphin, Carrick on Shannon, Mohill and Ballymahon twice a week for training and then again for our game on saturday wanting to wear the red and black and so to be honest it does dissapoint me that more lads in Longford are not coming out wanting to play in the red and black. I do go to watch school games in Roscommon and Longford when possible to see if I see any good players and before anyone asks no I don't get paid for this but love doing it so this is the reward for me and the biggest reward will be when some of my squad plays for the first team and belive me they will ! Now my point to this is - never mind turning this into a Longford Town v Schoolboy/girl league, go out and support both and encourage the young people of Longford to work thier way into the Red and Black. Follow the U-16's at www.msleague.ie and the U-18's at www.ccfl.ie

Further to the above, i was in discussion with Philip Coffey this morning and as he is the man in charge of youth development at the club, he wants me on his behalf to post this comment: He wishes to let people know that all training sessions within Longford Town underage system are open to the public and that everything done within the underage system is transparent and nobody is hiding anything from anybody. He also wants to emphasise that from when we started this season we have now in place a proper player pathway system, which means that from U-16 there is a complete link to the first team,the pathway is U-16 to U-18 to the Airtricity U-19/20 to the first team, this also includes that all training and match preparation is ran in the same way at alll levels. That link is strenghtened by the fact that Philip Coffey who is the first team assistant manager is involved in coaching at all levels down the line and is currently managing the U-18 squad. All coaches working within the underage system are at least working on their UEFA Youth Cert. Philip himself is qualified to UEFA A Licence standard (this is the same level as the majority of coaches in the english and top european leagues). When we have the system fully sorted within the club it is his hope that Longford Town and the Longford Schoolboy/girl league can work in conjunction with each other and develop young players and help them meet their full potential in soccer in Longford and surrounding counties. Anyone with any queries regarding the youth system can contact the club, we will only be too happy to address any questions or concerns you might have. At this stage it is in all our interest to ensure that we do what we can to secure the clubs survival into the future and we at Longford Town FC believe that developing young local talent is the way forward.

A lack of proper coaches is a major problem not just in Longford but Ireland as a whole . I was meant to go and do my kickstart during the summer but the FAI are a joke when it comes to answering a phone or replying to an email. Its the same story for refereeing. I contacted the FAI about refereeing/coaching courses back in end of May start of June and I didnt get a proper reply until the very end of August!!! I rang them almost everyday and left several emails but nothing. In the end I decided to get my refereeing career going and im now well into my first year as a ref in the ldsl but next year I really hope 2 go and start coaching.

on what massop said, this is a good way forward and i know about all the coaches working within the club, philip has uefa A, peter malone has uefa B as does larry mullanes and massop yourself are doing your coarses so this is the way forward, the link i would be referring to would be to tap into the academys which are springing up around the county and trying at best to take the best young players from here if you catch my drift. alot of the time the players coming into the under16s will never have recieved the level of coaching which they are thrown into with the club and it is a shock to some of the them, unless they were lucky enough to be involved with the kennedy cup teams, i know for myself personally that the training and coaching for this tournament brought on me and all the players i was playing with leaps and bounds, things like positional sense and shape. the work being done at underage and the work that has been done in the past has been a trojan effort on everyone involved but they keep plugging away.

This is just my opinion now and not from the club or anyone within it - Outspoken, "Lack of proper coaches" !!!! Does UEFA Coaching standards not count in your world ??? Come to training next week and say that to us coaches then take the session and see if YOUR standards are better than UEFA ! Take my advise you won't get anywhere in coaching by saying that about the coaches you need help from when getting your badges, you don't make it easy for yourself. Sitting at a computer giving out about everything is easy, why don't you come out from behind the computer and discuss things face to face with the people you are always giving out about !
Hows your touch, the point you have made is a valid one and we are currently looking into that but to be fair I had the hope that the best players would have had the ambition to move up the ladder and push for a place during the trials this year. What is the point in looking to sign a great player for him not to want to take the chance himself. I would have no problem meeting you to discuss this with you further if you would like as doing on an internet forum is not how I like to do discuss matters.

