Is Clinton Morrison better than Jason Byrne? :confused: Kevin Doyle is already a better player than Morrison, and he's only played one season in England, and only played twice for Ireland!!Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
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Is Clinton Morrison better than Jason Byrne? :confused: Kevin Doyle is already a better player than Morrison, and he's only played one season in England, and only played twice for Ireland!!Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
How would Clinton Morrisson or even the perpetually maligned Wavey Davy Connolly do in the eL? Extremely well I'd guess.
But that's not the point as far as I can see it. Relative fitness of the el vs England isn't the point either.
The point is that we should have FIVE forwards in the squad. Regardless of how you'd rank them I'd say most accept that Keane, Doyle, Elliott & Morrisson are the top four. Each is of similar build and athletic ability. But who is there as the "Doherty option" ? Excluding Doherty as he's just not good enough the only real options are Byrne, Lee and maybe, if he starts to get a regular game, Daryl Murphy. At the moment Byrne is the man in possession. He's done nothing to lose his place and his "competition" has done nothing to earn theirs. It also appears that Elliott's fitness can't be guaranteed for consistent stretches.
It'd be extremely harsh to drop Byrne particularly after having given a good account of himself agaist Chile. I have to be honest though and say that when I've looked for Byrne to do well against good European opposition he's snatched at quite a few of his chances and could have done better. I'd hope that even his strongest supporters would agree with me. It's not a terminal failing, just fair criticism.
Also, Martin Jol has played Robbie withdrawn, behind Defoe & Berbatov, in all Spurs' preseason games since Robbie returned from a neck injury. By all accounts he's been playing very well & all three seem to relish their roles. It's not stretching it to think that deploying Robbie in a similar role for Ireland is an option, even if only as a temporary strategy if a game's circumstances warrant it, and this copperfastens the need for five forwards in my opinion.
On Morrisson: yes, he's limited but I'd still be inclined to pick him for Stutggart unless club form or the Dutch game suggests otherwise. Morrisson for 55 minutes & Doyle for 35mins in Stuttgart makes sense to me.
Morrison is a very poor player, he lacks pace, touch, guile, invention, his offside display away to the faroes was embarassing...But sadly that is the state of play. Morrison and Doherty in all their awfulness still remain options upfront for us:eek:
No, I'd say most accept that Keane is 1 & possibly Doyle is 2, after that there will be little agreement. Personally I'd put Jason Byrne at 3 (possibly 2, not quite sure whether Doyle is really better - he certainly wasn't scoring more goals in the same league, but he has age on his side) and the rest a very distant 4th,5th,etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Doherty is hopeless. Hate to have to slag off the fella but I'd probably have a better chance of scoring than he does.
Morrison is getting a bit of stick on here but he has never let us down. His hunger and running often puts some of the other lads to shame.
Ok Clinton is no Shevchenko but he can do a job for us and make a good impact sub. Doyle seems to have leapfrogged him in the pecking order so it's unlikely Clinton will start against the Dutch and Germans but if called upon I'm sure he'll make an impression.
Byrne impressed me when he made his debut, won a lot of headers and if we need a target man for the last 10 minutes I'd prefer to see him run on over Doherty.
He hardly got a touch on his debut, he did ok in his 2nd game though ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by shakermaker1982
Clinton morrison is miles better than Jason Byrne.Quote:
Originally Posted by mypost
I'd agree with most of Stuttgart's post.
Morrison is indeed better than Byrne but that doesn't make Morrisson very good either. Lets face it there a drought of decent irish forwards. Saying all that Byrne is entitled to take this 5th choice forward role as there is no one else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
I know Dr. Peepee & others have disagreed with me on this point but against Switzerland when we needed a goal late on, Kerr took Robbie off. Personally I'd have brought on Elliott to partner Morrisson and left Robbie just in behind them. That way we'd have had 3 forwards on the pitch & a goal would have been more likely. It's not impossible that a similar re-jig may be required in future. Robbie'd be even harder to mark.Quote:
Originally Posted by totalfootball
Anyway, by all accounts Robbie's form so far has been brilliant, setting up goals, forcing savers & hitting the woodwork. But, as you suggest, he has two very good forwards ahead of him at Spurs to interact with. We don't have that luxury at the moment unless Doyle & Elliott step up to the plate.
