Irish Abroad 2013/2014

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

Not quite. You weren't ridiculed for expressing an unpopular opinion. The problem was not the popularity of your opinion; it was due to the fact that your claim was suspect. You offered a very ungenerous interpretation of a Robbie Keane quote relating to his eventual international retirement and were rightly challenged on it. Despite this and being presented with cogent reasons as to why your interpretation wasn't at all appropriate, you persisted to insist that you were right. If it was raised in other threads, it was most likely to serve as an example of your continued and irritating stubborness in the face of your denial.

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Really? First, I was accused of making the quote up. Then when I provided the quote and a link to several reputable sources that carried said quote, circumstances change, and then I am accused of misinterpreting his quote. Which is it like? I think that is pretty stubborn to be quite frank.

I know there is a distrust of the "meeja" and everything but Robbie said what he said, not anyone else. He doesn't deserve to be drawn and quartered and I don't think it's even that big a deal but it bears mentioning when you hear all this talk of supposed unconditional loyalty.

And constantly bringing up Anthony Pilkington or Robbie Keane, on a thread that has nothing to do with them, in a derisive way, when someone doesn't agree with something I say isn't kind of petty, no?

Take it to the Eligibility Thread, lads.

Sorry Chuck, the mods can move if necessary. TOWK's persistence on this point infuriates me.

Keane did indeed say what he said. That's not in dispute. It's what he meant that is ambiguous. TOWK knows that full well. He won't even accept any ambiguity. To him it's clear as day. Keane was holding the management to ransom. Pick me or I quit.

This attitude would contradict any other comment he has ever made about how important playing for Ireland is. To anyone without a Keane chip on his shoulder or an agenda it would be much more reasonable to assume that he meant that when he is no longer wanted he won't make a fuss, he'll just walk off into the sunset.

In fact the quote is so old now I doubt we'll ever establish what Keane truly meant. In all likelihood he'll probably have reached his sell by date at the same time as he is no longer picked. It'll be the right time to move aside. If he formally retires from international football when not selected there is no way TOWK or whoever can then say he told us so.

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Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks

Never ceases to amuse me how I am accused of attacking other posters/posts and making other users feel unwelcome while I regularly have to put up with things like this being said to me.

It says a lot that the poster who I was allegedly rude to is conspicuous by his absence in this debate yet the usual suspects are attacking me on his behalf, jumping on what I said, with the same old pack mentality and simultaneously accuse me of having an agenda. :rolleyes:

I get it lads. You have been here longer than me. I am an easy target. You pay absolutely no respect or tolerance to my opinions and never have.

Really, there is genuinely no need for the rudeness. What I said to bwagner did not warrant this tirade.

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It doesn't say much, really. I just made a comment and moved on and specified I was choosing to ignore certain things. I might urge you to consider doing the same some time.

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Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks

Really? First, I was accused of making the quote up. Then when I provided the quote and a link to several reputable sources that carried said quote, circumstances change, and then I am accused of misinterpreting his quote. Which is it like? I think that is pretty stubborn to be quite frank.

I know there is a distrust of the "meeja" and everything but Robbie said what he said, not anyone else. He doesn't deserve to be drawn and quartered and I don't think it's even that big a deal but it bears mentioning when you hear all this talk of supposed unconditional loyalty.

And constantly bringing up Anthony Pilkington or Robbie Keane, on a thread that has nothing to do with them, in a derisive way, when someone doesn't agree with something I say isn't kind of petty, no?

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Well, I'll speak for myself; I accused you of embellishing the meaning, rather than the literal content, of any quote. If someone accused you of making a quote up in its entirety - I certainly didn't - perhaps, like Bonnie, they were initially misled by your corruption and were rightly disbelieving of what you were claiming Robbie meant by something you were convinced he'd said. No quote exists that possesses the meaning you assigned to that quote. When the quote allegedly backing up your claim was re-posted in Robbie's thread in January of this year by geysir, things became clearer. It was purported by yourself to amount to "evidence" of inevitable indignant huffing on future Robbie's part, but it indicated nothing of the sort. At its literal worst, the quote was ambiguous. You put your own spin on it and attempted to give the impression Robbie had said something totally out-of-character. Contextually, it was an insult to his unrelenting service and commitment. In what way has he demonstrated his loyalty is conditional? How cynical. He's always shown up when called upon. You're correct that Robbie literally "said what he said" - no-one is doubting that - but that doesn't mean your stringent interpretation offers a true insight into what those words actually meant. What would motivate him to say what you claimed he was saying? What good would it do him besides damaging his reputation? Why would he intentionally present himself as a spoilt brat soon to throw his toys out of the pram? It doesn't add up.