Massop: paragraphs are your friend.

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Originally Posted by Massop 10

This is just my opinion now and not from the club or anyone within it - Outspoken, "Lack of proper coaches" !!!! Does UEFA Coaching standards not count in your world ??? Come to training next week and say that to us coaches then take the session and see if YOUR standards are better than UEFA ! Take my advise you won't get anywhere in coaching by saying that about the coaches you need help from when getting your badges, you don't make it easy for yourself. Sitting at a computer giving out about everything is easy, why don't you come out from behind the computer and discuss things face to face with the people you are always giving out about !
Hows your touch, the point you have made is a valid one and we are currently looking into that but to be fair I had the hope that the best players would have had the ambition to move up the ladder and push for a place during the trials this year. What is the point in looking to sign a great player for him not to want to take the chance himself. I would have no problem meeting you to discuss this with you further if you would like as doing on an internet forum is not how I like to do discuss matters.

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Mate i wasnt saying that Longford Town have no proper coaches i am saying that local clubs all around ireland dont have proper coaches im talking about the really young players here like u-10s or watever , i didnt mean any offence towards you or any other of the Town coaches I know from talking to some of the lads on the u-18 team that the coaching they receive is top class im just saying the really young players in local parishes dont receive the basics eg how to pass the ball because they dont have qualified coaches at their clubs.

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Originally Posted by outspoken

Mate i wasnt saying that Longford Town have no proper coaches i am saying that local clubs all around ireland dont have proper coaches im talking about the really young players here like u-10s or watever , i didnt mean any offence towards you or any other of the Town coaches I know from talking to some of the lads on the u-18 team that the coaching they receive is top class im just saying the really young players in local parishes dont receive the basics eg how to pass the ball because they dont have qualified coaches at their clubs.

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Outspoken: Sentences that don't last a paragraph are you friend too.

Furthermore, there are 165 teams in the LDSL. The LDSL are lucky to have enough parents willing to manage these teams and organise training and all, nevermind having people with the necessary badges for the respective teams.

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Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

Outspoken: Sentences that don't last a paragraph are you friend too.

Furthermore, there are 165 teams in the LDSL. The LDSL are lucky to have enough parents willing to manage these teams and organise training and all, nevermind having people with the necessary badges for the respective teams.

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Ok fair point

Totaly agree with L.T.F.C. on that point. Only for the parents and people who coach the kids in the LDSL there would be no players for us at Longford Town to work with so they all need praise for the job they do and not to be made feel like they are not doing things right cos they have no badges ! You don't need badges to show an 8 year old how to kick or pass a ball. Getting kids out with a football is the first step then the rest can be worked on and as I said earlier this season is the start and with a bit of work Longford town and the LDSL will hopefully work together in coming years to make sure they both make the pathway from the local schoolboy team to Longford Towns first team is as seemless as possible !

Not sure I agree with the lack of need for qualified coaches at 8 year old level, to be honest, they should have proper coaches. We (as in Ireland) won't produce technically gifted players without the proper infrastructure right down to that level. Also, they shouldn't be playing in competitive leagues at that level either.

However, those are bigger issues than simply Longford Town, and should be part of a national plan. The FAI have just laid off the techinical director. And just to be clear that wasn't meant as any disrespect for any of the people currently involved!

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Originally Posted by Macy

Not sure I agree with the lack of need for qualified coaches at 8 year old level, to be honest, they should have proper coaches. We (as in Ireland) won't produce technically gifted players without the proper infrastructure right down to that level. Also, they shouldn't be playing in competitive leagues at that level either.

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Nonsense.

You want to pay for 165 coaches for the LDSL? What about the other 26 counties? That would be thousands upon thousands of coaches. Who is going to pay for it? Do you want to spend money to get a badge to coach and manage a team of 8 year olds? Lets say the FAI pay for it? People on here moan and bitch about Delaney's salary; lets see how many will need a coronary bypass when they hear about how the FAI educated thousands of people, half of them that haven't a clue, with or without a badge.

