UEFA Euro 2024 Qualifying Group B

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by elatedscum

The issue is, how likely are the FAI to appoint the right type of manager or the right manager at all, maybe 20%

There’s a clip in RTE somewhere after the October 2013 window where they interviewed people leaving the stadium, everyone was picking either Martin O’Neill or Roy Keane to be the manager and I got interviewed and said Marcelo Bielsa (who was out of work since that summer) and talked about the worked he’d done with the Chile, playing attractive football, bringing through young players and getting them out of the groups at the World Cup. Bielsa would have been cheaper than MON too. I’ve often wondered what if…

I have very little faith in the FAI picking the right next manager.

---

I remember that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BOOMSHAKALAKA

That line has been repeated so often by Kenny supporters. It's not a choice between Kenny and hoofball managers. It's possible to get results while playing a progressive style. You just have to have a competent manager. Kenny has failed that test up to now but he said after the Luxembourg defeat that Euro 2024 was the actual aim. The time has come to put up or shut up. Let's hope he turns this around.

---

If only it was that easy - thin of the (probably) close to billions of Euro clubs could save hiring and firing. Sometimes teams need to be built on time and graft, no money to buy a team i iternational forward or ye dont have a golden generation that happen to come through together.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eirambler

I wish there was the opposite of a Thanks button for when people post straw man nonsense like this.

---

You think Trap rated Irish footballers, trusted his own players, didnt allow any freedom, didnt tactically use some very good attacking players eg Duff. M'ON stories of limited trainig methods, no set piece prep, general sense of lacking any tactic bar sitting deep and playing for, ironically, a set-piece hoping for a breaking ball to give a chance rather than creating. It is my opinion of course too, so I'm indifferent to the strawman argument, but pose your own angle eg Trapattoni wasnt a football snob.

Greece and Lithuania played out a 0-0 in a friendly earlier. Took a look at the stats and looks like Greece dominated possession and overall 26 shots (5 on target) to 3 (2 on target).

https://www.besoccer.com/match/selec...nia/2023745779

It is imperative that we get a result in athens. If we dont the positives of last night dissipate.
Id take a draw, but we should be looking for more possibly.

A minimum of four points gives us the best possible chance of finishing ahead of Greece. Anything less means we'll need to make up the difference against the Netherlands.
The Dutch don't look the strongest at the number, but they will improve.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

A minimum of four points gives us the best possible chance of finishing ahead of Greece. Anything less means we'll need to make up the difference against the Netherlands.
The Dutch don't look the strongest at the number, but they will improve.

---

If we want to have a right stab at this group I think we need to aim for 6 point in the summer.

Having taken nothing last night, if we don't get the six off Greece we can forget about finishing ahead of the Netherlands I think. We also need to take the Greeks out of contention entirely, as they have the advantage of playing France at home in their last game, by which point France will have almost certainly already qualified and won't be overly bothered about that game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nesta99

You think Trap rated Irish footballers, trusted his own players, didnt allow any freedom, didnt tactically use some very good attacking players eg Duff. M'ON stories of limited trainig methods, no set piece prep, general sense of lacking any tactic bar sitting deep and playing for, ironically, a set-piece hoping for a breaking ball to give a chance rather than creating. It is my opinion of course too, so I'm indifferent to the strawman argument, but pose your own angle eg Trapattoni wasnt a football snob.

---

No, I take issue with your (and others) insinuation that the only alternative to Kenny is a MON or Trap type. It's trying to reduce the argument to two distinct options, when in reality there are numerous other possibilities between those two extremes.

not really sure how kenny can get criticism for that. there were poorer performances under him where we got results against teams below frances level. not to mind some brutal sub choices in games. tactically we got it spot on tbh. finally using ogbene as a runner in behind and not a target man then he doubled up as an extra wing back against mbappe who was very quiet. as ever the litmus test is against the likes of greece but last night showed we can go toe to toe with the best.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eirambler

Having taken nothing last night, if we don't get the six off Greece we can forget about finishing ahead of the Netherlands I think. We also need to take the Greeks out of contention entirely, as they have the advantage of playing France at home in their last game, by which point France will have almost certainly already qualified and won't be overly bothered about that game.




No, I take issue with your (and others) insinuation that the only alternative to Kenny is a MON or Trap type. It's trying to reduce the argument to two distinct options, when in reality there are numerous other possibilities between those two extremes.

---

In a normal qualifying group 4 points from Greece and Gibraltar would do during the summer but in THIS group we need to get every last point that we can possibly get if we want to even give us ourselves a shot at qualifying.

The view from me is 6 points from Greec and Gibraltar and then 3 at home to the Netherlands and then see what we can do in Amsterdam (it’s the final game I believe so it’s a free hit). It’s not impossible to get a point in Paris but I believe that’s the sort of game where literally anything bar a bad defeat isn’t terrible.

The play offs are our realistic hope of qualifying..

We need all 15 path A teams to qualify, and 3 path B teams..

