LoI in Europe 2018

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Originally Posted by marinobohs

I think the generally held view is that anyone over 19 should be able to 'hack it' in the full set up or are never going to. The primary argument for under age is physical development etc but this should have evened out by 19/20. Probably a fair enough cut off age in most cases.

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I'm inclined to agree with you for the most part , most people who aren't good enough at 19 wil never be good enough.
The problem though is there are plenty of examples of players who weren't good enough at 19 but came good in their early 20's and the cut off at 19 means we definitely lose some of this unfulfilled potential from the guys who just pack it in and get on with life.
That's why I reckon an under 21 /23 reserve league in which players from the first team who need game time can play as well as a reserve squad would make more sense than an under 13 league. redundant conversation though as the under 13's is a fact and there's no money for under 21s/ 23's.
Good luck to the Bohs 19's though I might even do you a favour and pop along to Dalyer for the match, when I'm there Bohs always win :)

Or the reason may that if a player isn't good enough at 19 for the England Leagues he's never going to be.
The whole idea of the under ages leagues is to get better developed children going over to England & Scotland because the present system isn't working any more.
I doubt its to improve the lot of the LOI clubs.

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Originally Posted by disgruntled

Or the reason may that if a player isn't good enough at 19 for the England Leagues he's never going to be.
The whole idea of the under ages leagues is to get better developed children going over to England & Scotland because the present system isn't working any more.
I doubt its to improve the lot of the LOI clubs.

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Coleman is all I'm going to say to that

Sammon. Dicker. Boyle. Horgan. Could go on...

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Originally Posted by disgruntled

Or the reason may that if a player isn't good enough at 19 for the England Leagues he's never going to be.
The whole idea of the under ages leagues is to get better developed children going over to England & Scotland because the present system isn't working any more.
I doubt its to improve the lot of the LOI clubs.

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Well - the penny is at least dropping in some other quarters that we can't rely on British clubs to develop our youth any more. Not since they started overlooking us to hoover up talent from around the world instead.

Football has changed, and we have to change with it.

More legibly:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/45483586

Interesting bit: 'The European Leagues, the organisation that represents 32 leagues across Europe including the Premier League, Scottish Premiership and EFL, said it would fight the plans'.
My main question would be: is this now be a turn-off for potential investors thinking of putting cash into Irish clubs, with the potential for competing in the Europa League (or even the Champions League)? Would Dundalk's backers have been so keen if they thought the club would be further away from rubbing shoulders with Europe's more glamorous clubs?

In order to push this through UEFA will guarantee a few hundred grand more money for qualifying and probably a few hundred more for getting through a few rounds of the 3rd comp.

This will get the votes of 95% of the teams who would never see themselves as getting to a group stage.
Depending on the prize pool for getting to the group stages of this 3rd comp (even assuming there is one) it might offer mid level clubs an average payout bigger than the once in 10 years qualifying for the Europa group stages.
When UEFA spell out the money the clubs will make the decision.
Investors or boards might like a third tier if the average over several years looks better.
I guess we will see

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Originally Posted by sbgawa

I'm inclined to agree with you for the most part , most people who aren't good enough at 19 wil never be good enough.
The problem though is there are plenty of examples of players who weren't good enough at 19 but came good in their early 20's and the cut off at 19 means we definitely lose some of this unfulfilled potential from the guys who just pack it in and get on with life.
That's why I reckon an under 21 /23 reserve league in which players from the first team who need game time can play as well as a reserve squad would make more sense than an under 13 league. redundant conversation though as the under 13's is a fact and there's no money for under 21s/ 23's.
Good luck to the Bohs 19's though I might even do you a favour and pop along to Dalyer for the match, when I'm there Bohs always win :)

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Sean Maguire too ?

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Originally Posted by sbgawa

In order to push this through UEFA will guarantee a few hundred grand more money for qualifying and probably a few hundred more for getting through a few rounds of the 3rd comp.

This will get the votes of 95% of the teams who would never see themselves as getting to a group stage.
Depending on the prize pool for getting to the group stages of this 3rd comp (even assuming there is one) it might offer mid level clubs an average payout bigger than the once in 10 years qualifying for the Europa group stages.
When UEFA spell out the money the clubs will make the decision.
Investors or boards might like a third tier if the average over several years looks better.
I guess we will see

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This is most likely what will happen.

