Don't be jealous we all know you're smart in a different kind of way. It doesn't suit you.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
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Don't be jealous we all know you're smart in a different kind of way. It doesn't suit you.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
He was doing some shameless charity self promotion on the six one news there to improve his image before the court case.
He'll need a lot more than shameless charity activities to counter the 24 State witnesses being called to give evidence for the prosecution.
To be fair, players do things like this all the time. He's not able to play at the moment and the FAI was organising the event, so I doubt there's anything more to it than he was free and said yes when he was asked.
When is the case?
He's innocent until proven guilty but if he is found guilty of doing what is alleged is he a suitable candidate to represent our country? I'd like to know more about what actually happened. From what has been reported in the press it doesn't sound good but you couldn't believe a word they say to be fair to him.
If, and it's a big if, he did what has been alleged, is it too much of a risk to take a chance on something like this happening while he is abroad? If he was as good as Roy Keane I know I wouldn't even be thinking about this sort of thing which is massively hypocritical.
I'm torn on this one.
Well the Irish Independent just quoted what the 'victim' said in court so I don't think we need to doubt what's being reported in that sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
As for the suitable candidate thing... at worst, he got drunk and angry and things spiralled out of control. It's not nice but it's hardly worthy of terminating his international career! I'd say with footballers and athletes in general, it's so rare that they get to have a few drinks that it often blows the head off them when they let loose. That's not an excuse really but sh!t happens. Who hasn't gotten into a scuffle at some stage on a night out or woke up the next day and thought, "oh fu*k, what they hell was I thinking there!!".
Even from the allegations it's hard to know what Hendrick is being accused of after pulling your man out of the taxi, did the friends take over at that stage or was he in the middle of it leading the charge? Time will tell I suppose.
The case was adjourned to a date in April so it can't be far off.
I'm thinking out loud, but it is potentially concerning behaviour. Not saying his international career needs to be ended, but (assuming the claims are true etc) he may need to do something to try to control his temper. I do think Irish players should be held to a higher standard than what the English would be prepared to accept. Everyone who is given the honour of pulling on the green jersey is an ambassador for this place. We have been blessed over the years with excellent young men and women to represent us in all sports, but it doesn't just happen by accident. Wooden spoons up and down the country had to be waved in the faces of generations of Irish children to make that happen.
But I'm only thinking out loud really. We need to hear his side of the story.
I remember RMK was in the papers a lot in his early Man United days over getting drunk and into rows. Half the time he was innocent, half the time he was acting the boll!x. But he sorted himself out as he matured and removed himself from being in those situations. Hopefully Jeff follows suit.
It certainly shouldn't affect how we think about him because 1. we weren't there 2. we've only really read the alleged victim's side of the story 3. it has nothing to do with his football
Benefit of the doubt to him for now but the victim's side of the story is worrying alright. Makes him out to be very violent and vindictive. One part of the whole thing that I don't get is that the victim is claiming he did absolutely nothing. Not that any assault can be warranted but he makes out that the attack by the group was completely unprovoked which beggars belief and makes me wonder if there are fallacies in his account of events.
Hendrick himself actually spoke on Newstalk last night about his first season on the fringes of the first team having been on the bench for the closing game of the previous season. He stated that he went home for the summer in between and enjoyed himself too much with his mates, came back unfit and then got injured. Stated he learned a lesson there and hasn't let it happen again. Proves he's human and makes mistakes but does try to learn and clearly learned from that one.
Well he seems to have two and a half years good behaviour since then so maybe he has learned from it.Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
I was wondering that as well. For there to have been no words exchanged and absolutely no reason for it starting seems odd. Either there is more to it, or Hendrick has a serious problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
As DeLorean says though. Kept his nose clean for 2 and a half years since, which without having his side of it or any witnesses would create a seed of doubt about the guys story.
He absolutely gets the benefit of the doubt until the trial ends
I think it's a bit more serious than being provoked and slapping someone.
He instigated the fight, he dragged the - unwilling - participant out of a taxi and cowardly battered him with his mates.
He should get a small prison sentence but this is Ireland, you can glass someone on your 68th occasion before the courts and you will just get another suspended sentence.
In the Ireland I know, the victim would have been paid off by now. And then keep schtum about it. If he's found guilty, then he should get sentenced. And like all the other cases country wide, the sentence will be suspended and he'll never see the inside of a cell.
None of which should affect the right of MON to select him.
"Who hasn't gotten into a scuffle at some stage on a night out?" Me for one and probably most people in the country.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
This was not a scuffle.
He is being charged with violent disorder, one other is being charged with that as well as assault causing harm, more serious.
violent disorder definition
Hendricks will probably request Judge James O´Connor to be the judge :)
He dismissed this case with this judgement
OK Dad.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
Sh!t happens sometimes is all I mean, especially when young people, in particular, are fuelled with alcohol. It doesn't mean they're intrinsically bad or set out to do harm. Obviously if he's found guilty he'll get whatever punishment the court decides, but that will be that as far as I'm concerned.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
I meant a scuffle in the sense that it possibly started out that way and escalated. I know it's a lot more serious obviously, that he's not being charged with 'being involved in a scuffle', it was escalated to a higher ruling court after all. I was speaking in terms of the possibility of being banned from representing his country as a result of what happened.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
I don't think he should be prohibited from playing for Ireland but what's right is right; Joey Barton went to prison for beating the living daylights out of someone. After Hendrick receives his penance, he has an equal shot for redemption - like Joey.