You say the 8 year olds shouldn't be playing competitively? Then what should the 8 year olds be doing? Going to Abbeycartron on a písser of a Saturday to do some more training?
Of course they should be allowed to play competitively, they train every week, they should be allowed to have the chance to win medals. I still have all the medals I won from U-7.
Godless commie scum eh? Ironic...

Sure you're right, there's nothing at all wrong with the current system, as witnessed by the endless line of technically top quality players in the system, right up to the national team, which is obviously challenging for the major trophies every 2 years...

btw do have to attempt to make everything bloody personal, it's tiresome.

Of course I'm right. You're telling me that the system is wrong, I agree with you. The system is flawed. Give me your ideas to improve this!

However, there are one hundred and sixty-five teams in the LDSL alone. That is 165 people, kind enough to give up their time, to take care of a team. Organise buses, training, kits, referees, pitches, all of that stuff. I think these people are brilliant. Good luck finding those people that even want a coaching badge.

I specifically said it wasn't against the people who are giving the time, or didn't you read that part of the post?

Each club should have access to a coach who can at least give some direction to the training. Schools football is too much about winning, which makes it about the strongest players not the most skillful. It is up to the FAI to provide assistance in terms of coaching and supports, and direction in how football is developed. It is a much bigger issue than Longford Town.

Maybe it is a question of resources, which again comes back to Irish people not supporting Irish clubs. There's no way that Longford Town could realistically fund a "football in the community" scheme like they have in the UK, for example. The FAI just don't prioritise this type of initiative, even if they do have the money.

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Originally Posted by Macy

I specifically said it wasn't against the people who are giving the time, or didn't you read that part of the post?

Each club should have access to a coach who can at least give some direction to the training. Schools football is too much about winning, which makes it about the strongest players not the most skillful. It is up to the FAI to provide assistance in terms of coaching and supports, and direction in how football is developed. It is a much bigger issue than Longford Town.

Maybe it is a question of resources, which again comes back to Irish people not supporting Irish clubs. There's no way that Longford Town could realistically fund a "football in the community" scheme like they have in the UK, for example. The FAI just don't prioritise this type of initiative, even if they do have the money.

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I know that. I saw that.

Also, why shouldn't U-8s be playing competitively?

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Originally Posted by Macy

Each club should have access to a coach who can at least give some direction to the training. Schools football is too much about winning, which makes it about the strongest players not the most skillful. It is up to the FAI to provide assistance in terms of coaching and supports, and direction in how football is developed. It is a much bigger issue than Longford Town.

Maybe it is a question of resources, which again comes back to Irish people not supporting Irish clubs. There's no way that Longford Town could realistically fund a "football in the community" scheme like they have in the UK, for example. The FAI just don't prioritise this type of initiative, even if they do have the money.

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Totaly agree with this post this is what i was trying to say...kinda

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Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

I know that. I saw that.

Also, why shouldn't U-8s be playing competitively?

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i dont think you really understand how development works in successful footballing conutries?! they dont play competitively at this age and usually up until about 12 or 13 becuase at these ages they are expressing their skills and learning the basics for 5 or 6 years, getting them to know and react to situations in a game like they are second nature to them.

how often do you hear at this level when it is competitive football to kick it out when in trouble to avoid losing possession of the ball instead of letting the kids try and work their way out of trouble.? its winning that counts when it is competitive at this level and that usually means winning at all costs, not playing the player on the side lines who is a bit smaller than everyone else and who isnt as good as everyone else at his current stage of develpoment! not playing certain players because they might lose their team a game, when it should not matter at this age, it should not matter in the slightest!

it is so damaging to the players in the long run.

people saying well they should get used to winning, well its been proven that they will get used to winning, when they are 16 or 17 and older when it counts.

and its weird to think that since iv posted this that 12 RDO'S all around the country are out of a job on the fai's money saving scheme, and now there is NO underage professional womens coaches in this country. trap on 1.8million, if he took at pay cut of 800,000 he would still have 1million and the irish kids all around the country would still have their rdo's employed for the next 5 years.

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Originally Posted by Macy

Schools football is too much about winning, which makes it about the strongest players not the most skillful.