UEFA will chuck some more money at the 3rd tier nations, most of whom will clap like seals at the prospect of more crumbs from Europe's footballing banquet. The big money will continue to be retained higher up the foodchain, so the gap between bigger and smaller nations/clubs will widen even further.

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Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

Sean Maguire too ?

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Most people , he would be an example of what I went on to say.

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Originally Posted by sbgawa

Most people , he would be an example of what I went on to say.

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To be fair, you can apply the 'most people' qualification to almost any age statement

most people who aren't good enough at 15/19/21/23 will never be good enough

Europa League 18/19;
17 - Directly qualified.
6 - NCQ3 (4) and NCQ4 (2), (Champions League League Route)
4 - CHQ4, (Champions League Champions Route)
8 - LCQ4, (Europa League Champions Route)
13 - Q4, (Europa League Cup Winners and League Route)

48 to 32 is a massive reduction. Some media reports have suggested leagues outside the top 25 will be excluded from the Europa League. It'll take more than that for the reduction required.

Can't be for 18/19 teams already competing for places.
19/20 maybe.

We could end up with a situation similar to rugby. The top competition is a perpetually closed shop. The secondary competition is almost a closed shop save for token qualification through the third tier competition, which is the only place a team can directly qualify from a smaller league.

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Originally Posted by Poor Student

We could end up with a situation similar to rugby. The top competition is a perpetually closed shop. The secondary competition is almost a closed shop save for token qualification through the third tier competition, which is the only place a team can directly qualify from a smaller league.

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The Champions Cup isn't a closed shop. They have seen the need for a second tier and even a third as well.

I didn't agree with the power grab of the top 4 leagues for 16 automatic berths in the Champions League. A benefit of the restructure however was Cork for example being guaranteed a Europa League safety net.

If the next inevitable restructure is done in any small way properly, it should put an end to 3rd placed Champions League teams dropping into the Europa League knockout stage.

A proper 3rd tier European club competition should be exclusively for the best clubs outside of the top 25 leagues.

If UEFA are essentially talking about a Europa League II or whatever they'll call it, how are they likely to funnel league champions into these competitions?

If Celtic are in the top 25 leagues and are shocked by Dundalk. Will UEFA treat Celtic different for being from a higher league than Dundalk.

If league champions from outside the top 25 have to start off a round earlier, the best teams of that lot not making the Champions League or Europa League might question why are they being excluded from a competition in place of teams below them in their respective national leagues. Over to UEFA to sort out that conundrum.

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Originally Posted by legendz

The Champions Cup isn't a closed shop. They have seen the need for a second tier and even a third as well.

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I thought qualification was restricted to the English Premiership, French Top 14 and Irish, Welsh, Scottish and Italian participants in the Pro 16?

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Originally Posted by Poor Student

I thought qualification was restricted to the English Premiership, French Top 14 and Irish, Welsh, Scottish and Italian participants in the Pro 16?

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It built up around these leagues. Who's being excluded? Georgia, Romania, Germany and Russia could be proactive in forming their own Eastern Pro League and knock on the European door.

The likes of Scotland and the Netherlands are starting to feel excluded from the Champions League with the many more hurdles they have to jump over to get there.

You've a broader sense of closed shop which is fair enough. I'd see a Super League restricted to certain clubs as a closed shop.

Decent result for Bohs today in the Youth League; lost 2-1 in Denmark. Nothing to fear in the return leg in three weeks you'd imagine. Midtylland were 2-0 up after 75, but Bohs got one back shortly after Midtylland's second. Don't know did many head out?

Molde - who beat UCD on penalties last year - lost 10-1 to Chelsea.

In the Europa League, AEK Larnaka gave Bayer Leverkusen a heck of a game in Germany; took an early lead and were 2-1 down with two minutes to go, but eventually lost 4-2. But they - along with Cork's conquerors Rosenborg and, indirectly, Dudelange - are all on no points after two games.

FC Krasnodar, didn't pats knock them out a few years back? They beat Sevilla 2-1 tonight.

Wasn't that Krylya Sovetov? Currently 2nd from bottom in the Russian top flight. Krasnodar 2nd top.