Election 2007

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01/05/2007, 12:37 PM
pete

Quote:

Originally Posted by WeAreRovers

They don't believe that though, as myself Macy, Bohs Partisan etc have pointed out. They'd ditch that quick smart if in power.

Personally I'm not a huge fan of SF but the national question has always been important to me and SF (and FF) deserve a vote IMO for their work in the last 10 years.

Fair enough point on the National issue but do you think SF being in government here would help or hinder NI negotiations? How could the government in the Republic keep perspective. Why don't SF have any detailed policies with costings? (its impossible to find on their website). Why is Gerry Adams on SF posters when he not standing for election in this jurisdiction?

IMO a vote for SF is a waste as no party will go into government with them. I also think FF election manifesto is dishonest as they cannot get a majority. FG & Labour may not be able to get the numbers but at least they have a chance so presenting a Manifesto for government. On a related issue why don't the smaller parties inform the electorate what policies are showstoppers for them in government - at least that way we would know what policies they will drop when in sight of power.
01/05/2007, 1:01 PM
BohsPartisan

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

IMO a vote for SF is a waste as no party will go into government with them.

FF will if needs be. Secondly Pete, They are in Government in Northern Ireland and if the DUP will go into government with them then so will "Bertie's Team".
Finally in my opinion a vote for a Party that is going into government is a waste as whatever rainbow we end up with the end result will be more or less the same. Why not vote for someone who is trying to build a real opposition.
01/05/2007, 1:10 PM
beautifulrock

Thats a good point on building a real opposition. Living in the UK it is very clear that a strong opposition would/could have to some extent controlled Tony. Interesting to hear people's view on the current government in Ireland. However, is there a realt alternative? Even looking at the poll it seems that FF's still carry sway with the voting public (actually that is a point, does everyone who has contributed to this thread actually vote). Will watch with interest over the next few weeks.
01/05/2007, 1:33 PM
Dodge

FG and Labour tried fighting elections as one and it has always back fired on them. They have to go in as seperate parties. For all Labour's anti bertie posturing they've gone into govt with him before and they'll do it again. I'm sure they'd prefer to go in with FG (and others) but mainly down to then having a bigger say IMO

The PDs are made of up people who are pure evil (McDowell) and peopl who's ego wanted them to be big names in asmall party rather than FF backbenchers (Parlon etc). Disgusting party. Harney was given the job she and the other right wingers wanted (Enterprise, Trade & Employment) and still managed to **** it up. She was a joke in Health. McDowell has consistently failed on his woefully misjudged crackdown on crime, he's made a total balls of immigration issues, and he's made an arse out of himself on more than a few occassion with his petty vendettas

I'll be voting labour. Greens, FG and maybe even FF will get tactical votes of me (harney's is my constituency and it bugs me)
01/05/2007, 1:54 PM
Macy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dodge

FG and Labour tried fighting elections as one and it has always back fired on them. They have to go in as seperate parties. For all Labour's anti bertie posturing they've gone into govt with him before and they'll do it again. I'm sure they'd prefer to go in with FG (and others) but mainly down to then having a bigger say IMO

And they've never recovered from the last time! Only chance they'd have of pulling it off is if it were a deal breaker that Cullen, Roche, Brennan (for starters) were not Ministers of any description, never mind around the cabinet table.
01/05/2007, 1:57 PM
holidaysong

I will be voting Green - Labour - FG in that order. I think it is time for a change of government and also there is a much better chance for the introduction of same-sex partnerships under these three parties than under FF/PDs.
01/05/2007, 2:01 PM
Lionel Ritchie

Quote:

Originally Posted by holidaysong

I will be voting Green - Labour - FG in that order. I think it is time for a change of government and also there is a much better chance for the introduction of same-sex partnerships under these three parties than under FF/PDs.

I wouldn't know about that. There would be a huge socially right wing religious rump within Fine Gael or Fianna Fail that would oppose such partnerships on "moral" grounds.

You'd get scarce little of that from the PDs.
01/05/2007, 2:04 PM
holidaysong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lionel Ritchie

I wouldn't know about that. There would be a huge socially right wing religious rump within Fine Gael or Fianna Fail that would oppose such partnerships on "moral" grounds.

You'd get scarce little of that from the PDs.

FG have said they have no problems with their introduction, as have the Greens and Labour.

As for the PDs it was McDowell who needlessly 'postponed' the Labour Bill proposing them only a month or two ago. This meant that it wouldn't be seen again during the life of the current government.
01/05/2007, 2:15 PM
dahamsta

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lionel Ritchie

I vote Greens and Labour but have far more time for The Progressive Democrats than I would for Fine Gael and especially Fianna Fail. I've voted for them in the past and even had a very brief fling with the YPDs (long story:D )

They have an ideaology. I don't share their vision but I acknowledge and respect their viewpoint. Fianna Fails only vision is Fianna Fail in power. I consider them way more right wing than the PDs who are essentially a Liberal party who just happen to have a securocratic (thank you Shinners for my new word) leader.

If they have "fcuk the poor" economics -at least they say it to your face rather than behind your back or in the zipped up tent like FF.

So what you're saying is that if I believe that I should be entitled to oral sex from a different attractive woman every hour on the hour, and I believe it really strongly, you'll vote for me?

