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Purely speculation on my part but Keane has said that certain players who played the in the defeat to West Brom will never play for him again. Garvan was sub'd at half time, plus he hasn't been starting previous to that...
I wonder if he's one of them???
I'd say he's definitely talking about Garvan. Clearly has the ability but he's very much a luxury player and I don't think that's what Keane likes.
In the best game Ive seen Garvan play for the u21s against England he was head and shoulder the best player on the pitch and was far from a luxury player in that game. But I wonder what his attitude is like, Ive no reason to suspect its poor but clubs havent exactly been banging down Ipswichs door over the last year to try to sign him so maybe he isnt developing as much as we had hoped for
Keane will be shown the door before Garvan.
ya think hes gonna be sacked after just 3 games??Quote:
Originally Posted by ruben_sosa
You'd wonder if he upped his game that night because 'it was England'...Quote:
Originally Posted by Razors left peg
Ireland dominated both games against England though. They played on the break. When his team have possession he's great to have but when the opposition have the ball he doesn't do enough. Although Pirlo has done well for himself, they just built teams around him.
if it was a case that he has become a bit of luxury player it is definately down to the lads attitude because physically he has all the tools to be a good all round midfielder.
I imagine it's a scare tactic but if there are still no signs of knuckling down then then he'll be on his way. A shame because it looks like he has a lot of ability. Maybe Magilton could take him to QPR?
So much for the notion that Keane would get the best out of Garvan
I watched Garvan in the first game against Coventry and when he came on as sub his passing was superb. I hear he gave the ball away cheaply on Saturday and nearly gave away a goal.
Keane clearly hasn't learnt the art of subtlety over the summer. Usual scare tactics.
Didn't Keane come out and criticise the U-21's after this game?Quote:
Originally Posted by Razors left peg
Ive no idea to be honestQuote:
Originally Posted by Hunty's Flatcap
After all the hype about this lad that I have read on here, Ill be gutted if he doesnt at least make the step up to a top flight club in the next year or so.
I'm only surprised Keane hasn't fallen out with and shifted more players sooner, so as to give him time to bring in replacements before the transfer window closes.
Anyhow, Garvan may be in good company, since Keane is also getting rid of Gareth McAuley, who was both a regular starter and club captain last season.
According to The Daily Mirror:
http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news...cle127925.html
Ipswich boss Roy Keane may sell star defender Gareth McAuley to raise funds for new signings after a bust-up.
Town manager Keane wants to freshen up his squad after collecting just one point from four Championship games this term.
He axed Northern Ireland international centre-back McAuley, 29, for their defeat at West Brom and stripped him of the captaincy.
McAuley annoyed Keane with a blunt assessment of Town's shortcomings in midweek when called into the manager's office to discuss the team's poor start.
And the stopper, signed from Leicester in June 2008, may now be sold as Keane lays down the law at Portman Road.
It is rather ironic (or do I mean grossly hypocritical?), that Keane's own exit as a player from Old Trafford was directly on account of his doing an interview for MUTV, where he lambasted his fellow players with one of his own typically "blunt assessments"...
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/spo...icle585137.ece
Kind of. He said that there wasn't anything coming through on the evidence of the U21 match against England, which most here thought was harsh - England's goals involved a dreadful goalkeeping error, a deflection and all 3 were breakaways. There were actually some pretty good Irish performances that night. 3-0 was not a fair reflection.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunty's Flatcap
I agree with EG. He took over before season's end to have a chance to take stock. He made some pretty harsh decisions to axe players then and doing the same again now doesn't exactly endorse his early judgment.
If Garvan doesn't cut the mustard I'll just give up on young Irish players in England. The guy has everything it takes. Physically anyway.
What exactly do you mean? If doesn't make it, its because he is not good enoughQuote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Never underestimate the importance of a manager.Quote:
Originally Posted by kennedmc
Depending on the system/tactics played, mediocre players can look quality, or quality players can look brutal.
Look at the likes of Aaron Lennon. He looked pretty disappointing before Harry's arrival, and now he's playing like one of the Premier League's best wingers.
Garvan will find a team and do well. I've never been as sold on him as some on here, but he does have the quality to be a good player at Championship level at least.
I don't just mean Ipswich Town under Keane when I say if he doesn't make it.
Fair enough, if he fails under different managers or at different clubs, then that will probably be a fair test.
no, but Garvan won't leave before the January transfer window, i think Keane will be gone by then.Quote:
Originally Posted by Razors left peg
Whatever happens, I don't believe Keane will voluntarily leave Ipswich until he's had at least a full season in charge.Quote:
Originally Posted by ruben_sosa
Otherwise, he'll have established such a reputation for walking out when things get tough (or he simply gets fed-up), that only the most desperate Chairman of
a small club* will ever take a chance on him again.
Therefore, any player who's still on Ipswich's books come the end of this month, is stuck with him until the next transfer window opens (imo).
* - Cork City it is, then ;)
Some players may have the physical attributes but not the mental attributes or application / commitment. Luck often plays a part too. Plenty of good players don't get to play at a level they're capable of, plenty of mediocre players get to play at a higher level than they should be. Same in all businesses. I 've worked with some complete half-wits!Quote:
Originally Posted by kennedmc
I'm really just saying though that we've had a lot of false dawns with some of our young players. Shane Supple is a recent example. 2 years ago he was a teenage goalkeeper iplaying first team football. Billy Clarke was one of the hottest young forwards in The Chamionship. Stephen Elliott scored 18 goals in just over half a season at Sunderland and so on.
