Starting XI announced, game is on RTE2, and the RTE player
Printable View
Comfortable enough win without looking great. It took going 2-0 up before Luxembourg stopped defending with 11 men in their own half. No real standout performances but Coventry and Kilkenny were comfortable. Kerrigan didn’t look out of place for his debut. Kayode’s touch still lets him down but Ferguson didn’t do enough to really show he’s the better option. Noss looked bright when he came on. Maher is a pretty good keeper.
I think that’s fair enough. I like the look of Bagan, he looks a good reader of the game, didn’t do anything to spectacular but made some good choices with his passes and choosing when to take on his man. Good instincts. And the one big criticism I’d have of Kayode is really poor instincts, quiet a few of his bad touches seemed to be down to him just not anticipating the ball coming into him. Noss definitely had a good impact and I think Wright is still a bit raw but has huge potential.Quote:
Originally Posted by elatedscum
Despite his size, Kayode was pushed around a bit up front, and goal aside he didn't do much. Noss showed more in the 20 minutes than Kayode did for the 70 that he played. Noss really needs a goal though.
Luxembourg barely left their half of the pitch in the second 45 minutes, although Maher did make a great save from a breakaway
We need a win against Macedonia on Tuesday to put daylight between them and us, and to draw level with Sweden on ten points before we play them in November
FAI saying we are taking a 29 man squad to Macedonia and changes in the UK red list allowed all but 5 players from the original squad to travel. As far as I can see, everyone in their list except Blair, McEntee, Watson and Wright are missing, which is just 4. Saying that, Blair and Watson didn't make the squad on Friday and Wright came off injured, so who knows...
Wright is probably the only real loss. We don't have anyone with his skillset available to come in out wide, it'll probably be a centre midfielder playing there...
Coverage starting on RTE2 now
Bad decision by Maher to come out. 1-0 to MontenegroQuote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
This start is a end result of not being organized and being frantic, playing straight into Montenegro’s hands…
You'd have to question some of the selection: Gilbert, Ferry in particular. Noss on the left and Kerrigan on the right would have been my choice. Also, time will tell re Ferguson vs Whelan vs Kayode. So far, the front 3 don't look up to it. Ross Tierney contributing more than anyone going forward
Dreadful for half an hour. Looked like a switch to 4-4-1-1 then with Ferry switching to the right and Tierney getting closer to Ferguson. Progressively better from that point on and might have got one back. Seems to be a tricky wind and I think it’ll be in our backs second half. Definitely not out of the game but need to build on the last 15 mins of the first half.
clear penalty on kayode not given. another peno given now
coventry misses it
jesus these 21s make it hard for themselves. that's probably 3 points dropped across 2 games with missed penalties
I was just looking at the qualifying schedules for U17s & U19s on wikipedia and I noticed our European co-efficient rankings are 9th and 10th respectively yet we're only 23rd at U21 level. Why does the level of comparative achievement and performance markedly decline at U21 level? As a smaller nation with a shallow pool are we cannibalising the U21s sooner and to a greater extent than other nations that surpass us at U21s? Is coaching inferior? I know in years gone by we used to blame Don Givens, jobs for the boys etc but the difference in results is quite stark between those levels.
I think a part of it is the lack of a fully-pro environment at home for players to move into at that age. Half the current U21 squad are LoI-based - there's very limited options for full-time positions in the LoI, and the structure of LoI clubs by and large isn't going to be as professional as at other clubs. There's a similar disparity in the UEFA Youth League, where our clubs do ok at U19 level, but compare Molde and UCD as clubs and see where the respective players in our 2017 tie have done since. It's not just Haaland who's done well on that Molde team, whereas Farrugia is probably the highest-profile UCD player, and he's at Rovers.
I'd say pro academies for 19s up would make a big difference, but the money isn't there.
If that is the case, then Brexit will mean it'll become a big deal fairly soon. Which would be a positive as it would force us to address it - sink or swim, effectively.