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thats a very good point, and I think that problem keeps arising in the english game where technically gifted footballers are not givin the chance as maybe they lack the strenght or physicality of stronger players.. Its no exageration that the football culture in britain and ireland is of detrement to technical players, and only now the tide is slowly changing with the arival of players like wilshere. Its no coincidence that wenger is at the helm, a foreigner overseeing these changes..


As for u-8s playing competitive, thats a joke football (or any sport) at that stage should be about enjoyment and elitism. The major competition facing under 8s nowadays is tearing them away from playstations, and getting them on a football field in the first place

Some great posts been made here especially about technical players not been given their chance. I am one of many that was one of those kids left on the line all the time and it's lead to an early departure from the game but it was more down to not been a big shot which I know for a fact is a massive problem in Ireland it's all about who you are not what you are.

As for young kids playing competively I really think its more about getting them out and playing. I am at underage games every weekend and while their are some great coaches there are also ones who just roar and roar and roar at young children no bigger than the ball and if you ask me no player will develop like that.

In the ldsl their is a new blitz system for u-7 boys and girls were around 6-8 team come to one place and play several games , the games are not about winning it's simply learning and everything is very relaxed and I see alot more players willing to run with the ball and do a trick or to where as usualy I just see players hoofing it out over the line.

A few times this season I've seen the Town concede goals from trying to play it out of defence instead of hoofing it clear. I didn't hear many people cheering on the team after they conceded a goal like that...

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Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

A few times this season I've seen the Town concede goals from trying to play it out of defence instead of hoofing it clear. I didn't hear many people cheering on the team after they conceded a goal like that...

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you are missing the point they are not technically good enough to play the ball out of defence and that goes back to coaching.. Players (at a young age) should be encouraged to express themselves on the ball and not just kick it up the pitch a la Jack charltons teams.. At its simplest form, this safety first approach is whats wrong with a lot of football nowadays..

when the mind set shifts from playing the stronger players who can kick the ball furthest or the hardest but not necessarily the most skillful, then we will produce better skilful players..

I cant imagine messi or olic were ones to kick the ball up the field without taking a touch or two..

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Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

A few times this season I've seen the Town concede goals from trying to play it out of defence instead of hoofing it clear. I didn't hear many people cheering on the team after they conceded a goal like that...

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maybe if they had of been playing it out of defence from the age of 8 then they would have done it with ease. hoofing it clear is all well and good if its 1-0 and 89minute, it should not deployed as a tactic for the full game.

its all about knowing when to play and when to put it into the car park it all comes from good coaching at a young age

There are too many coaches in this country who do the badges just to say look what i have and not bringing the knowledge back onto the training ground at grassroots level. Every schoolboy section of a club should have a technical development plan for there young players which will develop in time, its about getting kids comfortable on the ball and repetitivly working on the key points of technique. If we dont show the players how to do it properly from an early age and give them plenty of practice on doing it themselves then they have no hope of doing it when they are in their early 20's. The FAI have made it easy for clubs to get their coaches qualified and this is a massive step forward for the future of our players if and only if the coaches use it. There are some great coaches in this country but equally there are some very poor coaches too.

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Originally Posted by howsyourtouch

i dont think you really understand how development works in successful footballing conutries?! they dont play competitively at this age and usually up until about 12 or 13 becuase at these ages they are expressing their skills and learning the basics for 5 or 6 years, getting them to know and react to situations in a game like they are second nature to them.

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Originally Posted by howsyourtouch

i
and its weird to think that since iv posted this that 12 RDO'S all around the country are out of a job on the fai's money saving scheme, and now there is NO underage professional womens coaches in this country. trap on 1.8million, if he took at pay cut of 800,000 he would still have 1million and the irish kids all around the country would still have their rdo's employed for the next 5 years.

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You want to pay them 13 grand a year? Do your sums will ya.

I think it is wholly unfair that you don't want to allow children to play competitively. Who would want to train for so long, and have to wait 5 or 6 years to attempt to win something? I'd rather be in the girl guides.
Explain to me how this "5 Year Plan" works. Also, can you tell me what successful countries don't allow their children play competitive football, because I don't know them.

