Ireland line-up under Trapattoni

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04/03/2008, 11:09 PM
irishfan86

I don't know if they're that attacking to be honest. Reid and Emerton/Dunn are very responsible and don't get exposed too often, while the wingers are free to join the attack quite a bit.

Contrast that to teams that give wingers and one of the central midfielders freedom to attack as much as they want and they aren't the most offensive team out there.

I'd call them a good balance between offense and defense, but not an out and out offensive team. If you watch their matches they're quite structured, they remind me quite a bit like Everton in their style of play.
05/03/2008, 7:39 AM
eirebhoy

For me it is very attacking and it obviously works. 2 proper attacking wide players and 2 strikers. I don't think Andy Reid is any more attacking than Dunn so I'd like to see himself and S.Reid play together.
05/03/2008, 7:54 AM
dr_peepee

The overall question is not just about the two midfeilders though it's about the package. For instance, flanked by Duff and McGeady, I don't think Reid and Reid would work. Bentley is a different offering to Pedersen, Duff and McGeady as a wide player so it's not comparing apples with apples. The same as Emerton has played a lot at Right Back so I'd say he has a little more defensively to offer than Andy Reid.

My overall opinion on Andy Reid is that he's all about football. He wants the ball and wants to use it progressively. I don't think he should constrained by the tactics, positioning & discipline required to play a deeper role, particularly when the further back you go the less insulation you have from his lack of engine, physique and poor tackling.
05/03/2008, 3:34 PM
Supreme feet

Stephen Ireland on the right? He's a different type of player to Duff or McGeady, and he could cut inside when prudent. Gus Poyet used to play out wide for Chelsea, but never stayed there. As did Lee Bowyer during his happy times at Leeds. I'm never sure about playing two out-and-out wide players in a 4-4-2.

As for the middle, the Reid-Reid partnership should at least be tried in one of the friendlies. if it doesn't work, get a more solid player in instead of Andy. Carsley for the (very) short term, hopefully one of the younger lads will step up. Hope springs eternal.

Anybody know anything about Darron Gibson? Haven't heard much of him lately, I had high hopes for him after seeing him against Denmark and for United reserves. Seems to have the physique, composure and intelligence to be a good midfielder.
05/03/2008, 10:23 PM
irishfan86

Quote:

Originally Posted by Supreme feet

Anybody know anything about Darron Gibson? Haven't heard much of him lately, I had high hopes for him after seeing him against Denmark and for United reserves. Seems to have the physique, composure and intelligence to be a good midfielder.

I watched a couple of Man United's pre-season games and he looked talented but sloppy in possession. He gave the ball away quite a bit against Asian club sides that were not solid at all- probably mid-championship level teams.

That said, he was always driving forward and not afraid to shoot from distance, something we've been sorely lacking in centre midfield lately.

He's on loan at Wolves lately- I saw a couple of his games when he first went there and he was being played wide right- he doesn't have the pace to play as a right midfielder, he's built for the centre....basically he looked crap on the right.

Hard to judge how good he is or will be, but I've got my doubts.
07/03/2008, 10:52 AM
lionelhutz

What is Irelands best starting line up on the current form of our players with their clubs?? For arguments sake, you can include Finnan, O'Brien, Ireland, etc.

Mine would be:

Given

Finnan Dunne O'Brien Kilbane

McGeady S.Reid A.Reid Hunt

Ireland

Keane

Doyle is playing OK with Reading but hasn't scored for an eternity. Duff has not played anywhere near his best since returning from injury.

I suppose there's a case for Carsley to be included on club form but S.Reid and Ireland are playing very well for their clubs and A.Reid is starting to play to form with Sunderland
07/03/2008, 11:00 AM
paul_oshea

ireland isn't playing as much not johnson is back and likely wont be for a while either.
07/03/2008, 11:07 AM
eirebhoy

Johnson has only been back one game and they both started. Johnson is a central midfielder anyway. Ireland has played all but 1 or 2 of the games he's been available for this season. On current form Elano will be back to the bench before Ireland if Castillo is due a start.
07/03/2008, 11:10 AM
dr_peepee

Is Ireland being groomed at city for that Elano role do you think???
07/03/2008, 11:27 AM
ifk101

If any players are available our best line-up IMO is either;

Given
Finnan Dunne A. O'Brien JOSH
Carsley
McGeady Ireland A. Reid Duff
Doyle

or

Given
Finnan Dunne A.O'Brien JOSH
Ireland Carsley A. Reid Duff
Doyle Keane

I thought we looked a good side when we played a 4-5-1 formation under Stan. The problem with that formation is where do you put Keane and we can't leave out Keane.

As for a 4-4-2 formation it is hard to know what our best partnership in the centre of midfield is. I'd like to have S. Reid in there but he's generally injured so you can't count on his longterm availability. Carsley can't pass the ball but he's our best player at breaking up the opposition play and we need a player that can do that in the side. I don't think Ireland is strong enough for the centre of midfield in a 4-4-2 formation so it's nip and tuck between him and McGeady for the right of midfield. Trapattoni will need to figure out quickly what our best options are at centre half and centre field - I think the injury proneness of certain players should also bear heavily on his thinking.
07/03/2008, 11:27 AM
paul_oshea

Quote:

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Johnson has only been back one game and they both started. Johnson is a central midfielder anyway. Ireland has played all but 1 or 2 of the games he's been available for this season. On current form Elano will be back to the bench before Ireland if Castillo is due a start.