I don't disagree with that you are saying but see if from a different angle. While not necessarily currently or with the last batch of U21s, I've generally felt the U21 LOI players have been more effective than their (technically better) UK based counterparts simply because they are playing first-team football (would point to the UCD chap Kerrigan who played against Luxembourg - thought he made quite a strong impact (on his debut?)). The UK based players selected at U21 are not always first team footballers and if they are, they are on the radar of a senior call-up. If we are wondering why there is a drop in ranking from U17/U19 to U21 level, it is as much down to our technically better players not getting first team football in the UK, when our peers playing in other leagues are, as domestic structure failings.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Oh they can be technically quite efficient, for sure, but their development is still hindered by playing a key developmental phase in a largely part-time environment. This is looking at U19s up, starting with guys who maybe aren't necessarily getting regular first-team LoI football and certainly aren't fully pro. The comparison between a fairly modest club like Molde and any LoI side (even Rovers) is quite stark.
I think your latter point is the same point I made though. Yes, other 21s players are often playing first-team football at home. We're an outlier in Europe in that we export players at 16 to a foreign academy. If they were able to stay at home and come through the ranks here - like in almost every other European country - then they'd be getting first-team LoI ball at 19-22 or so, and then moving to England for decent fees if good enough. I think our approach to those key developmental years is very lacking (and that's before you look at players going to England who come back three years later without having made it - which is the majority of them)
Campaigns are longer, so results turn around slower. We've only had one campaign since Noel King left and it went a little pear shaped at the end. If you look at the current eligible squad, you could have a team of:Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
Bazunu
O'Connor
Omobamidele
Collins
Bagan
Coventry
Kilkenny
Knight
Parrott
Connolly
Idah
That's a team that would win the group.
Compared to other teams in our u21 group, total eligible players in the senior squad in this window:
Ireland 7
Luxembourg 6
Italy 2
Bosnia 1
Montenegro 0
Sweden 0
For a wider sample, let's also look at our Senior group:
Ireland 7
Luxembourg 6
Azerbaijan 2
Serbia 2
Portugal 1
I think the issue with Noel King was a lot to do with picking the wrong players, the football was also pretty agricultural. But the fact guys like Harry Charsley and Conor Dimiao were playing and Jack Byrne didn't make a single squad. You could really pick apart about 10 of the squad members at the time. Jamie McGrath was ignored till the last game or two after he won the young player of the year in LOI and then he got a token call-up. Talbot and Kelleher largely ignored for Bossin. Ogbene ignored. In form lads like Cleary, Daire O'Connor, Jimmy Dunne, Dan Crowley. Tonnes of lads who never had a hope of progressing to the senior side: Rory Hale, Joe Quigley, Shaun Donnelan etc etc. That's that last group. The ones before that were played in Waterford, so i didn't see them. There was a sense that he was involved in convincing players to come on board, so he felt a debt to them to keep them involved and he trusted 'his group', so when the guys from 1998 graduated u19s
Declan Rice, Josh Cullen and Ryan Manning largely carried that side with the occasional cameo from Grego-Cox, Curtis, Shodipo and Ronan Hale. We ended up coming third.
The Kenny campaign was looking great after 7 games, really good results, bar losing away to Iceland. Maybe the squad was a little gutted for the last 3 games but losing to Iceland at home and losing to an Italy team which was an u20 team because their u21s were in isolation was pretty bad. Came 3rd again.
Looks like we're on pace for another 3rd place finish in this campaign. Shame because the 2000/2001 groups were fantastic.
