Aiden McGeady

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24/03/2008, 7:32 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Superhoops

No, not even highlights, no interest and even if I had, highlights are no way of judging a player. I have never criticised him playing for Celtic as I have never seen him play for Celtic. I have only ever seen him play for Ireland at all levels from U-15's through to seniors. I know he is still only 21 but he has 17 senior caps and ought to be producing for us by now. He certainly has not brought his underage performances through to the senior team.

Against Wales IMO he was no more that a 5, 6 at best. One good ball through to Keane, but he got caught in possession too many times and showed he cannot track back when opponents full/wing backs go forward.

Against Brazil, again IMO similar game to against Wales. Had one chance to put Duff through but delayed his pass too long and Duff ended up offside. In saying that no shame in not performing against Brazil but Wales was a game where he could have sparkled but didn't.

I've said it before but I could not care less how he plays for Celtic, but when he plays for Ireland I want to see him be an 8, 9 or 10 every game. He is not there yet, not but a long way.

His performances in this WCQ campaign will show if he is the real deal or not. While Duff is still in the picture, I'm not sure if Trapattoni will find room for both of them is his team.

So you are judging kid that was playing in a team that was completely disorganised by a clown of a manager and completely lacking in any confidence.Is there any attacking player that has consistantly performed to an 8,9 or 10 for Ireland in the last couple of years. For example would you say that Robbie Keanes form at Spurs this season is completely irelevent because his performances for Ireland in the last campaign werent fantastic. Or maybe you havent watched him play for Spurs either because you have no interest in them.
It is ridiculous to ignore totally a players club form and then say because he hasnt performed to a consistant rating in international football he is over hyped.
Just as a matter of interest do you just ignore Celtics games in the Champions League or is it the whole competition?
24/03/2008, 8:24 PM
Superhoops

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

So you are judging kid that was playing in a team that was completely disorganised by a clown of a manager and completely lacking in any confidence.

Fair enough, but let's assume Trapattoni knows what he is doing and organises the team, if McGeady is in that team (and I have doubts he will, especially if Duff is picked), then we should expect him to deliver, especially if he is full of confidence playing for Celtic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

..Is there any attacking player that has consistantly performed to an 8,9 or 10 for Ireland in the last couple of years...

The short answer is No, but I am sure most of us on here want to see every player playing well for Ireland.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

..For example would you say that Robbie Keanes form at Spurs this season is completely irelevent because his performances for Ireland in the last campaign werent fantastic. Or maybe you havent watched him play for Spurs either because you have no interest in them.

I've seen Robbie playing several times for Spurs and it is frustrating to see him playing so well for them and not for us. One big difference is that Ramos and Jol before him did not hesitate to either drop him or take off if he wasn't playing well. Neither Kerr, Staunton or Givens ever considered it for us and one of Robbie's biggest problems playing for us is that he thinks he is untouchable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

..It is ridiculous to ignore totally a players club form and then say because he hasnt performed to a consistant rating in international football he is over hyped..

Is it not reasonable to expect a player in form for his club to produce it for his country, if not every game, then at least for most games? The point I'm making about McGeady is that many on here and several people I know who watch Celtic regularly have been raving about his club performances but for me when he has played for Ireland he has not lived up to the raving.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

.Just as a matter of interest do you just ignore Celtics games in the Champions League or is it the whole competition?

No, I watch the CL every night it is on, but when there is a choice of 3 or 4 games, Celtic would be down the order. Maybe if they ever got to the stage where they are the only game in town then I'm sure I would have a look, but that's hardly ever likely to happen.
24/03/2008, 8:41 PM
Razors left peg

Superhoops I think we can all agree that we want all the players playing to the highest level possible when they are playing for us and hopefully now with the new management team in place we have alot of hope for the future.I just think that the stick McGeady gets from alot of Irish fans is completely unfair on him because he seems to be singled out when none of the team bar Richard Dunne has performed at all recently. My point about his Celtic performances was that it shows the potential of the lad and I think most people would agree that he is probably one of our most naturally talented footballers at the moment. The lad was even singled out by Barcelona recently as their biggest threat when they were playing eachother, I dont think there are many other Irish players at the moment that would draw that sort of praise.It took Damien Duff a lot of years to develop into a consistant performer for us and personally I think McGeady has the talent to be as good if not better.
24/03/2008, 8:45 PM
Billsthoughts

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

.It took Damien Duff a lot of years to develop into a consistant performer for us and personally I think McGeady has the talent to be as good if not better.