You realise that by that logic, if you lived in America you'd be voting for Fred Phelps and parading around with a sign saying God Hates Fags?

adam
01/05/2007, 2:28 PM
jebus

Quote:

Originally Posted by holidaysong

I will be voting Green - Labour - FG in that order. I think it is time for a change of government and also there is a much better chance for the introduction of same-sex partnerships under these three parties than under FF/PDs.

I think I'll have FG-Green-Labour in that order on my ballot, and I agree that a FG led coalition will be more likely to introduce same sex equality than a FF led coalition
01/05/2007, 2:39 PM
S�C

Interesting to see FF leading the way.

Tis just like the real thing, many the man has voted FF in the privacy of the ballot box when nobody is looking!

What are the biggest issues people consider when voting. For me it's the Irish language and the national question, after that house prices, first time buyer etc
01/05/2007, 2:45 PM
Lionel Ritchie

Quote:

Originally Posted by dahamsta

So what you're saying is that if I believe that I should be entitled to oral sex from a different attractive woman every hour on the hour, and I believe it really strongly, you'll vote for me?

adam

Nope. I'm saying I acknowledge they have an ideaology ...and you have yours. I don't think I committed to voting for either. Though do a drop a pamphlet through the letter box if you're passing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dahamsta

You realise that by that logic, if you lived in America you'd be voting for Fred Phelps and parading around with a sign saying God Hates Fags?

adam

That's a hell of a conclusion to arrive at. :confused: ...and how you got there I'm sure I don't know.
01/05/2007, 2:49 PM
OneRedArmy

Quote:

Originally Posted by S�C

Interesting to see FF leading the way.

Tis just like the real thing, many the man has voted FF in the privacy of the ballot box when nobody is looking!

What are the biggest issues people consider when voting. For me it's the Irish language and the national question, after that house prices, first time buyer etc

Funny enough its none of the above for me.

The national question, rightly or wrongly, disappeared with Articles 2 and 3.

Its health, sustainable job creation and retention, law and order and infrastructure and the environment for me.

Oh and reduction in cronyism and general "scratch my back I'll scratch yours, lets all meet up in the tent in Ballybrit"-type politics.
01/05/2007, 2:50 PM
dahamsta

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lionel Ritchie

Nope. I'm saying I acknowledge they have an ideaology ...and you have yours. I don't think I committed to voting for either. Though do a drop a pamphlet through the letter box if you're passing.

Nah, I'll be running in the People's Republic of Cork, we don't have free and fair elections. :)

Quote:

That's a hell of a conclusion to arrive at. :confused: ...and how you got there I'm sure I don't know.

I don't know how you can't. You said that you admire the PDs because they have an ideology. Nazis have an ideology, do you admire them?

adam
01/05/2007, 3:00 PM
osarusan

Quote:

Originally Posted by dahamsta

I don't know how you can't. You said that you admire the PDs because they have an ideology. Nazis have an ideology, do you admire them?

adam

He said he acknowledged that they had a viewpoint, and respected that point. He didnt say he admired them.

His point (I think) is that while Fianna Fail have no other motive than keeping power for themselves, other parties, while those ideology may be suspect, at least have an ideology, and that deserves respect.

He's not saying he will vote for anybody just because they have an ideology and others don't. By your logic, Phelps is the only person in the USA with an ideology, which I disagree with.
01/05/2007, 3:04 PM
BohsPartisan

Just for the record as The Socialist Party won't have a candidate in the constiuency I live in, I'll probably give my vote to The Workers' Party. Can't see anyone else on the ballot paper I'd even want to be seen in the same building as. There might be some independants worth giving a preference to.

By the way, I think FF do have an Ideology, they're just very good at hiding it from the electorate.
01/05/2007, 3:06 PM
OneRedArmy

Quote:

Originally Posted by BohsPartisan

Just for the record as The Socialist Party won't have a candidate in the constiuency I live in, I'll probably give my vote to The Workers' Party. Can't see anyone else on the ballot paper I'd even want to be seen in the same building as. There might be some independants worth giving a preferance too.

Greens surely the least objectionable of the big parties?
01/05/2007, 3:08 PM
Lionel Ritchie

Quote:

Originally Posted by dahamsta

Nah, I'll be running in the People's Republic of Cork, we don't have free and fair elections. :)

I don't know how you can't. You said that you admire the PDs because they have an ideology. Nazis have an ideology, do you admire them?

adam

Ah I was waiting for either the nazis or communists to be brought up and was going to deal extremist comparisons in the previous post but frankly I'm trying to do an actual job while nipping in and out of here too.

I brought up the PDs Ideology -which is actually composed of fairly mainstream political and economic traditions -in juxtaposition to, in particular, Fianna Fail who have no particular ideology at all beyond an all consuming desire to be in power and a presumption on a right to be in office.
01/05/2007, 3:11 PM
BohsPartisan

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

Greens surely the least objectionable of the big parties?

Anyone who hasn't ruled out coalition with FF or FG is objectionable to me.
01/05/2007, 3:15 PM
OneRedArmy

Quote:

Originally Posted by BohsPartisan

Anyone who hasn't ruled out coalition with FF or FG is objectionable to me.

Fair enough!

Surely there is an argument that they are better off influencing from the inside rather than sniping from the opposition?

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