Should have continued his run outside Bennett there. Norwich looking very dangerous on the counter.
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Should have continued his run outside Bennett there. Norwich looking very dangerous on the counter.
I don't think they look dangerous on the counter at all. They look extremely tired. Holt tried a shot from thirty yards out because he couldn't keep running. When Hoolahan messed up that run, all three Norwich players that were up for the counter just stood there until finally Bennett started tracking back.
Its interesting what he is doing best related to how Trap wants his players to play. If he kept playing like this everytime he would be the ideal replacement for duff. Because his close control is so good that when he finds himself in a good place from a clearance he controls it, holds onto it, and makes the pass, relieving pressure on the backs and letting them pull the midfielders out of shape. Thats what Trap will be looking for most and he has done very well today. I hope his positional sense hasn't been down to luck and its good awareness.
No he shouldn't have if he kept outside he was pulling the players out wide and only holt was inside. Bennett had pulled the defenders out to him giving holohan space to run inside. It was very intelligent running from him. Its a pity Bennett didnt look up.Quote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
Just to add his support play on the counter has been very good. Holt should have chipped in that last one and setup holohan for a volley.
They've been two-on-two or three-on-two three times now. That's dangerous, even if they've been been completely wasteful. It's not tiredness that caused Holt attempted a lame chip instead of smashing it or finding Hoolahan. Just poor decision making.Quote:
Originally Posted by Colbert Report
Holt, again with no pace or energy, messes up a breakaway. He needs to come off.
He ran into an area with at least two, I think three tracking Arsenal defenders. He also made the run at the exact moment a defender was closing Bennett down. It was a poorly timed decision and the wrong one. He keeps wide, he drags them out of position at least and gives Bennett something to run into if he keeps the ball.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
Unfortunately Wes ran where there was zero space.
Player injury.Quote:
Originally Posted by Colbert Report
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
We must be on about 2 different scenarios then, because the one i was watching he came behind him and run central, and the arsenal players had already ran out to meet bennett, giving holohan space and bringing him closer to holt to play a through ball to, had he ran outside he would have been isolated out on his own with 2 defenders on him and no chance of getting a good ball into Holt. It was the smarter run to make to keep the attacking move going, rather than just holding possession up.
Either way he is playing the exact sorta game a player Trap looks for in a midfielder.
Will try and get a video of it and we'll chew over it but my take was he was running into an area which could be more easily defended.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
Totally agree. I'd be ambivalent about Hoolahan in the past but I think he's proved today he could fill a crucial need in Trap's system, and so warrants a call-up (notwithstanding he deserves one from being a Prem performer).Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
As you say he was in a side under the cosh, and proved to be their best out-ball and a key counter-attacker in a side which played direct football. He was also tenacious and worked tirelessly. There really wouldn't be much more he could do to prove his worth.
...and Pilkington would be a far far better option on the wing than Cox or Keogh
he's an attacking central midfielder as opposed to a winger, I think he played to his strengths coming central, and he is able hold onto the ball at speed in those central positions. I'd be more confident that he would make more of the ball there than out on the wing. It seems we are on about the same incident, I might be wrong in this instance, I was watching more than one thing during this match, but on his general play I think him coming central was the smarter decision and played more to his strengths.
Anyway trap has no excuse if he can perform like this against arsenal surely he can against our international opponents.
Again totally agree, I'd have him central every time - just in terms of that incident I'd have stuck with making the run wide, where there seemed to be more space.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
On the basis of today he looks ideal to hold the ball up in the opposition's half, retain it, use it intelligently and launch attacks - a player we have a distinct need for. Might not work in a flat 442, but could play behind a central striker no problem. Moreover his energy and movement could be great to have as an option off the bench.
An ominous shake of the head from Trap when he got booked for kicking the ball in the net after he'd been flagged offside. I didn't see the whole game but he played well from what I saw - must have been wondering what he needed to do to get a pass on those counters.
