Everton and Liverpool discussion

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Originally Posted by reder

Everton manager David Moyes is set to capture Middlesbrough striker Yakubu and Portuguese playmaker Manuel Fernandes for up to £19m.

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This is from the BBC rumours today, and reading around i think "set to capture" is quite the overstatement given your recent transfer activity.

Regarding Fernandes, questions must be asked of any player who can't cut it at Portsmouth.

Yakubu on the other hand, would be an ideal striker for your "welly it" brand of football and could prove to be quite a coup. That is of course, if Boro accept your offer of 10 grams of jelly babies and a large white chocolate Toblerone.

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Pompy didnt sign him because of the price tag , He was on loan at everton for the second part of the season and was a first team regular so we know how good he is not quite arteta but with a bit of work he could be that good . So no there is no risk bar the dodgy agent deal ala tevez he has where the club own 50% and his agent owns the other 50%


I think Yakubu has a 10 mill clause in his contract ive wanted us to sign him for a few years now so im very happy with both players being linked ill be even happier if they sign .

Anyway a formal bid has been lodged for Manny and a enquiry has been made about Yak

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Originally Posted by anto1208

Anyway a formal bid has been lodged for Manny

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I wouldn't bother with him, he hasn't been all that good since he left the Stone Roses.

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Originally Posted by anto1208

I think Yakubu has a 10 mill clause in his contract ive wanted us to sign him for a few years now

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same here, smashing forward. Strong as an ox and a great shot.

Fernandes would be a great signing too - a touch of class.

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Originally Posted by SkStu

same here, smashing forward. Strong as an ox and a great shot.

Fernandes would be a great signing too - a touch of class.

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yakubu demands transfer :D

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...e_id=1779&ct=5

Well it didnt take too much thinking as id my mind made up a long time ago and all my questions have been answered , i think a no vote will rule out the kirby move alltogether and just give us less options to consider .


Here is my yes vote going in the post today :)

Funny that, I saw a different ballot paper....

http://img487.imageshack.us/img487/4254/efcqb8.jpg

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Originally Posted by Roadend

Funny that, I saw a different ballot paper....

http://img487.imageshack.us/img487/4254/efcqb8.jpg

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That is funny going to all that trouble and then spelling too wrong :p

Fiddlesticks

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Originally Posted by Roadend

I wouldn't bother with him, he hasn't been all that good since he left the Stone Roses.

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:D brilliant

Predictions for tomorrow people.

The mighty reds will start off with our usual dodgy start given the influx on new talent and I predict and 1-1 draw against the fake brummies. I dont see any reason why our form away from home against the middle tier of the PL will improve until after xmas.

Unfortunately most of the people are still on hols (I presume) and the people's club havent sold out their game tomorrow ;) against Wigan but I predict a 2-0 win for the toffees. The penis might "win" a penalty in front of the Gwladys.

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Originally Posted by reder

Predictions for tomorrow people.

The mighty reds will start off with our usual dodgy start given the influx on new talent and I predict and 1-1 draw against the fake brummies. I dont see any reason why our form away from home against the middle tier of the PL will improve until after xmas.

Unfortunately most of the people are still on hols (I presume) and the people's club havent sold out their game tomorrow ;) against Wigan but I predict a 2-0 win for the toffees. The penis might "win" a penalty in front of the Gwladys.

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If you're talking about AJ, it would make a refreshing change from last season if he was awarded a penalty without having to be shot first

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Originally Posted by anto1208

we know how good he is not quite arteta but with a bit of work he could be that good

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As good as Arteta, which means he'll reach the dazzling level of just above average premiership midfielder with also ran club. Sign him up quick, he's got Everton written all over him

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Originally Posted by reder

Predictions for tomorrow people.

The mighty reds will start off with our usual dodgy start given the influx on new talent and I predict and 1-1 draw against the fake brummies. I dont see any reason why our form away from home against the middle tier of the PL will improve until after xmas.

