League of Ireland in Europe 2014

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28/08/2014, 12:18 PM
A N Mouse

Quote:

Originally Posted by bennocelt

Sorry not a hope:) Ludogorets had an amazing run last season, and knocked out a few big hitters in the Europa, and BATE are very well funded. 40th in the Europe for the LOI is about right I think, the LOI has gone backward in years while these leagues have improved steadily.

How exactly has the league gone backwards?

How exactly is having four competive teams worse than one, or two, team(s) going on a great run?

This year was the third best (and the other two had only three teams) points wise.
Sure we're back at same position as end of 03/04, but if the progress of this year can be repeated with some consistency (maybe not every year, but should be the minimum standard we aspire to) then we're in a better position going forward.
28/08/2014, 12:38 PM
El-Pietro

Quote:

Originally Posted by GypsyBlackCat

Drogheda almost knocked Malmo out last season. I know Cork knocked them out a few years ago but that was back 2005. As for BATE and APOEL (didn't Cork knock them out in the CL?) it just goes to show that if a LoI club can break into the groups stages they can be set-up for life! Not so long ago if one of of our clubs got any of them you'd fancy are chances!

Malmo was 2005 in the Intertoto Cup. 3-1 and 1-0 to City. Went on to knock out NEC Nijmejgen (0-0 and 1-0) before losing to Nantes (1-3 and 1-1) in the Quarter Finals.
We played Apollon Limassol, not APOEL, in the Champions League in 2006, we won 1-0 at the Cross (Billy Woods) and drew 1-1 in Cyprus (Dan Murray header to tie the match and win the tie)
28/08/2014, 12:40 PM
pineapple stu

Quote:

Originally Posted by A N Mouse

How exactly has the league gone backwards?

We were ranked 29th in Europe five years ago, and now we're 40th?

Not beating Dutch or Swedish teams like we used to.

I think it's a fair enough comment.
28/08/2014, 2:10 PM
nigel-harps1954

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

We were ranked 29th in Europe five years ago, and now we're 40th?

Not beating Dutch or Swedish teams like we used to.

I think it's a fair enough comment.

Arguably getting tougher draws than back then? Easy to rise up the rankings when playing first round qualifying rather than entering at second round. Not exactly getting hammered by Welsh teams anymore either.
28/08/2014, 2:23 PM
bennocelt

Quote:

Originally Posted by A N Mouse

How exactly has the league gone backwards?

How exactly is having four competive teams worse than one, or two, team(s) going on a great run?

This year was the third best (and the other two had only three teams) points wise.
Sure we're back at same position as end of 03/04, but if the progress of this year can be repeated with some consistency (maybe not every year, but should be the minimum standard we aspire to) then we're in a better position going forward.

The standard the last few years hasnt been great in all honesty. Dundalk were great this year, sure, but if you look at some of those teams that LOI clubs were beating a few years ago and now look at them? The UEFA stats dont lie.

By the way I would love if LOI teams improved, just that we have differing opinions on what constitutes progress:)
28/08/2014, 3:26 PM
nigel-harps1954

Quote:

Originally Posted by bennocelt

The standard the last few years hasnt been great in all honesty. Dundalk were great this year, sure, but if you look at some of those teams that LOI clubs were beating a few years ago and now look at them? The UEFA stats dont lie.

By the way I would love if LOI teams improved, just that we have differing opinions on what constitutes progress:)

Maybe other national associations have actually invested in their leagues, thus making them much stronger?
28/08/2014, 3:28 PM
bennocelt

Quote:

Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954

Maybe other national associations have actually invested in their leagues, thus making them much stronger?

I agree. And then people wonder why our national team is so bad
28/08/2014, 3:40 PM
Mr A

I think it's as much about the lack of well qualified coaches than investment in the league itself. We're just not producing the players.

Posted on this a while ago- after pieces described by Junior here: http://foot.ie/threads/173000-Trap-O...=1#post1708600 http://foot.ie/threads/173000-Trap-O...=1#post1708693

ratio's of UEFA qualified coaches to active players

Spain 1:17
Italy 1:48
France 1:96
Germany 1:150
Greece 1:135
England 1:812

For Ireland the best figure I came up with was 1276:1. As pointed out at the time, many young footballers never meet a proper coach until they're already well through their development years.