On a side note, seeing Corry last night for Sheffield Wednesday and Hoolahan today, it's interesting that a lot of our most technical players were produced outside of England. Even Fahey, who was a product of an English academy, came back for a few years.
I think Trap was disappointed in the ref not Hoolahan.
Hoolahan would allow Trap to keep his beloved 442 but with Hoolahan just ahead, and behind Long or Doyle I reckon. We'd need two direct wide players with pace, two of McClean, Coleman or maybe Pilkington who showed tonight he's worth a trybout in the friendliest. Pilkington and McClean look quite similar in style. I'm getting very frustrated with McGeady.
Yeah I was being facetious - Trap doesn't blame Hoolahan.
I think you're missing the point of the 442. Trap has been very clear on why he plays it - because he doesn't expect us to keep many clean sheets, so we need two strikers so we can score enough goals to get by. Would you trust Doyle to score goals as our only striker? The 442 exists because in Keane we have a striker who excels in international football. If he retired or was ushered out, it would negate the need (in Trap's mind) to play it.
I didn't see the game but glad the Trap was there to witness Wes putting in a good performance based on comments here.
He played well.
No doubt he was out to impress Trappatoni today.
I don't think I am missing the point of Trap's 442. He has six defensive outfield players and relies on four others to be offensive. Up to now this has been two strikers, or even three with a third being played totally out of position. Now I don't think even Trap sees this as a runaway success, but he hasn't shown many signs of understanding the alternatives. I think Trap would me far more comfortable making a tweak in the direction of 4411 with Hoolahan doing just what he did tonight, recognising that a player like Hoolahan is better at covering back than a forward and would allow a bit more freedom for another midfielder to get forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
I also think Trap likes to keep it tight and nick goals from set pieces
Will be interesting to see if Hoolahan gets a call up for the next couple of friendlies, definitely seems Trap is interested in getting a look at him and this was shown back in August he called him up for the Serbia game however he pulled out due to injury, think he also called up Pilkington for that game too although I am not so sure about his commitment to Ireland to be honest.
I've been reading the analysis of Hoolahan tonight, to be fair I don't expect the fella to radically change Ireland but he can definitely offer alternatives and good ones at that. It's the fact that he's not even making squads that's criminal for me. He's a terrific attitude and work rate and that's the bizarre thing about Trap. Fellas like him and McClean you would think would be right up his street. McClean is direct hard working covers ground well gets forward and back and delivers a good cross so how can he rate Cox above him. Hoolahan the same gets on the ball keeps it well great alternative but can't get in the 23 even. After his performance tonight he must be a shoe in for a squad place.Quote:
Originally Posted by SolitudeRed
Did Tardelli not say that he was too old.
Quote:
Originally Posted by harry crumb
Thats even worse if so...hes young enough to be a stand out player against arsenal but cant get a sniff against the faroes.....madness
His age was definitely used against him by someone in the management team; either Trap or Tardelli. I don't see why a player's age should be an issue if he can still offer something (30 isn't that old anyway!) and it's especially odd considering he's three years younger than the likes of Duff who Tardelli was hoping would come out of international retirement last month.Quote:
Originally Posted by harry crumb
Was Trap definitely at the game then? Pics or it didn't happen!
Tv cameras showed him
Afaiu, that was just Tardelli being humorous which the press took literally and later we ended up with a cringe enducing piece on 'leave Duff alone'.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
But something was said or referred to about Hoolahan's age 'that we look to the future'.
I can't say I'm too excited about that future, the vision or the preparations. We'll see what transpires out of this visit. I just saw the last 15 minutes of the game and I guessed Hoolahan had a good game because he was still on the pitch :)
Here you go, absolute proof.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
http://cache.tcm.ie/media/images/g/G...ct12_large.jpg
Haha, wasn't being completely serious with that request, but thank you. :)
Irrespective of whether he was being facetious about Duff returning or not, why was 29/30 advanced as being too old for Hoolahan to get a look-in, but not for the likes of Given, Duff, Keane, Dunne, O'Shea, Doyle, Fahey, Kelly, Walters, Delaney, Green, Hunt and Lawrence who've all been selected despite being 29 or above at the time?Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
I thought Hoolahan was a country mile more effective last night than the much lauded talents of Ramsey and Arshavin. He'd have fitted in easily beside Arteta and Carzola.