Unfortunately most of the people are still on hols (I presume) and the people's club havent sold out their game tomorrow ;) against Wigan but I predict a 2-0 win for the toffees. The penis might "win" a penalty in front of the Gwladys.

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Liverpool should beat Villa, anything less is a bad result. I'm expecting a decent win and a clean sheet.
Everton should beat Wigan, as Wigan are cack and will probably go down this season.

Good to see we're back to talking about football.

Tough match at Villa tomorrow, followed by the even tougher trip to Toulouse (:eek:3.30ko:eek:), before coming home to face Chelsea again.

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Originally Posted by 4tothefloor

As good as Arteta, which means he'll reach the dazzling level of just above average premiership midfielder with also ran club. Sign him up quick, he's got Everton written all over him


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check the stats best spanish player on merseyside

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Originally Posted by anto1208

check the stats best spanish player on merseyside

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Yea that's why he's the first name on the Spanish national teamsheet. Good man Anto :rolleyes:

Beat Villa 2-1, as Stevie "over-rated" :confused::rolleyes: G comes up with the goods to save Carragher's embarassment.

On the penalty decision, it was a peno, but I wonder how Mike "blind" Reilly managed to see that handball, and fail to see Carvalho's much clearer handball at Anfield a couple of years ago?? Oh sorry, the difference is we were defending today. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by 4tothefloor

As good as Arteta, which means he'll reach the dazzling level of just above average premiership midfielder with also ran club. Sign him up quick, he's got Everton written all over him.

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Arteta is the most under rated midfielder in the Premiership.

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Originally Posted by 4tothefloor

Yea that's why he's the first name on the Spanish national teamsheet. Good man Anto :s:

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you can roll your eyes all you like you can't argue with facts (not that it ever stops you :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:)



Top premiership players

1 D Drogba Chelsea 628
2 C Ronaldo Man Utd 617
3 D Berbatov Tottenham 611
4 W Rooney Man Utd 580
5 F Lampard Chelsea 572
6 M Arteta Everton 567
7 F Fabregas Arsenal 565
8 G Barry Aston Villa 561
9 B McCarthy Blackburn 535
10 G Agbonlahor Aston Villa 517
Last updated: Tue, May 15 2007


Barclays Premier League
Top 5 midfielders
Name Index Score Index Rank Team
1 C Ronaldo 617 2 Man Utd
2 F Lampard 572 5 Chelsea
3 M Arteta 567 6 Everton
4 F Fabregas 565 7 Arsenal
5 G Barry 561 8 Aston Villa

Forget about Arteta. You want stats, I'll give you some real stats :

League Champions - 18
1900-01 1905-06 1921-22 1922-23 1946-47
1963-64 1965-66 1972-73 1975-76 1976-77
1978-79 1979-80 1981-82 1982-83 1983-84
1985-86 1987-88 1989-90

Football Association Challenge Cup Winners - 7
1964-65 1973-74 1985-86 1988-89 1991-92
2000-01 2005-06

League Cup Winners - 7
1980-81 1981-82 1982-83 1983-84 1994-95
2000-01 2002-03

European Cup Winners 5
1976-77 1977-78 1980-81 1983-84 2004-05

UEFA Cup Winners 3
1972-73 1975-76 2000-01

European Super Cup Winners 3
1977 2001 2005

Super Cup Winners 1
1985-86

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Originally Posted by 4tothefloor

As good as Arteta, which means he'll reach the dazzling level of just above average premiership midfielder with also ran club. Sign him up quick, he's got Everton written all over him

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Anybody who doubts how good Arteta is simply doesn't have a clue about football. The man is a magican and would walk into any team in the league. Just read any of Everton's match reports from the weekend to see how good he is or better still, actually watch him play.

The only bad thing for Everton is that we rely on him too much, hopefully we'll sign fernandes this week to help him out.

Arteta is indeed a very good player, sadly wasted at everton though:p

Like Arteta a lot, don't think he's quite top notch though.