And we'll get a place

Wales and Austria could be the key for us

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eirambler

Having taken nothing last night, if we don't get the six off Greece we can forget about finishing ahead of the Netherlands I think. We also need to take the Greeks out of contention entirely, as they have the advantage of playing France at home in their last game, by which point France will have almost certainly already qualified and won't be overly bothered about that game.




No, I take issue with your (and others) insinuation that the only alternative to Kenny is a MON or Trap type. It's trying to reduce the argument to two distinct options, when in reality there are numerous other possibilities between those two extremes.

---

Thats a fair point, I did pick the extremes to frame the original point I was making and there is of course the middle ground. I think it would be foolish and not cheap to replace the current management team especially when there is no obvious current plan b, names that have been dropped are no gauranteed upgrade, simply a fans opinion. The only reason to go for a plan b is if you are hiring a name like, for example, Trap or MON. I want every Irish manager to be a success, I'd like to think I also see a bigger picture, one being that if Guardiola was appointed he would limited by the players he can pick and hence would have to take time to develop and build a team.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Insidetherock

The play offs are our realistic hope of qualifying..

We need all 15 path A teams to qualify, and 3 path B teams..

And we'll get a place

Wales and Austria could be the key for us

---

Sorry to ask but if say Turkey qualify direct - what happens to their place in the League C playoffs?

Worth mentioning that Greece are assured a playoff also.

It goes to another League C team. No use to us and means someone else takes a B playoff spot ahead of us.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eirambler

It goes to another League C team. No use to us and means someone else takes a B playoff spot ahead of us.

---

Thanks. Interesting in that its Luxemburg who are ranked 5th and would be in line for a PO Spot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CSAD

In a normal qualifying group 4 points from Greece and Gibraltar would do during the summer but in THIS group we need to get every last point that we can possibly get if we want to even give us ourselves a shot at qualifying.

The view from me is 6 points from Greec and Gibraltar and then 3 at home to the Netherlands and then see what we can do in Amsterdam (it’s the final game I believe so it’s a free hit). It’s not impossible to get a point in Paris but I believe that’s the sort of game where literally anything bar a bad defeat isn’t terrible.

---

What we need I think is to at least match the Dutch results against Greece, and probably need to beat them here, or draw here and in Holland. That should bring it close to the wire. Paris is probably a write off, but you never know. Not sure when that is, but it might depend on how France are fixed in the group at the time. Hopefully the French will win in Holland too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid

Thanks. Interesting in that its Luxemburg who are ranked 5th and would be in line for a PO Spot.

---

Yep, they'll get a Path C spot..

As of right now, at half time in the current tables, we'd miss out on a play off by 1 spot

But that's assuming ourselves or Holland don't pass out Greece

If Scotland and Ukraine qualify directly, do we take the playoff spot in our nations league group?

Scotland 2 up on Spain and could be more,Spain made 9 changes from their win against Norway and it’s not turning out very well for them…..

Nope, it's goes on position in Path B, not on each individual group.. we're 10th in Path B so unless 6 ahead of us qualify directly.. we won't get a place

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Insidetherock

Nope, it's goes on position in Path B, not on each individual group.. we're 10th in Path B so unless 6 ahead of us qualify directly.. we won't get a place

---

Thanks for that!

Wikipedia has a live list of who's making the play-offs as things stand - obviously it's less than a quarter of the way through the campaign, but a useful link as things go on I think.

So at the moment, Holland are the only League A team not qualifying directly (they're behind Greece on goal difference). Four League B and two League C teams are qualifying directly, including two and one respectively who won their Nations League Group.

So as it stands - and again, this is just for fun as there's so much yet to play for - the play-offs are

League A
Holland
Iceland (I think top League B teams fill the League B play-offs first, and then move up to League A?)
Norway
Estonia (League D winners)

League B
Israel
Bosnia
Finland
Ukraine

League C
Georgia
Turkey
Kazakhstan
Luxembourg

We're the next in line in League B. Romania, Greece and Slovakia are the three sides ranked below us who are automatically qualifying as it stands. Romania already have a four-point gap, and Israel (who we'd like to qualify instead) dropped two points to Kosovo at home. Slovakia have beaten Bosnia at home which is a big result for them. And Greece have only played Gibraltar; we can do our own bit there to sort them.

So as it stands we need to throw our two games with the Netherlands to ensure they Q and take their place in the League A playoff. Greece take the League C P/O spot and Luxembourg lose out.

Yeah, throwing games would work too!

I think there is a possibility that, if things go as badly as they well might for us, but also if Greece do well, that it might actually suit us to make sure we lose our last qualifier away in Amsterdam.

I mean we're well capable of losing that game anyway, but if we're out of contention it might actually be in our interest to lose it. Which is a bit mad.

Yeah, it's actually mad that it could arise, that we'd be better off losing a game rather than winning..

It might also make UEFA look at how the play off get calculated

There is also one other anomaly that we spoke about last time potentially arising, but didn't, but could very well arise this time

Should all 15 Path A teams qualify (and its not beyond the realms of possibility that Holland could pass out Greece), then on the current standings, the play offs would be..