Because you had plonkers like Noel King incharge for so long…Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
Tell that to Gavin Bazunu.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
There is a drop at u21 level are down to the fact that you had Noel King incharge for so long…Quote:
Originally Posted by ifk101
Yeah, taking one datum point doesn't really prove or disprove the macro-level point.Quote:
Originally Posted by CSAD
That's a useful analysis. Answers my question about us cannibalising (for want of a better term) our U21s more than others due to lack of current depth. It'll be interesting to see if there's a greater convergence of performances and coefficients going forward once the senior squad stabilises.Quote:
Originally Posted by elatedscum
Yeah I can't see the 2002 crop of U21s being affected like the 2000 crop. The lads who'll be overage after this campaign will hopefully start replacing lads who'll be phased out of the seniors over the next couple of years and we've already got the three best 2002 age group players in the seniors already with Bazunu, Omobamidele, and Parrott.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
I'd more go with this post and your earlier one on the matter, you do have the potential to make good points on occasion:). The promotion of the best underage talent to the senior squad this term just exposes other shortcomings.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
The Iceland senior squad in transition contains 8 u21 players (when fit), yet the u21 team have maintained a similar level of competitiveness in this campaign. Whilst the most talented Icelandic youngsters are most always cherrypicked mid teens, the majority don't go abroad until aged 19/20/21, after they've played a season or two at senior level, finished their 2nd level education and have already been capped at all underage levels. From the players perspective, a competent level of maturity, attitude and football ability has been learned, so if things don't work out with their first club they'll find another club readily who can use them.
However, the Faroese senior squad has no u21 eligible player, they currently have a policy of using the best youngsters for the u21 squad. This has had the effect of maintaining a good level of competitiveness against vastly bigger federations at the u21 grade and probably develops a better 'mentalitee'. Different strokes for different folk.
The smaller federations who have invested wisely in home grown professional standard coaches and coaching infrastucture have gained the most benefit from that UEFA/FIFA TV income/grants etc which is distributed equally to each federation. The FAI is about 15 years (or more) behind.
Squad announced for Italy and Sweden: https://www.fai.ie/ireland/news/craw...X7uyWVZbNYGaqA
Armstrong Oko-Flex strong form for West Ham under 23s rewarded. Interesting to see Andrew Moran isn't in there but Evan Ferguson is. Johansson back from 19's to 21's. Festy Ebosele and Will Smallbone return from injury. Gavin Kilkenny remains with the 21's.
Anything else of note?
All the keepers are Irish based lads, are they picked because they are playing week in week out? or is there no one of note across the waterQuote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
I read recently that Conor Gallagher is no longer eligible for any country, other than England, because he played for England in a competitive U21 game after his 21st birthday.
If that's correct, does that mean that Conor Coventry, who turned 21 in March, is now tied to us, and Will Smallbone (21 since February) will be too if he plays against either Italy or Sweden?
Dan Rose probably would be there but he's going to be the U19s #1, so no point warming the bench at 21s level. We're in a weird spot too that our best U21 keeper starts for our senior team, so there's that!
Good to see Oko-Flex there. Would love for to kick on and get a senior appearance at West Ham soon.
Is McGinty, the Sligo keeper, overage now?
Yeah he's 22 now. Born in August 1999, so misses out by 4 months!Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
I think so. Once u are under 21 years of age u can do what u want, including 3 senior competitive caps ( which is ridiculous) but once u hit 21 and play competitive game you are officially committedQuote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Yeah I'm still confused on that rule whether it includes competitive U21 games or just senior games. I always assumed it would tie the likes of Gallagher, Coventry, and soon Smallbone down but the rule does state if they appear in A international level. Would assume A international level means senior team.Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Interesting that Crawford mentioned yesterday that the FAI were interested in Conor Bradley and had talked to 3rd parties about the possibility of switching before he was called up to Northern Ireland senior team.
Can we get clarity on this once and for all? it would be good to knowQuote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Don't think it's that ridiculous especially now with nation's league replacing friendlies. Stops bigger nation's from capping young dual nationality players and then not playing them again. FIFA scraped getting capped at U21 level tying a player down as France were doing it with young players of African descent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggs246
Small nation's will benefit more now in the long run. And players will have to wait three years now after their last appearance before they can play with their new nation so won't get lads just switching at the drop of a hat and walking into teams like Rice did.
Its not just nations league. A guys can play 3 competitive world Cup or European championship qualifying games for the senior team and then defect?.no sorry that is ridiculousQuote:
Originally Posted by JR89
Festy Ebosele scored for Derby today. Good man.
Why do you put value on those claims? are you not a UCD laureate?Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Has Conor been capped at senior competive level yet? And what were you reading, the Daily Dimwittery?
no, I'm asking if it's trueQuote:
Originally Posted by geysir
no, UL graduate
no, just u21
the42's football newsletter