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Originally Posted by KildareFan

The man is a magican and would walk into any team in the league.

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By magican are you referring to the fact that he made the 2003 season in which the Gers won 3 trophies vanish from the minds of the Rangers management and fans. :confused:

He was then sold by Rangers after that "magical" season in which the ended up with no silverware to whoever offered the best price.

And out of all the liverpool fans here saying he isnt that good etc how many have actually watched him play for any length last season ? id say 3 or 4 games at most and 2 of those would have been the derby matches .How can you argue with people that have watched him play 30+ games :confused:

Look at the stats he is the 3rd best midfielder in the prem league so if Arteta isnt top notch just how far off the top are Gerrard Alonso macherano and sissoko ..... dont forget Harry kewel :p

I'm not sure how accurate those "stats" are, for instance they say Ronaldo is the best in the league mainly when playing against the weaker teams which most of the prem is made up of, but fails to mention how he goes missing when he is really needed in big games.
Anyway my point is i dont think many liverpool fans would swap Gerrard for Arteta, and i personally wouldn't swap Mascherano Alonso or Sissoko for him either

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Originally Posted by anto1208

you can roll your eyes all you like you can't argue with facts (not that it ever stops you)



Top premiership players

1 D Drogba Chelsea 628
2 C Ronaldo Man Utd 617
3 D Berbatov Tottenham 611
4 W Rooney Man Utd 580
5 F Lampard Chelsea 572
6 M Arteta Everton 567
7 F Fabregas Arsenal 565
8 G Barry Aston Villa 561
9 B McCarthy Blackburn 535
10 G Agbonlahor Aston Villa 517
Last updated: Tue, May 15 2007


Barclays Premier League
Top 5 midfielders
Name Index Score Index Rank Team
1 C Ronaldo 617 2 Man Utd
2 F Lampard 572 5 Chelsea
3 M Arteta 567 6 Everton
4 F Fabregas 565 7 Arsenal
5 G Barry 561 8 Aston Villa

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You can roll out the stats all you like but Arteta is not better than any of Liverpool's central midfielders. He is not better than the likes of Michael Essien either, who also fails to make the top players. And the fact that Gareth Barry and Agbonlahor, who didn't even start for Villa on Saturday, are amongst the top players there tells you all you need to know about quoting stats :rolleyes: A load of rubbish.....

Arteta is a decent player, he is a cut above your average premiership midfielder, but he is not in the top bracket of players. And he ain't ever going to reach that level at Everton. If he was that good (a) He wouldn't be at Everton - a bigger premiership or Spanish club would have him signed ages ago and (b) He'd be starting for Spain. Why isn't he starting for Spain, or even making the Spanish squad? Because he's not as good as Alonso or Fabregas....

The stats are about about as revelant as the FIFA World Rankings.

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Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse

The stats are about about as revelant as the FIFA World Rankings.

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Yea because basing a players rating on what they do on the pitch is a stupid idea. how do you propose you rate the players , another gem from the liverpool fans :D


amazing the way we had a lovely summer of talking about footy untill 4to the floor popped back in and started having pops at everton yet ye will be the ones to tell me to stop going on about liverpool oh the hypocrasy . Im going back to ignoring it .

So back to the blues, Manny flew in last night, he is on merseyside to finalise the deal in the next 24 hours , should be with the rest of the squad in london then tonight for the spurs game .

Hoping to see Pienaar getting a run out looked good at the weekend Baines is still injured and fingers crossed Jags comes in for the donkey Neville .

I hope it will line up like this
howard
hibbert yobo stubbs lescott
Carsley
VDM arteta jags pienaar
AJ

but ive a feeling moyes will go with the same back line but with Carsley neville in CM and osman and arteta on the wings big vic and AJ up front

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Originally Posted by 4tothefloor

You can roll out the stats all you like but Arteta is not better than any of Liverpool's central midfielders. He is not better than the likes of Michael Essien either, who also fails to make the top players. And the fact that Gareth Barry and Agbonlahor, who didn't even start for Villa on Saturday, are amongst the top players there tells you all you need to know about quoting stats :rolleyes: A load of rubbish.....