I was already familiar with the quote and plenty others had also encountered it previously on Robbie's thread back in 2011 when certain "reputable sources" first decided to push the same dud tack with which you went, so it's not as if you were enlightening anyone with some grand revelation as to Robbie's "true" intentions or bringing anything new to the table.

The only reason others might persist with this is because you still appear to be in complete denial of the possibility that you might have misinterpreted Robbie's words. The one who brought it up here was your own self; again, to fabricate victimhood. If you think me taking you up on this again is "petty" or happens to take a thread off-topic for a brief moment, I'm not too bothered. I nevertheless assure you it's nothing personal and I'd rather you posting here than not. As a matter of principle, however, I think it's worth defending against this sort of agenda-driven guff the reputation of an Irish legend who has not just entertained me and filled me with national pride, but brought me so many moments of pure, unbridled joy down through the years.

Ryan Robinson supposedly signing for Everton. Anyone able to tell me how good he is? A bit confusing, but if Shelbourne get just under 1million for him, it looks like LOI clubs might be finally getting the money they should for the young players they are developing, which is a mighty step forward if this article is to be believed.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport...-irish-7142834

I'd be pleasantly surprised if it was anything like £1 million straight up, but if it is Kevin's will be due a good chunk of it. Hopefully this will be the sign of things to come with players going up the chain to LOI before moving to England and all clubs benefiting from his progress rather than lads being shipped off by the schoolboy clubs the moment they turn 16. I haven't seen Robinson play so I can't comment.

Danny, I never said that you were being petty.

I interpret Robbie's words differently from others. I don't think I ever said that my interpretation was the literal meaning of his words but if I did, I am sorry.

I just have to say that he has been one of our top 5 players over the last decade and a fantastic servant, even if he has started virtually every competitive and friendly game, even if it comes at the expense of looking at other options in the case of the latter.

Players who turn up unconditionally even if they are picking up splinters on the bench deserve equal respect.

And giving Robbie the benefit of the doubt is understandable but if memory serves me correct, lads like Daryl Murphy and Joey O'Brien weren't afforded the same benefit of the doubt when they said similar things when left out of squads at the start of the Trapattoni era.

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Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks

Danny, I never said that you were being petty.

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Fair enough. I might have been a bit melodramatic, but your intransigence grated with me. :o

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I interpret Robbie's words differently from others. I don't think I ever said that my interpretation was the literal meaning of his words but if I did, I am sorry.

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You implied such in continually stating, "he said what he said", as if that offered your position clarity. It's not an apology I'm after; I was just looking for an acknowledgment that your interpretation might not have been sacrosanct.

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Players who turn up unconditionally even if they are picking up splinters on the bench deserve equal respect.

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Certainly, they deserve respect. On top of his commitment though, I think Robbie's unique record and achievements command a special respect.

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And giving Robbie the benefit of the doubt is understandable but if memory serves me correct, lads like Daryl Murphy and Joey O'Brien weren't afforded the same benefit of the doubt when they said similar things when left out of squads at the start of the Trapattoni era.

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Their treatment has nothing to do with Robbie. Just because their commitment might have been questioned (by the public/media?) in the past, it doesn't justify treating Robbie similarly. And you certainly weren't affording O'Brien the benefit of any doubt only last week. You accused him of "crying off"! :confused:

You will have to excuse my ignorance over my comments about Joey O'Brien. It's probably the frustration that he is our best option to play left back and he is missing four games to get valuable playing time.

He missed three months through injury. He has been fully fit for over a month now and has a sum total of one League game to show for it. I don't think two friendly games spaced out over a week/two weeks would exacerbate his condition. If anything, the match practice would probably be a good thing.

If he's missing these games, then what chance does he have of featuring in the Oman game or the Qualifying games when he's back in the thick of it in the PL?

I just have hard time buying it to be quite frank.

Not going to get into it with Robbie Keane again suffice to say I never said my opinion was sacred and he is our record goalscorer by 40 odd goals - fair enough - but in the context I think he should be analysed the same way as everyone else.

I just think it boils down to the fact that you go to worst case scenario on every issue related to Irish players. It is clear that "worst case" is your default interpretation of every issue, real or perceived, that you are presented with.

You're not alone in that but you are certainly in the minority here where most posters usually try to apply a sense of balance to opinions, rely on past behaviours as being an indicator of current intent and, all else being equal, default to benefit of the doubt.