Germany, they scrapped their kids leagues a few years ago and now start competively at u14. There main focus is on academies that develop their players at the crucial age.

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Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

You want to pay them 13 grand a year? Do your sums will ya.

I think it is wholly unfair that you don't want to allow children to play competitively. Who would want to train for so long, and have to wait 5 or 6 years to attempt to win something? I'd rather be in the girl guides.
Explain to me how this "5 Year Plan" works. Also, can you tell me what successful countries don't allow their children play competitive football, because I don't know them.

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No competitive football until U14 in Holland and Spain for years also

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Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.

You want to pay them 13 grand a year? Do your sums will ya.

I think it is wholly unfair that you don't want to allow children to play competitively. Who would want to train for so long, and have to wait 5 or 6 years to attempt to win something? I'd rather be in the girl guides.
Explain to me how this "5 Year Plan" works. Also, can you tell me what successful countries don't allow their children play competitive football, because I don't know them.

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you clearly have no knowledge of working with children, a child should be encouraged in so far as possible to achieve their potential, but at the end of the day enjoyment of the game and aquisition of skills should be most important. If children are pressurised early on into winning and the importance of winning, skill development will suffer.. if countries on the continent are producing players of great technical ability all the while, not allowing competitive football, surely they are doing something right.. Id rather have a player who can play a bit of football than won an u-10 medal when he was young..

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Originally Posted by Cabs88

you clearly have no knowledge of working with children, a child should be encouraged in so far as possible to achieve their potential, but at the end of the day enjoyment of the game and aquisition of skills should be most important. If children are pressurised early on into winning and the importance of winning, skill development will suffer.. if countries on the continent are producing players of great technical ability all the while, not allowing competitive football, surely they are doing something right.. Id rather have a player who can play a bit of football than won an u-10 medal when he was young..

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You totally missed my point. Totally. Children shouldn't be pressurized into winning but my point is that you're denying children the right to play competitive football. This isn't a totalitarian state.
You clearly have no knowledge of how hard it is to make it in football. You may rather that he can play football, but I'd say he would rather have something to show for it.

You sound very bitter? Its a worldwide thing now to start competitive football at an older age, parents have alot to be desired about their kids winning mentality, this win at all costs bull&£@&! it's football and football is all opinions but if something is tried and tested then who are we to argue it.

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Originally Posted by Tallanted

You sound very bitter? Its a worldwide thing now to start competitive football at an older age, parents have alot to be desired about their kids winning mentality, this win at all costs bull&£@&! it's football and football is all opinions but if something is tried and tested then who are we to argue it.

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Not bitter at all. Who are we to deny children to play football in whatever manner they want?

And I'm L.T.F.C. and I can argue whatever the **** I want.

Deny children to play in whatever manner they want??? You've missed the whole point again, I will leave it there I will talk to the wall outside instead. It's all opinions but you seem to have taken an arrogant view and are under the assumption that cause you said it it's right and whatever else is posted by other posters is just for you to have a go at because you are LTFC(quite a childish post) Its narrow minded people like you that are holding back our young players, to understand somthing you need to see it in action, from your posts I would imagine you are no older than 17 or 18?
You have argued everything with I think this and that but no facts, also when you asked for facts to prove it you ignored the response and went back to the well I stil think this and that, which is fair enough it's your opinion but you need to respect others too.

I remember seeing on sky sports news not too long ago that the English are now trying to turn away from competive underage football. They have implemented a mercy rule in some league by which if a team goes ahead by 6 or 7 goals they stop the game award the points to the winning team and just like kids do at school they would give the weaker team some of their better players and play out the rest of the game for fun.

the FA has done great work in recent years to tackle the massive problem of abusive parents. At underage matches they now put up a tape around the pitch which keeps the spectators back and they make the parents sign contracts to say they will not shout abuse at the children or the referee I think this is a truly great system and its something the FAI should look at cause theres nothing worse than seeing a 7 year old cry because his parent is roaring at him like hes on 80 grand a week.