Arteta is a decent player, he is a cut above your average premiership midfielder, but he is not in the top bracket of players. And he ain't ever going to reach that level at Everton. If he was that good (a) He wouldn't be at Everton - a bigger premiership or Spanish club would have him signed ages ago and (b) He'd be starting for Spain. Why isn't he starting for Spain, or even making the Spanish squad? Because he's not as good as Alonso or Fabregas....

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Arteta isn't a central midfielder, he played handful of games in the centre when he first signed so if you think he is a central midfielder, you can't have seen him play very often!! It's only since he moved to the wings that he has has really shone. Left or right, it doesn't matter,he is is at his most effective coming in from the wings.

As for tonight, Moyes will definitely go back to a 4-5-1 with the only change being Jagielka coming in for Victor i would imagine. I'd rather Jagielka replaced Hibbert who was crap on Saturday and have somebody like Pienaar play just off AJ.

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Originally Posted by KildareFan

Arteta isn't a central midfielder, he played handful of games in the centre when he first signed so if you think he is a central midfielder, you can't have seen him play very often!! It's only since he moved to the wings that he has has really shone. Left or right, it doesn't matter,he is is at his most effective coming in from the wings.

As for tonight, Moyes will definitely go back to a 4-5-1 with the only change being Jagielka coming in for Victor i would imagine. I'd rather Jagielka replaced Hibbert who was crap on Saturday and have somebody like Pienaar play just off AJ.

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I know poor old hibbert is getting caught a lot lately but he is a great tackler one of the best its his distrabution that lets him down but ive watched jags play at right back as well and he was worse , he is a midfielder really , id prefere if jags came in for Neville who can shoot cant pass cant tackle

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Originally Posted by anto1208

I know poor old hibbert is getting caught a lot lately but he is a great tackler one of the best its his distrabution that lets him down but ive watched jags play at right back as well and he was worse , he is a midfielder really , id prefere if jags came in for Neville who can shoot cant pass cant tackle

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If that's the case, i'd prefer Neville at right back than Hibbert. All everton fans have been saying for a long time that Hibbert is excellent except for his passing but passing is a huge part of football, the amout of moves that break down when the ball reaches him crossing the halfway line is ridiculous. Neville is a much better crosser of the ball created a few goals last year like AJ's excellent at White Hart Lane last year

Anto here's a question for you. Do you think Gabby Agbonlahor is the 10th best player in the Premiership.

If you answer (A - Yes) then you know nothing about football.

If you answer (B- No) then you will disprove the very point you are trying to make.

Stats show you how many times someone passed or shot or how many yards he ran etc. If you think that gives you the whole picture you should give the FAI a call. They are full of people who don't "get" football.

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Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse

Anto here's a question for you. Do you think Gabby Agbonlahor is the 10th best player in the Premiership.

If you answer (A - Yes) then you know nothing about football.

If you answer (B- No) then you will disprove the very point you are trying to make.

Stats show you how many times someone passed or shot or how many yards he ran etc. If you think that gives you the whole picture you should give the FAI a call. They are full of people who don't "get" football.

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here was me thinking running passing and shooting where important parts of the game , oh silly me so what is it that makes you a good footballer? its not what you do on the pitch its what you dont do :rolleyes::confused:

clowns

The truth hurts eh Anto, anyone using Opto stats to try and argue how good a player is has shot himself in the foot before he's even started :D

Care to answer the question?

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Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse

The truth hurts eh Anto, anyone using Opto stats to try and argue how good a player is has shot himself in the foot before he's even started :D

Care to answer the question?