We may be improving, but other countries have been and continue to improve faster.
28/08/2014, 5:51 PM
pineapple stu

Quote:

Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954

Arguably getting tougher draws than back then? Easy to rise up the rankings when playing first round qualifying rather than entering at second round. Not exactly getting hammered by Welsh teams anymore either.

Aberystwyth? Banga? Jeunesse as a seed? Easiest qualifying draw ever for the LoI this season.

Anyway, if the draws have been rejigged and you drop by getting a bye into round 1, that'll go for all countries. We've still dropped from 29th to 40th when compared to the other countries playing in the exact same tournament.

Worth noting that two Cypriot teams have put out two Russian teams in the Europa league today. Apollon Limassol won 4-1 away to Lokomotiv Moscow. (To put that in context, the other Russian team just knocked out Real Sociedad) That's three Cypriot teams in the groups (including the CL), with the fourth just 2-1 down against Spurs. We need some of what they're having.

Edit - shut my mouth. Dinamo Moscow score deep, deep into extratime (livescore showing into the 11th minute now?) to put Omonia out. Still, what are they doing that we can do?
28/08/2014, 8:07 PM
ger121

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Edit - shut my mouth. Dinamo Moscow score deep, deep into extratime (livescore showing into the 11th minute now?) to put Omonia out. Still, what are they doing that we can do?

Well Cypriots are going to matches for one and Wealthy Cypriots are investing in clubs. Neither of which happens here. Stating the obvious I know!
28/08/2014, 9:16 PM
ger121

Now Dundalk if you're going to get a fine. Make sure it's worth it!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwJf1lSIQAA2DjL.jpg:large
28/08/2014, 11:20 PM
MeathDrog

That's an impressive banner. Fair dues.

They'll get done for racism against capitalist pigs.
29/08/2014, 1:00 AM
gufcfan

As impressive as that banner is, it makes them look like fools for ridiculing UEFA when they went by the book.
29/08/2014, 2:29 AM
ArdeeBhoy

Did they? When, exactly?
:rolleyes:
29/08/2014, 3:54 AM
DannyInvincible

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Did they? When, exactly?
:rolleyes:

I think he means UEFA went by the book in awarding Celtic a 3-0 victory. It's with their own club those Legia fans should be livid. It's a visually-impressive display and all that - there's even truth in the suggestion that UEFA have a liking for money - but it's just idiotic victim-playing really. Celtic weren't awarded a 3-0 victory by UEFA because it was more profitable for UEFA to do so; it was because Legia broke a regulation for which the only punishment stipulated was the match being declared forfeit. Legia gave UEFA no choice in the matter.
29/08/2014, 6:41 AM
Acornvilla

I'd imagine, from a Leiga perspective, they're convinced that had a larger club fallen foul of this rule, a different outcome would have been seen. I find it hard not to believe at least partial truth in this possibility.
29/08/2014, 7:07 AM
pineapple stu

Yet it's nonsense, as we've seen when Stuttgart fell foul of it back in 1992.
29/08/2014, 8:25 AM
GypsyBlackCat

The standard of the league has dropped in recent years but I think we are seen an up turn. The Cypriot league is the example we should look at. They've invested into their league and clubs. But in Ireland we like to put the roof on the house before we built the foundations.
29/08/2014, 9:37 AM
colonelwest

Quote:

Originally Posted by ger121

Now Dundalk if you're going to get a fine. Make sure it's worth it!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwJf1lSIQAA2DjL.jpg:large

For some reason this one from the same game seems to not be getting the same amount of press:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwJchdXCcAAgpGY.jpg

How could anyone hate Jimi Hendrix? :(
29/08/2014, 9:39 AM
nigel-harps1954

So how did the LOI conquerors fare in their European exploits? Not awfully well, it has to be said.

Legia, after their mess in the CL qualified for the Europa Group stage last night after a 3-0 aggregate win over Aktobe of Kazakhstan.

Hajduk Split couldn't overturn a 2-1 first leg loss against Dnipro of Ukraine and drew 0-0 in Split.

Shakhtyor Soligorsk had a respectable result in The Netherlands against PSV Eindhoven with a 1-0 loss, but got beaten 2-0 at home. 3-0 aggregate score put them out.

Rosenborg were put out in Q3 by Turkish side Karabukspor on away goals after a 1-1 home draw. Karabukspor were themselves put out in the play-off round on penalties by St Etienne of France after each winning 1-0 in their home ties.

Also, the Icelandic dream came to an emphatic end after Stjarnan were beaten 9-0 on aggregate against Inter Milan.

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