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Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks

I don't think two friendly games spaced out over a week/two weeks would exacerbate his condition. If anything, the match practice would probably be a good thing.

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From where exactly do you derive this insight? You're an Irish football fan, who's never met Joey O'Brien, writing on an online forum. You're not his doctor nor are you a member of the FAI's medical staff.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

From where exactly do you derive this insight? You're an Irish football fan, who's never met Joey O'Brien, writing on an online forum. You're not his doctor nor are you a member of the FAI's medical staff.

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I wonder if this is TOWK pulls off his mask and reveals himself as Dr Richard Steadman.

Back in the real world, if anyone fancies ploughing through this list...you will find a few Irish players in the mix.
http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/n...sed-lists.html

Conor Henderson didn't make it at Hull, disappointingly. Brandon Miele released by Newcastle. Egan and Westwood gone from Sunderland. Not a great day for the Irish in the north east.

Reid obviously hasn't worked out a contract with WBA either.

Apparently they could still get offered a new contract by their current club...those ones seem unlikely though.

last two stats blogs of the season up: http://irish-abroad.appspot.com/
Appearance stats for May, and the appearance stats for the 2013/14 season as a whole.

I've updated the goals page with a new video player: http://irish-abroad.appspot.com/Blog?tag=goals
You can click on the game you want to watch, or each time is a link to when the goal was scored in the video

http://rokerreport.sbnation.com/2014...join-new-clubs

Forrester scouted by Sunderland.

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Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks

http://rokerreport.sbnation.com/2014...join-new-clubs

Forrester scouted by Sunderland.

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Everton and West Ham also looking at him according to the Daily Mail. Leeds have looked at him but with Brian McDermott gone that will presumably end.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...er-Column.html

How did Forrester play against Derry?

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

How did Forrester play against Derry?

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He couldn't see the wood for the trees



Attachment 2095 / Attachment 2094

http://www.independent.ie/sport/socc...-30258597.html

Seen this (3 week) old article. Forrester says he would like to play abroad - if a move to England doesn't materialise - with Buckley's encouragement.

One of Stan's players from our last sojourn in the States is moving up a grade: http://www1.skysports.com/football/n...tephen-gleeson

Stephen Gleeson in talks with Birmingham. Still only 25- 7 years on from his Ireland debut.

I can't have been the only one who wanted it to be Joe Lapira.

http://www1.skysports.com/football/n...-host-of-clubs

Could be agents trying to stir an interest but he shouldn't be short of offers. That goal tally from midfield demonstrates he was at a level below himself. Will be interesting to see if he just moves to League One or if a Championship side is willing to take a punt.

Sky Sports

understands a number of Championship clubs are tracking Leyton Orient forward David Mooney. The likes of Mooney's former club Reading and Ipswich are thought to be keeping tabs on the Irishman, who scored 21 goals for Orient last season.

Alan Cawley's comments and personal experience about going to England at a young age are interesting (I know it's a few months old). It must be so hard on the kids and their family. I really wish we could keep these kids at home until they are older and more mature before they make these decisions.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/irish...7275-analysis/

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Originally Posted by gastric

Alan Cawley's comments and personal experience about going to England at a young age are interesting (I know it's a few months old). It must be so hard on the kids and their family. I really wish we could keep these kids at home until they are older and more mature before they make these decisions.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/irish...7275-analysis/

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Call me biased, but I think they're far better prepared to go to England at 18/19 after a season or two in League of Ireland. It's a big ask for a 15/16 year old to leave home and move to England to play football full time. A couple of years makes a big difference to a kids experience and character.

How good is Cork City's Brian Lenihan? Seemingly Arsenal among others are interested in him.


http://www.eveningecho.ie/2014/07/01...offer-lenihan/

He's a super player but I wouldn't have thought he'd interest Arsenal. Technically very good but very raw too, decision-making isn't great at times although I'm not sure where his final position will be. I think first team football is really helping him and you'd be worried about him getting lost in reserve team football.

New contracts for Sean Long and Shane Griffin of Reading.

http://www.getreading.co.uk/sport/fo...ing-fc-7355238

Anyone know much about Justin Merz?: http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/justi...spieler/172652

He was born in Germany and plays with Karlsruher SC II, but is eligible to play for us and recently played for our under-21s. How does he qualify? Irish mother, I assume?

Doyle and Ward uncertain futures
http://www.independent.ie/sport/socc...-30434968.html

Josh O'Hanlon to League Two York on a month's loan. He previously had a good spell with non-league Poole Town. On the bench today at Mansfield.

http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/spo..._City_on_loan/