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I wouldnt have seen enough of gabby to know how good he is clearly you have watched a lot of villa games are therefor you are better able to judge , but i would say looking at the table it seems to be pretty acurate

ie
1 D Drogba Top scorer
2 C Ronaldo player of the season
3 D Berbatov spurs best player
4 W Rooney fantastic player
5 F Lampard fantastic player
6 M Arteta genius
7 F Fabregas genius
8 G Barry
9 B McCarthy 18goals in his first year
10 G Agbonlahor

the only two i wouldnt know much about are the villa boys but to score so highly in a below par team they must have played well .

But to answer your question i dont use the stats to pick my best players but i am able to call on them to back up my point of view.


Why dont you answer the question on how do you rate a player ?

is it if he plays for a top club ?

in that case liverpool have no top players and john o shea and darren fletcher are top players so thats not a good method .

Is it because he plays for the international side as 4tothefloor suggests ?

in that case ledly king is better than Carra:eek: im sure if i checked a certain other thread id find ye argueing against that very point .

Stats ?

No you cant use stats to prove how well they played

im looking foward to finding out your method of judging players ability without watching them play or using stats , perhaps you know so much about football that you can just tell a great player by looking at there name .

Anto, I read the first couple of lines and I can see you're shirking so I can't even be bothered reading the rest of your post mate. It's taken you 2 hours to come back and you still can't answer.

Its really quite simple. Do you think Agbonlahor is the 10th best player in the Premiership? If not you've shot your own argument down.

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Originally Posted by anto1208

I wouldnt have seen enough of gabby to know how good he is clearly you have watched a lot of villa games are therefor you are better able to judge , but i would say looking at the table it seems to be pretty acurate

ie
1 D Drogba Top scorer
2 C Ronaldo player of the season
3 D Berbatov spurs best player
4 W Rooney fantastic player
5 F Lampard fantastic player
6 M Arteta genius
7 F Fabregas genius
8 G Barry
9 B McCarthy 18goals in his first year
10 G Agbonlahor

the only two i wouldnt know much about are the villa boys but to score so highly in a below par team they must have played well .

But to answer your question i dont use the stats to pick my best players but i am able to call on them to back up my point of view.


Why dont you answer the question on how do you rate a player ?

is it if he plays for a top club ?

in that case liverpool have no top players and john o shea and darren fletcher are top players so thats not a good method .

Is it because he plays for the international side as 4tothefloor suggests ?

in that case ledly king is better than Carra:eek: im sure if i checked a certain other thread id find ye argueing against that very point .

Stats ?

No you cant use stats to prove how well they played

im looking foward to finding out your method of judging players ability without watching them play or using stats , perhaps you know so much about football that you can just tell a great player by looking at there name .

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Even you admit the stats are wrong. If ronaldo was player of the season why is he only number 2. By that logic Chelsea won the league last season

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Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse

Anto, I read the first couple of lines and I can see you're shirking so I can't even be bothered reading the rest of your post mate. It's taken you 2 hours to come back and you still can't answer.

Its really quite simple. Do you think Agbonlahor is the 10th best player in the Premiership? If not you've shot your own argument down.

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A) I HAVE OTHER THINGS TO DO BESIDE ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS
B) IF YOU HAD READ PAST THE 2ND LINE YOU WOULD HAVE SEEN THIS

But to answer your question i dont use the stats to pick my best players but i am able to call on them to back up my point of view.

now how about you answer the question ? you have 2 hours ( just to be fair !!)

You use the stats as proof that Arteta is class and then you say " I don't use stats to pick the best players"......

I really don't want to waste any more time on this. Accept you've boobed and move on, it happens to the best of us ;)

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Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse

You use the stats as proof that Arteta is class and then you say " I don't use stats to pick the best players"......

I really don't want to waste any more time on this. Accept you've boobed and move on, it happens to the best of us ;)

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HAHA BRILLIANT you should be a politician did you go to bertie’s school on dodging questions

why dont you answer the question anyway just for the laugh id love to know how to judge a player by your methods