All manner of circumstances can conspire to either lead you to the top echelons or to relative obscurity. Ability should never work against you - but its the least you are going to need.
Whenever I hear Garvan mentioned, I think of Trapps original training camp in Portugal. I was encouraged to hear that both Garvan and Whelan would be involved and actually thought that Trapp would fast-track Garvan with Whelan a lesser possibility.
If utilised correctly and with a bit of insight - Garvan could become a real asset to a club of a certain playing style.
Probably more suited to somewhere like Italy though. Even a team like Celtic who dominate most games. In fact he's perfect for Mowbray's Celtic as replacement for Donati who fails too often.Quote:
Originally Posted by irishfan86
I never understand this notion that a player who is struggling in one country will flourish in another country, merely because of the "style" of play in the latter.Quote:
Originally Posted by eirebhoy
The fact is, whilst particular footballing "styles" may suit certain players more than others, top level countries like Italy also require additional attributes such as a minimum level of talent, application, physical accomplishment and commitment etc.
(Which is why the very top players will still be top players, regardless of the environment they are playing in)
Now I've no idea whether Garvan is being held back at Portman Road by any deficiencies in the above aspects of the game.
But if he is and he's struggling to make it in a mediocre English club, why should he do any more than struggle similarly in Italy, even at one of their mediocre clubs?
Are you seriously comparing the 100 miles-an-hour "style" of the SPL to the football played in Serie A? :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by eirebhoy
The fact is, if Garvan were to go to Celtic and prove a success, the most likely explanation would be that the standard in the SPL (Old Firm games excepted), is arguably even worse than that of the Championship.
P.S. I am not having a go at Garvan when making these points, since I don't know nearly enough about the player himself.
good post EG.
Fair enough but that doesn't explain why the likes of Shevchenko, Rebrov, Veron, etc were class acts outside of England and flopped miserable in the Premier LeagueQuote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
Does anyone actually think it would be good for Garvan's development to stay at Ipswich under Keane? What has he done in terms of developing young players so far?
I wouldn't say he's struggling per se, he's been a first team regular for 4 seasons since making his debut at 17 less then a year into his apprenticeship. He's had spells out of the team before and always come back strong. It just looks to me that Keane doesn't fancy him which is a kick in the teeth as he's always been his idol. Probably best to move on at this stage, the lad's only 21 and already has bags of Championship experience, he'd find another club no problem at that level.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
agreed - Cardiff or West Brom would both suit his style id say and he would have a fairly good chance of promotion to the Premiership with both..Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er
Has any player had anything good to say about Keane as his manager?
Well to add fuel to the speculation on here Garvan isnt even on the bench for Ipswich tonight in Carling cup
That's crazy talk EG. There's dozens of players that are stars in certain leagues that have even failed in the SPL because of the hectic style of play. I'm certain Andrea Pirlo would struggle at a weak Championship club. Definitely.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
The reason I'd see Garvan having a lot more success at Celtic is because they dominate play playing football on the ground. Garvan doesn't have a problem playing in matches when his team are dominating. It's the long ball, physical battle, crap football games that he doesn't like.
Garvan is a quality midfeilder who has the ability cut open defences and is capable of been in the irish senior squad. We have gibson and whealan who are more defensive midfeilders and with steven ireland out and andy reid not looked at he our a future prospect
Im my opinion Keane will be the ruining of Ipswich. Ipswich are known as a club for bringing through their young players and play attractive football and ive never seen roy keane nurture any talent at sunderland and they werent the prettiest team to watch. Ipswich will be broke and there best young players will be sold.
Andy Reid backs up what a few fans said about Keane:Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
"I suppose we didn't know the direction that he wanted to go. We probably weren't made too aware of it. It was a case of go out on the pitch and do what you do. It was a completely different mentality. He believed players should go out on the pitch and automatically know what to do because managers didn't need to tell him what to do. That wasn't the case with us because we weren't as good as he was. I felt we needed direction and I think with the manager we have now we have that."
Garvan not making tonights bench confirms that Keane was referring to him anyway.
I don’t know what Keane's motive is when he buys Irish players only to mess them about shortly after they arrive. Does he not do any kind of research into their ability before he brings them to the club? McShane , Harte, O' Donovan, Reid ,Healy, Delaney and Stokes are just a few who spring to mind. I know Garvan is not one of his recruits but he appears to be putting the blame on him for his bad start. Surely he has to look at himself somewhere down the line?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendan 82
Whatever about developing them, he's not afraid to give young players a chance with Leadbitter, Waghorn and Liddle and Sunderland and yer man Wickham and ,I think either Trotter or Peters, at Ipswich.
The thing about Keane as a manager I think is that we all want his tenacity and application to rub off on someone with the attributes of Garvan or Stokes. He clearly rewards effort and commitment and as such has seen mediocre players like Whitehead, Nosworthy and Collins forge premiership careers where I don't think they would have had they not played under Keane. (Just my opinion. I know all three were signed by Mick but Noz was a stinkin right full and Collins was in and out.).
I wonder how does he reward effort and commitment or does he just expect that as a given from a player?
You'd think though with the absolute awe and respect all these young players have for Roy that he'd have to do is say well done and the player would break his bóllix to get another compliment.