Path A

Estonia, Iceland, Norway, Ireland

Path B

Bosnia, Finland, Slovenia, Ukraine

Which would mean teams finishing lower in Path B, have potentially easier play offs

Really need Bosnia or Iceland to overtake Slovakia too, to give us some breathing space

I don't think the swivel eyed rabid SK out brigade could handle it if he got an extension from having to throw a game and then actually throwing it, but there is part of me that would love to see it happen, I don't think their little hearts would be able for it. Keyboards would suffer up and down the country.

now that the first international window has closed, where do we stand in terms of a possible playoff? maybe there's a website out there tracking this?

Discussion here from post #341 onwards

https://foot.ie/threads/278318-UEFA-...Group-B/page18

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zero

now that the first international window has closed, where do we stand in terms of a possible playoff? maybe there's a website out there tracking this?

---

Added a link to the play offs section on wikipedia to the first page
UEFA Euro 2024 Qualifying - Play Offs

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Discussion here from post #341 onwards

https://foot.ie/threads/278318-UEFA-...Group-B/page18

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

Added a link to the play offs section on wikipedia to the first page
UEFA Euro 2024 Qualifying - Play Offs

---

apologies completely missed pineapple's post! i saw the follow ups but without the context I didn't follow what was going on.

Looking ahead to the Greece game, there's nothing we should fear from them at all. No real stand out players. They topped their group in the Nations League but ahead of Kosovo, Northern Ireland and Cyprus. In the last qualifying campaign, they came just ahead of Georgia and it was fairly 50/50 between them. So that's the kind of level we're talking about. Am I right in saying that kick off is at 9:45? But anyway, at night the temperature isn't too bad at all so that won't come into play. We should be expecting to win this and get back into this group. A draw is of no real use to us.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BOOMSHAKALAKA

Looking ahead to the Greece game, there's nothing we should fear from them at all. No real stand out players. They topped their group in the Nations League but ahead of Kosovo, Northern Ireland and Cyprus. In the last qualifying campaign, they came just ahead of Georgia and it was fairly 50/50 between them. So that's the kind of level we're talking about. Am I right in saying that kick off is at 9:45? But anyway, at night the temperature isn't too bad at all so that won't come into play. We should be expecting to win this and get back into this group. A draw is of no real use to us.

---

A loss is not acceptable at this stage (for most - there is a core element for whom the results are not especially relevant, or at the very least, not the priority). Greece also played on Monday, a friendly v lithuania with most of the same players that started the gibraltar game. It finished 0-0.

Lithuania are below Latvia in the rankings.

It's not going to be the walkover people think it will be. Greece have a solid record at home, since losing to Italy and Armenia in 2019, they've only lost once in four years, a 1-0 loss to Spain in November 2021. They've won three and drawn two since then, conceding two goals, and scoring nine.

I think people downplaying their ability are just trying to set the future narrative a bit in the event we don't take three points. Without doubt it is going to be a tough game away - hostile environment, above 20 degrees for sure - against a team with a decent caliber about them with players that are playing regularly (mostly through their domestic teams) in the CL and EL. It is without doubt a game where we should be (and have to be) targeting 3 points and set up to win but they're definitely no mugs and the 3 points will be hard earned if we get them.

4 points from Greece would be indicative of good, for want of a better word, proper, progress.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SkStu

I think people downplaying their ability are just trying to set the future narrative a bit in the event we don't take three points. Without doubt it is going to be a tough game away - hostile environment, above 20 degrees for sure - against a team with a decent caliber about them with players that are playing regularly (mostly through their domestic teams) in the CL and EL. It is without doubt a game where we should be (and have to be) targeting 3 points and set up to win but they're definitely no mugs and the 3 points will be hard earned if we get them.

---

Exactly, yes. The same who are at present happy to belittle the France performance & from some very questionable positions IMO, will be the very same who will hold up the France performance if we don't win in Greece. & they wonder why their input isn't always well regarded here ...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SkStu

I think people downplaying their ability are just trying to set the future narrative a bit .

---

Possibly, but I'd say it's more likely to be familiarity bias. Same reason we think Troy Parrott might be a 45-goal international striker while ignoring the younger forwards doing better than him.

A win in Greece would be a very good result because we have remarkably few away wins against sides like Greece. Austria away about it in the last dozen years?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SkStu

I think people downplaying their ability are just trying to set the future narrative a bit in the event we don't take three points. Without doubt it is going to be a tough game away - hostile environment, above 20 degrees for sure - against a team with a decent caliber about them with players that are playing regularly (mostly through their domestic teams) in the CL and EL. It is without doubt a game where we should be (and have to be) targeting 3 points and set up to win but they're definitely no mugs and the 3 points will be hard earned if we get them.

---

or just call it as it is! People = BS. Already setting it up as one we should be winning, terrible for the group outcome if we don’t and of course at 9.45pm Greek time in June the heat won’t be a factor. And if we don’t win there’ll only be one reason why.

I prefer your view myself.

Greece are at about Georgia's level. We know it's not easy to go to Georgia but we expect to win. Let's not start talking up Greece or saying 20 degrees is too hot for our players. How many of their side would get into our team? Not many. We not only should be winning this game and getting 6 points in June but we have to get 6 points if we want to qualify.