But a scuffle it wasn't. It was an unprovoked, one-sided gang assault - and the lad should be ashamed of himself.
Delorean, not sure which post this was on, you can call it lazy, but the Jamie Vardys are the exceptions, I am not saying something so radical as it not to be believed or uncommon. Hendrick is playing Division 1 for the last few years, and that doesn't look like its going to change this year unless Derby promote themselves. Its simple logic, the cream rises to the top. YOu call the lazy, i call it natural progression.
I could be wrong, Ireland could have a great campaign and end up in the Quarters, with Hendrick playing a pivotal role, talk of spain, germany, italy and the premiership. And a move to Norwich/West Brom materialises.
It seems a lot more serious than a scuffle.
Having thought about it JD is probably right. Innocent or guilty it shouldn't affect the right of MON to select him on this occasion. Everyone can make a mistake, especially when drink is involved.
If it happened again it might be a different matter though. Even if he is found not guilty i think a conversation needs to happen about avoiding those situations (if it hasn't already happened).
You sound like you were there.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
I'd say so too.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
And the court has been very touchy feely sensitive to Stokes' football occupation, ahead of the interests of the alleged victim.
But I suppose if you imitate Elvis, you got to take the punches.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
Lads, I used the word scuffle. I wasn't saying it was just a scuffle, I was saying that scuffles can spiral out of control with a lot of alcohol consumed, that things can happen that nobody intended initially. I obviously didn't explain this very well originally but I've explained it since. Nobody is saying it was just a scuffle.Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
That's pretty much what I meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
Harry Arter was the example I used, not Jamie Vardy. I don't think Arter stories are that exceptional, most of the Bournemouth team have acquitted themselves well at a higher level. All I'm saying is that Hendrick is probably capable of that too.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
Harry Arter has been a mainstay of that team for a long time now though. Hendrick hasn't.
Just to expand on my opinion of it, guilty or innocent, I don't think either should veto Martin O'Neills choice on whether to call him up or not. But the whole situation should have an effect on whether Martin thinks it's a good idea to call him up. FAI/Media/Supporters opinions should have no influence, just what's right for the Squad, the player, and the teams chances. Anyway, I don't want to sweep the whole thing under the carpet, nor do I think we should make a big deal of it. Judgement should be reserved until, well, judgement.Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
When Arter was Hendrick's age he was a mainstay in League 1. Hendrick has played over 200 games since making his debut five years ago. That's an average of 40 appearances per year. He's picked up a fair few injuries and has been out of favour here and there, but for the most part he's been a regular starter and important part of their team. Anyway, the point was that if Bournemouth didn't get promoted and Arter was still a Championship footballer, would you hold it against him, saying the cream comes to the top, if he was any good why aren't other clubs trying to sign him?, etc., etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
All that said, it is going to be tough for Hendrick to get back into the Derby team short-term when he recovers from his latest injury. They've had a couple of good wins in his absence and Hughes and Bryson are over their injuries.
I'm not even sure what we're discussing any more to be honest. I can't remember if you're saying he's not capable of playing in the PL, or that he wouldn't be a regular in the PL, or that he wouldn't be star in the PL, or what!
Judge, jury and executioner.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
Might be no harm to tone down the reporting of allegations as fact. Especially the more colourful ones. There's been a bit of sailing too close to the libel laws over the last couple of pages.
Don't feed the troll lads.
Hey, what I have said is public record. It's what several impartial witnesses have brought into record. I am not saying the lad should be punished by his club or national team - simply the law; same for everyone.
What you've said is to repeat allegations as fact. It's out of line and potentially defamatory in any context. And given dahamsta runs this site from his own pocket, I think it's very bad form to say anything which has the potential to bring him into legal trouble.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
It is public record. This isn't rag gossip. It has been brought as evidence. If what you're saying is the case, the matter shouldn't be discussed at all really. I think it's fair game.
It's reported court testimony. It's not fact.
What happened to my last comment? Did I accidentally delete it when I was trying to edit it? Idk I am drunk right now tbh. The truth will out!
Charlie, then why talk about it at all if.it's just conjecture? Maybe there was no.confrontation at all?
Don't be silly. The court testimony has been reported by a newspaper in line with legal guidelines. You've chosen to ignore those legal guidelines and assert that testimony as fact, and in doing so could expose the owner of this site to severe financial repurcussions. I think you should be very careful about abusing the trust he places in the users of this forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
Okay I won't talk about it any more because of the road it's going down but I don't see what's so different between this and your implying Seamus McDonagh is the reason Stephen Henderson is not getting called up to the Irish team with little or no basis in fact.
There is as much chance of you getting sued by McDonagh for that than there is of Foot.ie getting in trouble for my reciting of court testimony from a dozen witnesses.
It's not like I'm repeating second-hand allegations for Gods sake.
there has been legal action taken against forums in Ireland, including foot.ie, in the past because of posts
The difference is that there's nothing slanderous or otherwise about suggesting a player's coach is the reason why he's not being selected.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
In fact, I'd go so far as saying Ireland goalkeeping coach Seamus McDonagh has a big role in the selection of all Ireland's goalkeepers.
Jeff Hendrick on choosing soccer over Gaelic and Martin O’Neill’s magic touch: http://irishpost.co.uk/interview-jef...s-magic-touch/