Morrisson is better than Byrne.However, what we don't have is a striker that can offer what Byrne can in terms of being a 'target' man.Byrne is better than Alan Lee & Gary Doherty.Daryl Murphy is not yet good enough, and in my opinion will not be.
Also, in the last campaign, we had many chances to score through set pieces and so forth.However we had no one with the physical prescence to execute these chances.
So it's Keane, then Doyle or Morrison, the either or both Elliott and Byrne.I think 5 strikers should be in the squad.
However none of this matters as I seem to remember reading on this forum that Bobby Robson said Byrne would never be part of the squad again:rolleyes:
Could have been just the grumblings of a disgruntled poster worse for wear spreading unsubstantiated rumours late in the evening (that thread was locked 5 seconds later).Quote:
Originally Posted by Soper
What I remember Bobby being quoted as saying was that Jason could improve his fitness levels.
I would be very very surprised if this happened... Keane was by far and away Spurs best striker last season and as well as scoring goals his all-round play was superb. Also hasn't he been captaining in Ledley King's absence???Quote:
Originally Posted by totalfootball
now i know its unlikely but, what if Macken at palace were to deliver a decent season, say, managing about one in 3 and having 10+ by Christmas in all comps, and in the process forging an understanding with Morrisson(who i beileve will start v holland and, barring a mare, also the germans).Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
would he then not come into the reckoning, even as a last 20mins player if we are chasing it, next to Morrisson with Keane tucked in behind the 2 of them?
given the much of a muchness between many of our lads compteing for the back-up striking spots, i dont think we can completely rule him out if he's doing ok.
Well, you say yourself it's unlikely! I wouldn't rule anyone out but I think the fifth forward role should be for someone who offers something different & at the moment Byrne's the man in possession. It's up to him to lose it or someone else to earn it. If Macken can earn it then good luck to him. I think the same applies to Alan Lee & Daryl Murphy. I also think Trundle could be considered and maybe even Andy Keogh or Adam Rooney in time. Maybe Stan is already planning on including young Dixon. Who knows? Maybe Stan'll go for 4 forwards bearing in mind he may think of Duff or Andy Reid as back-up options.
But you're right in saying that nobody can be "completely ruled out" if they're playing well enough - we have very few resources - but in Macken's case I just don't see it happening. I'd prefer to see Trundle given a shot than Macken.
How do eL fans rate Stephen Ward? Potential to become a full international?
I thought he was good for our U21s.
Not IMO. Lacks a fair bit. Wouldn't rank him in the top 10 strikers in the league and for someone who's looking to play international football within a couple of years you'd want him to stand out more. Bohs fans I know rate him highly though
yes Byrne is the man in posession, and rightly so as present, but wont his season end in mid-winter?
and the 'something different' being sought by this, and indeed, our prevoius manager, up front, is a bit of height and target man presence,as the game on the islands isnt technically proficient enough to play without one.
this is why somewhat limited (in international terms) guys like Byrne, Macken, Doherty and Lee have been selected, as we miss the big guy to hit.and i believe IF mr. Macken were to begin well, he would come back into the fold quicker than many people think, for this reason.
I would expect Lee to return to the squad as soon as he is fit and provided he is getting his game at Ipswich. I would be shocked ( pleasantly ) if Jason Byrne played in any qualifying game bar the against a minnow side.
Any thoughts?
He should be a regular in the Ireland squad anyway if the move goes through.
Don't ever stick a posting like this in the Ireland thread. Pete and Gustavo will have a fit.Quote:
Originally Posted by JC_GUFC
Just buzzin but they will.