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he is celebrating his 80th birthday on thursday, i have to say he has been one of my favourite politicians growing up, i've always thought he has had the peoples best interest at heart no matter what choices he made while in power. I dont have my colours nailed to the mast of any politicial party but i would vote for a party with him in charge.
He still tours the world doing lectures about the strong economic position Ireland have gained for themselves. At his age i find it amazing.
Wasn't Fitzgerald one of the people pushing for the European Constitution? In fact I seem to recollect that he was involved in drafting it...
adam /pro-europe, anti-right-wing-constitution
Slightly before my time but certainly one of the most respected politicians in our countries history. People will obviously disagree with some of his decisions but no doubting he in politics for the right reasons.
You only have to compare him with his arch nemesis Haughey who through bribes & backhanders made a fortune out of politics whereas Fitzgerald is by no means a wealthy man.
thats a good point pete fitzgerald made dicisions becuase they had to be made, not to line his own pockets.
one of the greatst politicians this state has ever known.
Correct my young self if I'm wrong but wasn't it Fitzgeralds enlightened regime who tried to introduce a tax on childrens shoes in one budget and in another memorable move a couple of years later attempted to cut the social welfare christmas bonus at a time when 100's of thousands were on the dole :confused:
Just because your better than a crook like Haughey doesn't make you great
WrongQuote:
Originally Posted by dahamsta
John Bruton was one of the Irish members of the European Convention (the body that drafted the Constitution), Garret wasn't, though I'm sure Garret was probably a fan of the Constitution.
http://european-convention.eu.int/
Jebus the man signed the Anglo Irish Agreement and stood by while ten men(one a T.D. and one an M.P.) starved in The maze, Because IMO he was afraid to stand up to Thatcher. how any one can compliment the man is beyond me.
Right, sorry about that. He was still a cheerleader though, as you suggest.Quote:
Originally Posted by crc
adam
Bruton tired to put the tax on childrens shoes i believe. Anyway hardtimes require hard decisions. Haughey still gets credit for giving OAPs free bus travel but that was just a populist act.
As i said people will disagree with certain decisions made by any politician but i can'r see how anyone coul deny that Fitzgerald was an honourable politician who wasn't it politics to line his own pockets (hence the CJ comparison).
I think he still writes opinion pieces for the Irish Times from time to time.
the very fact that we are supposed to venerate a politician for not being as bent as haughey amuses me.
Its Ireland.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
I suppose it's just a reaction to all those that still can't take the blinkers off and see what a corrupt politician Haughey was...Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
Not a fine gael voter but there is no suggestion he is "not as bent" as anyone. To the best of my knowledge the guy has never been implicated in any shady act of backhanding. That's the only Haughey comparison that was made.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
Hmmm ....maybe he didn't agree with the ten mens politics. Maybe he didn't like their particular methods of protest which it strikes me is pretty much a slowed down suicide bombing. Maybe he felt that, horrible as those lads deaths were, those lads got to choose the hour and manner of their own passing which is a hell of a lot more than the IRA and the INLA ever gave those who got in their way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Block G Raptor
Haughey was his biggest political rival & it must have been obvious to Garret Fitzgerald what was going on. Its to his credit he didn't follwo that route to gain power.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lionel Ritchie
Or maybee he was so humiliated by Thatchers P.R. coup after the Anglo Irish Agreement was signed when she made him look like a total prat in front of the whole country that he didn't have the stomach to go against her on the hungerstrike issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lionel Ritchie
I dont neccessarly agree with there brand of politics either. neither did amnesty interrnational, the archbishop, the POPE and they all did more for them than Fitzgerald. The tragedy of the 1978-1981 prison dispute had more to do with basic human rights than any political status.
I think its worth pointing out that none of the hungerstrikers were serving sentances for murder !Quote:
those lads got to choose the hour and manner of their own passing which is a hell of a lot more than the IRA and the INLA ever gave those who got in their way.
the hungerstrikes were a few years before the anglo irish agreement. and haughey was in power for most of them as far as I remember. (altho gov changed hands a few times over short period at that time.) I dont think you can judge any man on how he dealt with a situation designed by very politically savvy people to cause as much discomfort and embarressment to both goverments as poss. it was a no win situation.
Kleins already dealt with this but how he couldn't have the stomach to stand up to Thatcher due to something that wouldn't take place for another four and a half years is fairly nonsensical.Quote:
Originally Posted by Block G Raptor
Fair enough. Now I'll point out that to a man they were members of the IRA with the exception of was it Patsy O'Hara or Francis Hughes who were INLA.Quote:
Originally Posted by Block G Raptor
OK fair point but do you think that when Major was PM if Gareth was in office that we'd have a reletive peace in NI or that if Gareth was in talks with Blair Paisley and Trimble that the good friday agreement would ever have come about. whilst not a fan of Bertie or Albert Reynolds they stood up to their respective opposite numbers and got a good deal for all in the end. IMO gareth was not as strong willed as either of these and proved with the AIA that he was not below cow-towing to EnglandQuote:
Originally Posted by klein4
I think the person you should be talking about is thatcher. she didnt stand down to anyone.so i think if bertie and reynolds were in power they wouldnt have got good friday agreement out of her.it was different times with different factors at play.think would george bush sit down with al quaeeda(sp?) and you will understand thatchers position on IRA. its too simplistic to say things like bertie would have got a deal. the situation was a lot more complex than that as you probably well know.
EDIT . O.K. so I got the timeline of events reversed but its the same really he didn't support the basic human rights of prisoners and he conceded on the AIA both show an unwillingness/Inability to promote his country's interestsQuote:
Originally Posted by Lionel Ritchie
Patsy O'hara and Kevin Lynch were both INLA members
The point I'm Making is that none of them were serving sentances for Murder
to point out that they were members of PIRA/INLA whilst insuating that this means they were murderers by association is irresponsible to say the least