Ive been having a good chat to a city fan at work the last few days ( he reckons there are lots of young Irish lads there too coming through some quite young ) he reckons Ireland will be on the bench now that johnson is back and elano will be playing. I did notice he had been substituted in a few of thelast games too.
07/03/2008, 12:16 PM
tetsujin1979

Quote:

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

ireland isn't playing as much not johnson is back and likely wont be for a while either.

I don't see why, they were both starting in the same team before Johnson got injured.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Ireland has played all but 1 or 2 of the games he's been available for this season

From http://www.chatsoccer.net/irishabroa...ry?teamID=1718
Ireland has missed five games for City this season, 3 of those were because he was suspended. He's started every other game, apart from 2 when he came on as a sub

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr_peepee

Is Ireland being groomed at city for that Elano role do you think???

Elano is still only 26, he'll be around for a long time yet. But, yeah if Ireland improves the defensive side of his game, he could play a little deeper in midfield, where Elano is now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

he reckons there are lots of young Irish lads there too coming through some quite young

City's Academy side beat Sunderland 2-0 in the semi final of the FA Youth Cup last night, Donal McDemott set up the second goal.
From the reserves there's Karl Moore, Ian Daly, Michael Daly (not related), Paul Marshall, and Garry Breen

Quote:

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

he reckons Ireland will be on the bench now that johnson is back and elano will be playing. I did notice he had been substituted in a few of thelast games too.

Most teams have figured out how to mark/kick Elano out of the game now, but Ireland hasn't come in for that kind of treatment yet.
With everyone fit and available, I'd say the City midfield will line up something like this

Code:

Hamann Johnson/Fernandez Elano Petrov Ireland

with Ireland coming off the right into the centre
07/03/2008, 12:17 PM
livehead1

Quote:

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

Ive been having a good chat to a city fan at work the last few days ( he reckons there are lots of young Irish lads there too coming through some quite young ) he reckons Ireland will be on the bench now that johnson is back and elano will be playing. I did notice he had been substituted in a few of thelast games too.

Well I doubt you mate knows sh*t. Elano has been terrible for the last few months, ever since he came back from international match for Brazil. He'll get plenty of football.
07/03/2008, 1:14 PM
paul_oshea

Quote:

Originally Posted by livehead1

Well I doubt you mate knows sh*t. Elano has been terrible for the last few months, ever since he came back from international match for Brazil. He'll get plenty of football.

I never said he was my mate. Time will tell though alright....
07/03/2008, 2:04 PM
dr_peepee

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

Elano is still only 26, he'll be around for a long time yet. But, yeah if Ireland improves the defensive side of his game, he could play a little deeper in midfield, where Elano is now.

Didn't realise he was that young...
07/03/2008, 3:47 PM
eirebhoy

I was just thinking. Lack of leaders got mentioned a few times with our current set of players. Given, Dunne, Carsley, S.Reid, Kilbane, Keane and Hunt are all top 3 in the list for captain at their clubs. Andy Reid was Charlton captain and will probably take that role with Sunderland if he's as influential for them. Andy O'Brien captained Bolton last night if we can include him. Not bad for what could potentially fill 9 of the 11 spots in the team for the qualifiers.
07/03/2008, 4:01 PM
kingdom hoop

Fair point Eirebhoy, but how many of those mentioned strike you as great characters? It's great to have plenty of guys who are used to speaking up in the dressing-room, but when we need it I can't see any of our current crop really standing up and rallying the troops. I suppose it'll have be more participatory democratic than autocratic. The autocrat option did work well in the recent past though!

A general lack of strong characters strikes me as a current theme in world football though to be fair. Does an insulated lifestyle and too much money make people a bit soft?
09/03/2008, 12:25 PM
shakermaker1982

If I was sending out a team tomorrow against Georgia away from home (assuming Given is fit and we can tempt Andy O'Brien back) it would look something like this:

Given

S Kelly Dunne A O'Brien O'Shea

Hunt S Reid A Reid Duff

Ireland

Keane

Subs:

McGeady
Doyle
Carsley - to defend a lead with 15 minutes to go
Long
Kilbane
Keeper

I don't think we have the players (particularly in MF) to play an attacking 4-3-3 like Manchester United (and to some extent Chelsea) and I'm somewhat reluctant to leave Robbie up there on his own but S Ireland likes to break forward and support.

Whatever happens I hope the Trap picks players on form/merit. Hopefully O'Halloran gets some starts at A Villa early next season and starts making a serious challenge for the LB slot.
17/03/2008, 2:56 PM
eagleforlife

Given
Foley Dunne O'Shea Kilbane
Scannell Carsley A. Reid S. Hunt
Keane Morrison
27/03/2008, 2:49 PM
eirebhoy

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnpark

A 4-2-3-1. Ive never seen any manager use this before. :eek:

I see van Basten said yesterday that he's going to also play 4-2-3-1 with Holland. You could say England played that formation too last night.

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