Can we dispell this myth thats been thrown around on this thread a few times. Macarthy favoured Kilbane to Duff for reasons best known to himself. He never at ANY stage put in performances as poor as Mageadys.
24/03/2008, 8:55 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

Can we dispell this myth thats been thrown around on this thread a few times. Macarthy favoured Kilbane to Duff for reasons best known to himself. He never at ANY stage put in performances as poor as Mageadys.

so you are tellin me that Duff never played poorly and was anonymous in games for us earlier in his career... give me a break. Im Duffer biggest fan but I remember him being very inconsistant.
24/03/2008, 8:58 PM
tetsujin1979

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

Can we dispell this myth thats been thrown around on this thread a few times. Macarthy favoured Kilbane to Duff for reasons best known to himself. He never at ANY stage put in performances as poor as Mageadys.

I always thought it was because Kilbane was better at covering for Harte's shortcomings (i.e. pace) at left full, whereas with Duff on the left we were left very exposed. A Kilbane + Harte left side was more balanced than a Duff + Harte left side
We didn't really have an alternative to Harte at left full (plus ca change) and he was an asset from free kicks, so really couldn't be dropped. Duff was shoehorned into a role alongside Robbie Keane at a time when we didn't have that many quality strikers in the squad.
25/03/2008, 8:36 AM
BigmanCas

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

Can we dispell this myth thats been thrown around on this thread a few times. Macarthy favoured Kilbane to Duff for reasons best known to himself. He never at ANY stage put in performances as poor as Mageadys.

Give us a break Bill. You are so full of s*** it's unreal.
25/03/2008, 10:09 AM
gola11

I can't see why people are knocking McGeady. He's still only 21 and has a lot to learn especially on the defensive side of his game. Hopefully he's going to keep improving and become one of our most important players over the next few years. What annoyed me the most was so called fans chanting Hunt's name after about 15mins of the Czech Republic game last Sep. Although he was having a bad game, this did nothing for McGeady's confidence and therefore had a negative effect on the team.
25/03/2008, 11:16 AM
geysir

Duff could play at RM so it wasn't a Kilbane or Duff choice.
More times he replaced McAteer.
When brought on as a sub in a competitive game, say against Portugal away, Duff kept things tidy and simple.
McGeady is about the same age now as when Duff was used as a sub in the 2002 WCQ.
25/03/2008, 11:34 AM
tetsujin1979

Wrote this a while back comparing McGeady's career to date to Duff's at the same age - http://www.chatsoccer.eu/news/content/view/28/5/
25/03/2008, 12:03 PM
BigmanCas

Quote:

Originally Posted by gola11

I can't see why people are knocking McGeady. He's still only 21 and has a lot to learn especially on the defensive side of his game. Hopefully he's going to keep improving and become one of our most important players over the next few years. What annoyed me the most was so called fans chanting Hunt's name after about 15mins of the Czech Republic game last Sep. Although he was having a bad game, this did nothing for McGeady's confidence and therefore had a negative effect on the team.

I was at the game. It was purely and simply a disgrace. Then look what he did when he eventually did come on.
25/03/2008, 12:35 PM
Junior

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

Can we dispell this myth thats been thrown around on this thread a few times. Macarthy favoured Kilbane to Duff for reasons best known to himself. He never at ANY stage put in performances as poor as Mageadys.

Nope. I distinctly remember on a few occasions at Lansdowne, Duffer coming on as a sub and running around like a headless chicken. Can tquite recall the specific games (probably early 200/01ish). Unfortunately for this debate, chat forums were as Peter Kay would put it 'The Future' so we dont have a 134page thread to pull up from the archives but it happened.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

Wrote this a while back comparing McGeady's career to date to Duff's at the same age - http://www.chatsoccer.eu/news/content/view/28/5/

Decent article & comparison of the two players.

Obviously the same points are being covered time and time again here.

1) He's doing great stuff for Celtic this year - some Irish fans are interested, some dont care.
2) He's done nothing of note for Ireland so far & had a couple of particularly poor performances in Eastern Europe - Dont think anyone can dispute this, though with regards to the games against Czech/Slovaks - so did at least another 9 players!
3) Do we want McGeady to be a success for Ireland? - Yes, we need a player like him performing for us.
25/03/2008, 1:27 PM
geysir

We would be having the same debate over Duff at the time of the first 5 or 6 of the 2002 WCQ as is now happening with McGeady.
25/03/2008, 10:22 PM
Billsthoughts

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

I always thought it was because Kilbane was better at covering for Harte's shortcomings (i.e. pace) at left full, whereas with Duff on the left we were left very exposed. A Kilbane + Harte left side was more balanced than a Duff + Harte left side............

maybe so but the comparison with mageadys Ireland form doesnt really ring true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigmanCas

Give us a break Bill. You are so full of s*** it's unreal.

Well argued and balanced post there as always BMC. :confused:

Quote:

Originally Posted by gola11

What annoyed me the most was so called fans chanting Hunt's name after about 15mins of the Czech Republic game last Sep. Although he was having a bad game, this did nothing for McGeady's confidence and therefore had a negative effect on the team.

Mmmmmm...am sure he of all players has heard and dealt with worse.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junior

Nope. I distinctly remember on a few occasions at Lansdowne, Duffer coming on as a sub and running around like a headless chicken. Can tquite recall the specific games (probably early 200/01ish). Unfortunately for this debate,.

He was excellent against portugal at home. he was sub for Estonia. andorra?
I think your thinking of the qualifying campaign before that. I remember one home match he was getting stick from the crowd but cant remember which one it was. he was going up the wing and losing the ball time and time again. different to Mageadys just standing around and watching players run by him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

We would be having the same debate over Duff at the time of the first 5 or 6 of the 2002 WCQ as is now happening with McGeady.

Not really Duff was playing well for both club and country at the time.
26/03/2008, 12:27 AM
geysir

Quote:

Not really Duff was playing well for both club and country at the time.

Maybe we are talking about different players, I said for the first 5 or 6 games.
Duff was an unused sub against Holland away, came on as a sub against Estonia at home and Portugal away. 10 minutes against Cyprus, In our first 5 games he didn't do anything of note.
His first impact was when he came on as a sub for Keane at home to Portugal, age 22.
He started in the next game away to Estonia and did very well.
26/03/2008, 8:14 AM
Billsthoughts

Photographic memory there.
Macarthy had his favorites and picked them regardless of form. Duff was left out and used as sub despite good club form. Mageady has been played in most of the qualifiers and been rubbish.
26/03/2008, 8:31 AM
eirebhoy

SPL Assists:
http://www.scotprem.premiumtv.co.uk/...~20073,00.html

He has 18 in total. Fantastic for a player that doesn't take set pieces.
26/03/2008, 9:44 AM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

Photographic memory there.
Macarthy had his favorites and picked them regardless of form. Duff was left out and used as sub despite good club form. Mageady has been played in most of the qualifiers and been rubbish.

Thank you for acknowledging that Duff was left out/used as a sub sparingly and did not show his spark until his sub appearance in the 6th game of the 2002 qualifiers ;)
Considering that that was a successfull campaign against 2 top teams, McCarthy managed the campaign quite well considering the choices he made. Duff eventually made his break due to circumstances of Keane getting injured and grabbed the stage.
It's hypothetical how Duff would have done if he was used more earlier on or if McGeady was blooded in slower as a sub.
McGeady will be the same age as Duff was then by the time of the Qualifiers in September.
Age isn't everything, the main thing is whether a player is still making the improvements needed in his game.
We have a better squad with having McGeady in it.
26/03/2008, 1:53 PM
Junior

Quote:

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

SPL Assists:
http://www.scotprem.premiumtv.co.uk/...~20073,00.html

He has 18 in total. Fantastic for a player that doesn't take set pieces.

It says 15 in the link and I think Jan VofH quoted 20 after the game - either way its pretty good.

McGeady appears to be the 2nd highest (McDonald is 1st) Celtic shooter as well using that database, which surprises me.
26/03/2008, 2:00 PM
Junior

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

He was excellent against portugal at home. he was sub for Estonia. andorra?
I think your thinking of the qualifying campaign before that. I remember one home match he was getting stick from the crowd but cant remember which one it was. he was going up the wing and losing the ball time and time again. different to Mageadys just standing around and watching players run by him.

As I said, Im not exactly sure of which campaign without going back and trying to reactivate the memory! But either way it was at the start of Duffs international career, the same as McGeady. We were actually doing okish at the time as well, compared to the dysfunctional team that McGeady has been a part of.

You seem to imply that Duffs poor performances were in some way better than McGeadys? yet if Aiden was mindlessly running round like an eejit and losing the ball time and time again, Im not sure you would be so generous.

Anyway, personally I think the comparison is a fair one and I hope we see significant improvement in confidence and performances over the next qualifying campaign, which I think we have already started to see in the Wales and Brasil game albeit conservative.

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