I'm not saying he's the messiah but he'd go a long way towards joining up this team and enabling some ball retention. He'd reduce the need for hoofball. With Duff gone we have nobody capable of receiving the ball and brining others into the game, bar Gibson maybe.
I mentioned above how I'd try to accommodate such a player. I may not be right but if I was being paid more than a million to improve this team I'd damn well try hard to do it right.
I'm not the mind reader you think I am :)Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
The question about Hoolahan was asked after the Euros. I guess Tardelli was thinking of the future from that point on, McCarthy? Meyler? Brady?
I guess Trap did not not rate Hoolahan for previous qual campaign for tactical reasons and dismissed his chances then of making the squad in various utterances.
Hoolahan was called up after Gibson 'retired' but it appeared that was as a token filler rather than anything else. There is also another aspect, Trap is serious about 'being right' and resorting to Hoolahan who was always available, would be an admission of sorts that he failed to see the qualities of this player. That's why I think Trap was hoping that the younger options would come good and hoping to whitewash Hoolahan out of existence. But Hoolahan is still there, still playing in the EPL.
Something similar also applies to Andy Reid who has done well to recover his form after a string of injuries. The Mainz scapegoat thing looks more and more absurd after all this time and the whole episode more reflects on the manager that he couldn't mend fences with Reid - who we are told from a reliable source - is a decent lad. Basically Trap was not interested in Reid as a player and it's as if he did not want the embarrassment of having a player with ability hanging around the squad.
So we are left with the sight of intelligent Andy Keogh coming on as a sub.
Know your meme.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
So Trap being at the game yesterday will produce a coupole of scenarios.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
(a) Trap now sees how good Wes is and plays him against Greece and makes him a mainstay in his team
(b) If he does the above then it will show people the error of his ways and also show that he should have done it all along. It will also show that us supporters were correct about having Hoolahan included a long time ago (at least those of us who didn't keep saying that he didn't fit into the famous system of Trap's)
(c) why all of a sudden does Trap feel the need to go and see Hoolahan, when he claimed before that Wes wasn't part of his plans. Was it something the FAI demanded of him?
10/11 It was political gesture, genuinely not interested in Hoolahan/Pilks before or now
6/4 Looking for more excuses as to why Hoolahan is not a 'squad man', Pilks tainted by association.
4/1 the slate is clean of old attitudes - Trap prepared to look at Hoolahan/Pilks with objectivity.
I don't think there's a single poster here who doesn't think Hoolahan has always been worthy of a squad place, especially since he was so instrumental in getting Norwich promoted. But Trap did have a system and Hoolahan didn't suit it, so that explained his absence. I think that 4 years in Trap is less convinced of the system as he was - if not he's blind to the evidence - so is looking at new ideas, at least partly due to FAI pressure and media pressure. What he actually decides to do is anyone's guess at this stage.
So you'll have a punt on the 4/1 option?
I'm reading Steve Jobs' biography, there was a strategy which Steve Jobs employed on more than one occasion. Once when he bought an elderly wooden vacation home, he wanted to raze it and build anew, the local conservationist community objected. By the time the court process came close to being exhausted, the house had fallen apart on its own anyway from neglect.
With Trap/Tardelli neglecting Hoolahan all these years, then saying he's too old to try out now, then with their arms twisted they do take an interest in him. Even if they were willing to give him a small chance, Wes will be on the wrong side of mid thirties before the assimilating process would be exhausted.
I might need help, I'm sounding just as cynical as Paul, but at least I have some grammar to console myself with
I never knew grammar was something you could own/possess!
Dude, that's Lloyd Bridges!Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
Where's that full-stop so?Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
Looks photoshopped to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir